Would you turn down an Ivy?

[lemma]

2 hours ago, powercube said:

Thank you for your comment, another perspective I had not previously considered.

No worries, I hope it wasn't overly negative. I appreciated my undergrad for the most part, but going back to a similar institutional culture and geography (I live a long way outside the US) without my partner for a long time would not have been good for me, and I wouldn't have thrived there. 

For any program, I would also try and probe into what specific factors may influence your wellbeing, especially if the program is the social, as well as academic, focus. 

There were some very specific cultural characteristics that weren't great for my wellbeing as an undergrad. I've outlined some here, and they may or may not be relevant to your program (especially as it's a graduate program, not college), but they give some insight into cultural aspects that I found problematic. Even if they're irrelevant, maybe they provide food for thought for your own questions. 

I struggled with the idea that you needed to be extremely busy to appear successful, as this wasn't conducive to my productivity or mental health. I felt there was a lot of pressure to seem like a high achiever and on top of everything to other people. Being in an environment where heavily drinking was normalized was extremely bad for me, as was being in an environment where it was normal to sleep at 3am everyday. There was a lot of implicit pressure that came from everyone around achieving amazing things, and consequently any setback made you feel like you were getting behind. If you were in a class with regular assignments, you never got a break. I also found that the friendships I had were a bit superficial (apparently a common sentiment among international students), and there was a period where I really needed support, and my friends didn't rise to the occasion. 

There were many wonderful things about my undergraduate program too. So many wonderful things. I probably have to be more careful than the average person mental health wise, which influenced my application decisions. I would definitely be interested in returning for a postdoc one day, if I'm lucky enough to be invited back! 

[TakeruK]

I also want to point out that an undergraduate's experience at a particular school may be very very different from the graduate student's experience at the same school. (In addition to all the things that change with time, advisor, department, etc.). I feel like the type of student that would excel and thrive as an undergraduate where I did my PhD would be very different from the type of student that would excel and thrive as a graduate student there. I felt like it was an excellent and nurturing place for me as a graduate student. I don't think I would have done very well as an undergrad there at all and I am very glad that my undergrad school was very different than my PhD school.

[collegesista]

On 2/11/2018 at 3:34 PM, birdy-bear said:

I think the other key piece you're missing here is that you can turn down any program, including an Ivy league program, but if you applied to this program believing it was a great fit, you owe it to yourself to make sure that your conjectures about the program are actually true. It seems like you have a lot of preconceived notions about what an Ivy league school is like, but not enough interaction with the actual people and program to base them on. As someone mentioned above, even within a single school, the culture can vary widely from program to program. Visit the program, try to check your biases at the door, and you might surprise yourself with what you find.

I agree with your comment wholeheartedly. I'm reading a lot of assumptions from the original poster, but not enough first-hand evidence. I think you're trying to make yourself feel better if you turn down an Ivy and that's perfectly fine – but go to visit day, talk to professors, and get insight from students to see how it's really like.