Please advise a 31 Year Old Potential Applicant

[CarbonBasedLifeForm]

I'm 31. I received my Poli Sci B.A. at a public university (top 5 with honors for what it's worth) nine years ago. Right after undergrad I went to a top 50 law school. I've been practicing law since I graduated, but I'm interested in getting a Political Science PhD. Any advice regarding the following would be greatly appreciated. I'm less interested in getting into an uber-elite program than I am with not accumulating a huge amount of debt.

• Does anyone recommend any books about applying to Political Science PhD programs?
• Is it a disadvantage to be an older applicant?
• I went to a huge school nine years ago. How the heck would I get letters of recommendations? Do they have to be from professors?
• How relevant would a law degree and GPA be to schools? (I don't consider it very relevant.)

[anxiousapplicant]

I'm not sure of anything, but I do know that you're going to have to make a good case for why you are switching careers and why you need a Ph.D, and you'll need to demonstrate that you know what's going on currently in the field of political science and the research that is being conducted.

[Penelope Higgins]

31 is not old enough to pose a disadvantage. In some programs, that will fall firmly in the middle of the age distribution of first year students. The law degree (with GPA and LSAT scores) won't help you a huge amount, but it is far from a detriment to your application. Have you thought about getting letters from law school profs?

[Goosefoot]

I'm 31. I received my Poli Sci B.A. at a public university (top 5 with honors for what it's worth) nine years ago. Right after undergrad I went to a top 50 law school. I've been practicing law since I graduated, but I'm interested in getting a Political Science PhD. Any advice regarding the following would be greatly appreciated. I'm less interested in getting into an uber-elite program than I am with not accumulating a huge amount of debt.

• Does anyone recommend any books about applying to Political Science PhD programs?
• Is it a disadvantage to be an older applicant?
• I went to a huge school nine years ago. How the heck would I get letters of recommendations? Do they have to be from professors?
• How relevant would a law degree and GPA be to schools? (I don't consider it very relevant.)

The first question I have and an adcom will have is WHY are you applying, and WHAT do you want to do with this degree?

I was your age when I applied (and was accepted at a top 5) and I think it is an asset. In no way is it a disadvantage on its own. Admissions committees will look positively at your JD and undergrad GPA but anxiousapplicant is right, you need to make a strong case that you understand what you are getting into in a political science program, where research is king. Do you understand what a research proposal looks like? This is what your statement of interest should look like - it should not be about your feelings, or why you are so excited by "politics", or why being a lawyer sucks, and most definitely not about why you want to make the world a better place. It should how them that you are capable of carrying out original research that will contribute to the field. So, it would help to know what exactly you want to study.

#1 - Read this: http://www2.smumn.edu/deptpages/~tcwritingcenter/Forms_of_Writing/ResearchProposal.htm

#2 - Read APSR and some of the top journals in your subfield (whatever that is) so you know what is current in the discipline

Your letters MUST be from professors. No one in academia cares at all what your professional colleagues have to say about you, no matter how great you are or how good they are in the field. Not following this advice could seriously hurt you. You are going to have to suck it up and get back in touch with them. Send them a cordial email, remind them of your grade and whatever papers you wrote for them (attach them if you have them), explain what you have been doing and WHY you want this PhD. This is the information they need to write a basic letter. Did you have an honors advisor or a positive relationship with anyone? If so, you should call this person and explain the situation.

I can't think of a specific book about applying to poli sci PhD programs but "Getting What You Came For" by Robert Peters is an excellent guide to applying to grad school and actually getting the degree.

Good luck! I feel sympathetic since I was in your shoes.

[carrar]

I'm 31. I received my Poli Sci B.A. at a public university (top 5 with honors for what it's worth) nine years ago. Right after undergrad I went to a top 50 law school. I've been practicing law since I graduated, but I'm interested in getting a Political Science PhD. Any advice regarding the following would be greatly appreciated. I'm less interested in getting into an uber-elite program than I am with not accumulating a huge amount of debt.

• Does anyone recommend any books about applying to Political Science PhD programs?
• Is it a disadvantage to be an older applicant?
• I went to a huge school nine years ago. How the heck would I get letters of recommendations? Do they have to be from professors?
• How relevant would a law degree and GPA be to schools? (I don't consider it very relevant.)

The above advice is good, so I'll just share my recent experience. I'm 30, and I was accepted to three good (and good fit) schools, but none were elite (top 50-ish). I did get full funding at all. The most important thing is to articulate in your SOP why you want to get your PhD. I briefly mentioned my previous career and what skills would add to my success in grad school, but it was a minor part. I just got back from a school visit, and the department was VERY encouraging to me. One professor explained that they liked my application because I was very clear about what I wanted to study, stemming in no small part, I believe, from the fact that I had not been in school for a while and had time to think about why I wanted to give up decent pay and go back to school. Another professor mentioned that I was right to see a PhD program as somewhat of a career training program rather than an end in itself.

As far as recommendation letters, I emailed the professors, asked if they would STRONGLY recommend me, and offered to send them my transcripts from their school, a paper from their class, my CV, a draft of my SOP, and any other materials they would need.

While I wish that I would have been able to start my PhD a few years ago, there are positive aspects to being slightly older. A big one: barring unforeseen circumstances, I plan on finishing as soon as possible rather than extending my TA-ship for 7, 8, 9 years because I know what real(ish) money is.

I'm really happy with my results this year, and my campus visit was also a good ego boost. PM me if you'd like more info. Best of luck!

[curufinwe]

RUN!!!

[GopherGrad]

I am a (slightly) younger JD applying this coming season, as well.

I think the emphasis on explaining your departure from legal practice is overblown.

For starters, I spoke about this potential issue in my application with adcomm members at several schools in several different academic disciplines. No one placed much value on a linear path and all recognized that successful people with diverse experiences will tend to continue thier success. In fact, some amount of diversity is obviously valued in the classroom.

Second, it's not as though most people don't realize that law is a boring, sucky slog for lots of top grads. Grad schools do worry about attrition, but completing your JD and working for five or six years actually proves you DO have the fortitude to slug it out. Smart people change careers all the damn time.

That said, if you have something of a through-line, play it up a little. My JD coursework and a note I published focused on corruption and developing legal institutions and I interned for Dept. State between 1 and 2L years.

You may also want to look at the courses you've taken and ask if there are any obvious deficiencies that a traditional polisci kid wouldn't have. I took Econ this spring and will take a methodology course this summer to shore up my knowledge and assure the committees that I can hit the ground running.

The bottom line is the same for you as for anyone. Solid grades and GREs are required; some outstanding extra-cirriculars or career success can be a little bonus. The key to distinguishing yourself is having great letters and an SoP that clearly delineates a research interest that fits well with your school.

A final note if you plan to hang out on these sites. A lot of people that post here are wicked smart, but basically none are on adcomms. Take all our advice with a huge grain of salt, but particularly aggressive, gunner-ish, world-on-string stuff. Remember how you felt as 23 year old starting your JD with all that grit and determination and certainty about what practicing law would be? A lot of people that frequent these boards are in the same boat. Selling a career change or the value of work success to them will be harder than to a middle age prof.

Edited April 29, 2010 by GopherGrad

[Penelope Higgins]

A final note if you plan to hang out on these sites. A lot of people that post here are wicked smart, but basically none are on adcomms. Take all our advice with a huge grain of salt, but particularly aggressive, gunner-ish, world-on-string stuff. Remember how you felt as 23 year old starting your JD with all that grit and determination and certainty about what practicing law would be? A lot of people that frequent these boards are in the same boat. Selling a career change or the value of work success to them will be harder than to a middle age prof.

Everything you said is right one except this: some of us are on admissions committees. But I'm hoping to avoid doing it again any time soon!

[GopherGrad]

Thanks for confirming some of my understanding; I knew there were a couple of you guys kicking around with us.

If I recall, your insight has been valuable to me and many others. Thanks. I think most of us understand that it's difficult for adcomm members to identify (much less articulate) patterns in what makes applicants stand out. What you can give, though, helps us become competetive and, I should think, increases the quality of applicants pools and the clarity of our applications.

[mrmirv]

Thanks for confirming some of my understanding; I knew there were a couple of you guys kicking around with us.

If I recall, your insight has been valuable to me and many others. Thanks. I think most of us understand that it's difficult for adcomm members to identify (much less articulate) patterns in what makes applicants stand out. What you can give, though, helps us become competetive and, I should think, increases the quality of applicants pools and the clarity of our applications.

It feels good to see someone also applying. I am 31 myself. I have always wanted to go for a PhD in IR. I did not have the financial resources sadly as I became indepedent of my parents very young. I feel much better about my chances.