objectivityofcontradiction

New England. It was supposed to be 4-6 in., now it's going to be about a foot.

We in the Northeast are in the process of getting dumped on (about 6-10 inches of snow) AGAIN. Perhaps this is why we have yet another slow day... University closings, etc.

Stop wasting our time. You have done nothing to show any member of this forum that you are legitimately interested in graduate studies in philosophy and so your seemingly genuine questions do not warrant our time. Moreover, it is obvious to me that clogging up the space of this thread is some sort of game for you, given that so so many of the questions you ask have been addressed countless times elsewhere. And your target questions, like the one here, are all questions that any serious candidate would never bother asking. The question being raised here has a very self-evident answer, namely, that, in most circumstances, top 25 departments hire from top 25 departments. Aside from exceptional cases when the candidates publishing record is excellent. Given that you 'wrote a book' maybe you should skip the PhD. and just apply for Professor gigs straight away, eh? So, I say again, stop wasting our time.

'Philosophical maturity' is a phrase used by Schwitzgebel in his blog post on applying to graduate school (I think in the discussion of writing samples)... maybe that is where the original poster found it. Either way I think philosophical maturity is actually one of those things that can be gleaned more from conversation, classroom behavior, and interviews, rather than in written work. To be philosophically mature in your writing would seem to suggest a basic cover concept for, among other things: clarity, familiarity with relevant lit, strong analytic skills, etc. I think it may also refer to a general way of carrying yourself and going about the daily business of being a young academic or grad student, for example, conferencing, have a good writing schedule, and all that jazz.

Yeah, I'm with you. And I'll admit of a bit of satisfaction knowing I at least made it through a round of cuts (if we can all last weeks rejection notifications 'round 1'), given that I've been flat out rejected from two others so far.

Ian, The IU wait-list post has been taken down from the results page, FWIW. At least I couldn't find it when I just did a quick scan. I've heard no news from IU either way yet. They seem to be one of the first who are sending out acceptances and rejections around the same time.

Obviously the Leiter post is speaking about letters of recommendation written by Senior faculty for recent PhDs or Junior faculty looking to secure employment, not for professors writing on behalf of their student's entry into a program, so I am not sure how helpful that link is. I had not seen the discussion before (but obviously know of the issue) and so was hoping to learn a thing or two from the Leiter post, but didn't find much. I think writing letters for students looking to go to grad school is a whole different ball game. Too bad it hasn't been specifically addressed at Leiter. I did, however, notice that one poster mentioned a distinction between the way UK profs write their letters and the way Americans do, namely, that in the UK, professors are on the whole much less hyperbolic. I got my MA in the UK, and all of my letters came from professors there. I wouldn't change my writers for anything, but I wonder how their letters are being perceived...

If I get shut out I think I'll return to Europe for my PhD. I am an American who took an MA from a European university, graduating with a 4.00 and First Class Honours (apparently this has not impressed my American compatriots). I grew to like several of the elements of the European academic system (esp. its emphasis on research and publishing over teaching), and perhaps I am now intuitively more comfortable with the way they do things over there. The only reason I did not apply to European schools for PhD. was because of what I had heard about it hurting your employment chances in the future, as a lot of American Unis do not fancy hiring European graduates. I think that was a stupid mistake. If I get a PhD. in Europe, I'll stay in Europe, and not bother applying for jobs here until I have built up a publishing record. Obviously, the other big hurdle to overcome is the great lack of funding for international students in Europe. But I have heard that the situation is improving in this regard. Then again, I think I have begun to despair a bit too early. I still have 8 schools to hear from, with just two rejections, and two assumed rejections out of the 10 I applied to. I'm really holding my breath for good news from either Georgetown, BU, or Columbia...

I'll make an optimistic conjecture here, in regards to ^^^^ the above post: If several rejections go out, and you are not one of them, yet you have not been informed of acceptance or wait-list, you might take it as a sign that your POI or POI(s) have been engaged in vehement arguments for your admission. This may leave you in an uncomfortable purgatory for a couple weeks, but the end results could be huge. I know people who were accepted with no prior word as late as the middle of May. Sucks to wait that long, but it is what it is. Although persistent silence could mean that you are in that pile they forgot to notify of rejection, I tend to want to believe that the deeper we get in this process, the better the chance is that you are giving the dept. something to think about.. and maybe, just maybe, you'll have some good news in your future. Again, I have taken an incredibly sober and 'realist' approach to this whole process after being rejected by a few places and honestly, it has given me a bit more hope than I had before, and it makes for much less stressful days

I took a break for a five days from this place and boy was it an excellent idea. Despite receiving one of the Notre Dame rejections today, I feel a bit refreshed, even if still quite pessimistic about my overall chances. FWIW, I was one who questioned early on why any one would think that the 'results' posters would be bluffing. That was until I spoke with an old friend who is currently enrolled in a program that at least a few on here have claimed acceptance to, who told me that he was fairly certain the committee had not even met yet. He may have gotten his facts wrong, but this did give me some cause to rethink becoming quickly negative after seeing results going up on here. That being said, I'm not surprised if Yale has sent out acceptances. I'm also in the boat of those who'd like to hear from Georgetown tomorrow (I'd take a wait-list offer from Indiana U as well if I could get one!). I am weirdly much calmer and feeling more realistic about my chances after getting away for a few days, already brain-storming ways to improve my application for next time around. I am not going to be one of those who tries and tries and tries at this. If I get shut out this year, I'll try once more, maybe next season, maybe the season after. I know what I am capable of (I did land a 4.0 MA GPA, after all, and have published in an actual journal, with real life philosophers), my instructors at my MA institution do as well. Anyways, if you're bummed about all this jazz, I really do recommend getting the hell off this site for at least a couple days, reading some philosophy without all the pressure. It can be a nice way of reassuring yourself of your love for the subject, and that you aren't going to let rejections make you think you're some how not as good as the rest, not to mention how obsessively checking the results page really dilutes the excitement that may accompany an actual acceptance, one you find out about spontaneously and not via a grad-cafe surrogate.

I would take a rejection at this point. Anything but silence, it is maddening.

I've seen acceptances go up to a few schools that were near the bottom of my list and I have not been one of them yet. These were places I applied to that I felt I fit well with, but not as well as say, my top 5, which have yet to release any results. So I suppose I have to think that fit does matter a lot, though I knew this already and mentioned it a while back on here, at which point there were several that disagreed. But it has always been obvious to me that fit, along with the makeup of the adcom, are the real difference makers.

I'll be snowed in tomorrow, from the looks of things... what a chore it is going to be to find things to do around the house that do not include checking my email every 15 minutes...

Good news for me then.

I listen to instrumental metal or doom or stoner metal or sludge (Lento, Russian Circles, Pelican, KYOTY, Year of no Light), but usually only if I am out in a cafe or some place that is naturally noisy. Sometimes post-rock. At home it's either silence or classical, mostly Mahler. When I write, nothing.

Spent the day away from the forum and results page... doesn't look like I missed much. Quiet one, eh?

I have been trying to take scheduled breaks from the internet over the past week or so and hope to do so as the process continues so I don't go mad. But I have been failing. This is me every 20 minutes: 'Well, I suppose I could check the forum... or maybe my email... maybe a committee member will send me a late night email letting me know I got in... they do that, right?' The mornings are even worse... I almost like to avoid my email to start the day in the hopeful anticipation that it'll be full of positive news. And it is still so early on... I am screwed, I need to fix my thoughts elsewhere. I am in the middle of writing a review for a phil journal... and still reading loads of philosophy... but in supremely negative moods I find myself thinking, 'why bother if I am just going to get shut out?' Oh, the trials! In reality, I think I should probably start believing that if there is no word after 8PM EST (5PM PST) I should call it a day and stay away from my email. One thing I have found to be rather enjoyable and something that takes away the stress even if it is a bit naive and optimistic, is spending some time over on the City Guide forum and just googling and perusing blogs detailing life in the various locations of the schools I have applied to. I'm a coffee snob and so have been reading cafe reviews in a lot of cities. Also checking rent prices, etc. Yes, I know this is awfully forward looking of me. Oh well. Any one else find themselves doing this?

Reality and I had a rough break up. I'd rather not talk about it. Sorry to the rest for wasting the space of this thread.

Loric, If you did read the previous post, which I doubt you did, and you still want to argue that, 'well, in the end, the 13 USC accepted were BEST,' I suppose I can see your point. But I think what Schroeder is saying is pretty simple: philosophy applications all adhere to at least a semi-universal standard of excellence when they are looked at at first glance. Which does contradict your point that some applications are just flat out bad. Given how much it costs to apply, I think most who invest are great. I don't think they are delusional because on that logic, our letter-writers would have to be delusional as well for speaking in favor of us. So you want to say, then, that professional philosophers who speak on behalf of their students don't recognize promise even after being in the discipline for numerous years... ha, okay.

From the Schroeder (professor at top of the top program) comment on Leiter that Meontic referred to. Read it Loric, and then disappear. This year at USC we had just over 130 applications. Of those, no more than five were weak enough to be "not serious candidates". For the rest, I had to spend time reading every letter carefully, reading the personal statement and comparing to the applicant's history and record, and have two colleagues do the same, before we could judge whether the total level of promise merited further review. Since we admitted 13 this year, we needed all three rounds of review just to get to the top 10% that you assume could be skimmed to with little effort. When we say that admissions are "competitive", we mean that they are competitive - i.e., not just that there are a large number of applicants, but that decisions are very difficult and there are many excellent candidates, most of whom won't get in. If I had an easy way of equipping prospective applicants with an algorithm to assess the promise of their application, I would be happy to do so, but all I can say are things like "our admissions process is incredibly competitive" and "we have to be very impressed by your letters and writing sample", which is what I tell every prospective applicant. I don't think this language is opaque or misleading, or gives prospective applicants a false sense of their chances. On the contrary, I think what it clearly means is that no matter how good you are, you might not get in.

Inform my letter-writers and some friends from my MA program.

Past: T.W. Adorno Current: Raymond Geuss

I have thought about this.. but I am not sure what is appropriate. Given that my MA supervisor and I are quite close, and more friends now than anything since I am no longer a student of his, I figured I might send him along a non-philosophy book that I think he'd dig. For another, since we live fairly close, I may visit and offer to take him out for a pint. But that is the extent of what I will do, and I am more leaning towards it not being necessary to do anything.

German Idealism and the Frankfurt School (19th - 20th Cent. German phil generally).

Why is it that there is always some one who questions the validity of the postings as they start to come up? Get over yourself. You didn't get notified by Duke yet. Big deal. Some one else did and some one has to be first. End of story.