School Prestige for Industry

[fireuponthedeep]

So, I've been accepted to two MS programs in biostatistics, Emory and Colorado. I have 5 more I'm waiting to hear back from, hopefully get accepted to around 2-3 more of them (guessing IUPUI is a lock, then one or two of Minnesota, Wisconsin, Vanderbilt). The question I'm struggling with is how much the school/program prestige matters for jobs in industry, specifically pharmaceutical. I know school choice matters less for industry, but how much less? I would love to go to Emory, but the cost is quite prohibitive. However, I could live rent free if I went to IUPUI and the program cost is very minimal. The MS program at IUPUI is very new, and tbh not sure about the quality. It seems like most people on this forum are interested in tenured positions at top tier schools, so it's hard to gauge what the optimal school decision for industry would be based on posts found here, as the majority would not consider IUPUI, rightfully so considering their career goals. The Emory acceptance email specifically mentioned a recent MS graduate working in a job similar to the one I eventually want, senior statistician at a pharma company. Would I be better served paying more for a better school? Or is the boost provided by the better school negligible? I'll add that I eventually plan to get my PhD, but only to allow myself to advance in industry, so would getting my masters from a higher ranked school be a better decision for that long term goal as well? Thanks for any input y'all might have, hope your admissions cycle is going well!!

Tl;dr: Not sure whether it's better to get masters for cheap from worse school, or expensive better school, want to work in industry. Advice/information greatly appreciated.

[Stat Assistant Professor]

For industry, you don't necessarily need to go to an Ivy or a top school to get a good job, but if you are aiming for a nationwide job search, the people hiring need to be familiar with the institution/program. My guess is that the graduates from IUPUI will mostly be recruited from companies in the Pittsburgh area (local companies are more willing to pluck graduates from nearby regional schools that don't have as much  nationwide recognition). That's fine if you want to stay in the Pittsburgh area short-term, but your chances at getting a job in another location would most likely be better if you went to Emory. That's certainly a brand name school for big pharma.

I would inquire the Emory Biostatistics department about research assistantships and other financial aid for Masters students. Some of the top Biostatistics programs in the country do offer partial tuition remission or a small stipend for Masters students who serve as RA's (you'll likely help out on projects and do coding tasks in R/SAS).

Edited February 8, 2019 by Stat PhD Now Postdoc

[fireuponthedeep]

@Stat PhD Now Postdoc Thanks for the advice! And I guess it proves how little known it is, but IUPUI is in Indianapolis not Pittsburgh haha. I wouldn't mind being in Indianapolis, especially since Eli Lilly operates there, but I also think I would be geo-restricted to Indiana. Emory does provide financial aid, but they haven't calculated how much, if any, I'll receive, so I'm operating under the assumption of none. The biostatistics department doesn't specifically mention anything about RA's, but it seems like there's a school wide portal for finding those opportunities, so I'll look into that, and reach out to the department as well. Hopefully I can find something that eases the financial burden, as I would really like to go to Emory if the cost is manageable. Thanks again, it is really helpful to get info from someone who has experience in the field!

[Stat Assistant Professor]

My mistake. I thought you were referring to Indiana University of Pennsylvania ? ?

Either way, this program does not seem to have any kind of national reputation as of now... so whether a degree from there will help in your job search (at a national level) may be one thing to consider.

 

 

[GoPackGo89]

First of all congrats on your acceptances! Have you thought about where you'd like to live when you graduate? Do you think you'll be to start a nationwide job search or does living in one of those cities really excite you?

I never realized how much location would matter in grad school (even though everyone seems to rank it was one of the top criteria). I naively and without any evidence believe prestige will not make up for the cost and especially not cost + sacrificing location once we get into the Emory/Wisconsin/Minn zone

[fireuponthedeep]

@Stat PhD Now Postdoc haha that's not a problem! And that's a good point to consider, and something I will weigh heavily when making my decision.

@GoPack89  Thank you!!!! It felt great when I got the emory acceptance, especially since I was rejected by JHU the prior friday lol. I don't really have any geographic preferences, except for avoiding Texas/south west (Texas is too big and hot, and I don't have much desire to live in the Southwest again). I know it's a shallow reason, but honestly whatever opportunity gives me the greatest financial success + job fulfillment is the largest determinant of where I'd live. I grew up fairly poor, so financial security is pretty important to me. I've bounced around the country so I know I can live happily anywhere (Texas/southwest aside). My concerns with going to a less prestigious school, like IUPUI, would make me less employable, restrict me to only work in Indianapolis, and would make it harder to go back for my PhD, assuming I still desire to do that in 5-8 years. Plus I know plenty of people who've gone to the school for other degrees and it's.....not all that great, so I'm worried about that too lol. But free rent is pretty great!!

[Stat Assistant Professor]

If you are interested in a PhD, the reputation of your Masters institution will play a big role. There is no way around it... more reputable schools will be known for being rigorous, whereas adcoms who are not familiar with a more regional program might have more concerns about rigor. Students from regional schools also will be at a disadvantage if it comes to getting a job outside that particular region in comparison to grads from elite private schools or flagship public schools.

If money is an issue, is there any reason why you could not just bypass the Masters and apply to PhD programs in a year or two?

[fireuponthedeep]

@Stat PhD Now Postdoc Yeah, that lines up with what I've heard on here/elsewhere, but it's good to have it reaffirmed. And money is primarily an issue with only Emory, if I got into Minnesota/Wisconsin I would get in state tuition since I live in Minnesota so it would be drastically cheaper, but haven't heard back from either yet so operating with Emory as my top choice. Emory would be about 2~2.5x more expensive than either state school. Honestly I applied to my Master's without any thoughts of getting my PhD, more interested but it's too late to change that decision lol. And it's a very lukewarm interest, not sure I'd enjoy research since I've never done it. I know I want my Master's, but iffy on a PhD at this point in my life.

I say I want to get my PhD, but it's primarily so I could advance up the ladder in industry and get more leadership roles, from what I've heard PhDs dominate the top in industry, but maybe I'll enjoy not having responsibility, hard to say lol. To me it's a big commitment to go for my PhD with zero clue if I'd enjoy the final 3 years due to research focus, whereas my Master's is going to be coursework primarily and I know what that's like. I'm going to reexamine how I feel about a PhD in 5 years, see how life is and whether it makes sense to continue on for it or not. But for now it's not something I feel comfortable pursuing. I don't mind the cost of a Master's since I know it'll increase my earning potential, but I would like to make it as cheap as possible, with other factors being considered. And if I do end up wanting to get my PhD, I want my Master's choice to not torpedo my chances of going someone good lol

[theduckster]

@fireuponthedeep I'd be careful about making implications like "PhDs dominate the top of X industry" ==> "Getting a PhD will help me climb up X industry".

Lots of correlation vs. causation issues here, plus confirmation bias. Most billionaires have somewhat eccentric backgrounds, but doesn't mean we should start emulating them in that regard!

The biggest cost with PhD is opportunity cost. Those are six years where, if you had stayed in industry, you could have gained valuable experience, a fair amount of money, and moved up the corporate ladder. But if you truly love research and want a research-based position, then going for a PhD makes complete sense.

Edited February 9, 2019 by theduckster

[fireuponthedeep]

@theduckster that's a good point, just getting a PhD wouldn't necessarily boost me to the top. I'm basing it more on the job descriptions the companies put out, all the senior level stat/biostat positions list having a PhD as a prerequisite. Maybe the x years of experience + a masters would make up for that, but I honestly have no clue as I've not even entered the field yet lol. I think it's safe to assume that having a PhD would at least give me more options for advancement, based on those job descriptions. 

I have zero clue how I feel about research, went to a small liberal arts college so had minimal opportunities to do it there (wasn't really on my radar either) and where I'm currently living is pretty rural so no chances here. Figured I'd get exposure to research during my masters and figure out how I feel then, but it felt a little bold to apply for a PhD with no idea whether I'd enjoy the final 3~4 years. Didn't really consider the path of going for a PhD but only staying long enough to get my Masters and essentially getting it paid for. Feels kinda disingenuous to plan to do it that way, not sure if there's a stigma attached to it but seems iffy to me. But I'm probably thinking that way to feel better about not even considering it lol