How will my GPA be evaluated?

[Arcadian]

Hello everyone, I'm new here. Just to be clear, I am applying during the Fall 2010 season, but I'm applying to attend in the Fall 2011 season. I wasn't sure what to put for "application season." I will be applying to several PhD cognitive/neuro programs and a few MS experimental programs.

My GPA situation is a little complex. After my first two years, I changed my major from engineering to psychology, and as a result of this I had to change schools as well (from UT Austin to UTSA). In spite of my rough start, I really struck gold with psychology. I love it, and now I want to pursue a career in basic research. Here is the quick summary of my various GPAs.

Overall: 3.0

UT Austin: 2.6

UTSA: 4.0

Psychology: 4.0

At the moment I have a lot more hours at UT, but in the end they should be close to equal. I have 30 hours in psychology. Honestly, I expect to finish with a 4.0 in psychology. How should I expect these grades to be evaluated? From what I understand, many programs emphasize your major GPA and upper-division GPA. Will the bad grades from my engineering background be viewed as a strike against me, or will it be viewed more admirably for versatility?

Also, I will be gaining my first research experience this fall when I will work in a professor's cognitive aging lab. Obviously, I couldn't have possibly done any research until now because of the change of major. I won't have the chance to write any research papers. The professor said I will simply be assisting with experiments and discussions. Is this sufficient preparation for a PhD program?

I have a preliminary list of programs that interest me. The list is long. It ranges from Harvard to UT Dallas. Should I bother applying to highly prestigious schools?

[socialpsych]

Will the bad grades from my engineering background be viewed as a strike against me, or will it be viewed more admirably for versatility?

I do not think they will be viewed favorably, but they might not hurt you since they are lower-division and in a different field. Still, you will have to work to remind people that your psych GPA is good.

Maybe it's just me, but isn't 30 psych hours an extremely light psych major? More like a minor, in fact? Can anyone else comment?

Also, I will be gaining my first research experience this fall when I will work in a professor's cognitive aging lab. Obviously, I couldn't have possibly done any research until now because of the change of major. I won't have the chance to write any research papers. The professor said I will simply be assisting with experiments and discussions. Is this sufficient preparation for a PhD program?

It certainly isn't optimal, but it might be enough to get you in to some places. To speak to your question about highly prestigious schools, honestly I think you do not have a great chance at those, given your overall GPA and lack of psych coursework (if I read that correctly) and especially your lack of research experience. There are so many applicants now who have spent two years doing research full-time that I think it will be difficult for you to have a shot at the top programs.

To make the best of your RA assignment, be extremely responsible and enthusiastic, and as independent as possible. Contribute whatever you can to experimental design and other discussions. Make sure the supervising professor knows you well.

Just my two cents. Best of luck!

[Arcadian]

Maybe it's just me, but isn't 30 psych hours an extremely light psych major? More like a minor, in fact? Can anyone else comment?

Remember, I'm not done yet. I still have two semesters left full of psychology classes. The degree requires 39 hours in the major, and I'll surpass that requirement after this fall. (BTW, the psych minor is 18 hours at my school.)

It certainly isn't optimal, but it might be enough to get you in to some places. To speak to your question about highly prestigious schools, honestly I think you do not have a great chance at those, given your overall GPA and lack of psych coursework (if I read that correctly) and especially your lack of research experience. There are so many applicants now who have spent two years doing research full-time that I think it will be difficult for you to have a shot at the top programs.

Alright, so let's say I do an MS in experimental psychology and get more research experience. Then would I have a chance at getting into a prestigious program? I think the MS is a good option for someone like me who changed majors halfway through but wants to do research. At the same time, I know very precisely the kind of research I want to do, so I think I would be a very good fit for many of the PhD programs on my list. Even though I haven't done any research yet, I've done a lot of reading (not just text books, but research articles). Is that worth anything?

Edited June 15, 2010 by Arcadian

[socialpsych]

Alright, so let's say I do an MS in experimental psychology and get more research experience. Then would I have a chance at getting into a prestigious program? I think the MS is a good option for someone like me who changed majors halfway through but wants to do research. At the same time, I know very precisely the kind of research I want to do, so I think I would be a very good fit for many of the PhD programs on my list. Even though I haven't done any research yet, I've done a lot of reading (not just text books, but research articles). Is that worth anything?

1) The reading you've done and your cool research interests will absolutely help you -- once you get an interview. They might also help you get an interview in the first place, via your great research statement, but mostly I think they would help you get offers if programs are already interested in how you look on paper.

2) Maybe someone in cog/neuro knows otherwise -- I really mostly know about social psych admissions, so take this with a grain of salt -- but I think a lab manager position might be better for you than an MS, assuming you are sure you want to do the PhD. Either of those would DEFINITELY help you out, but I think being a lab manager would look like more research experience than an MS since you would not also be doing coursework, and having a close relationship with a faculty mentor could result in an awesome letter. Since you already know exactly what research you want to do, why not try to work with someone who does that type of research, instead of taking a general psych curriculum? Of course, the downside is that you don't get a master's degree at the end...which doesn't matter for PhD programs (most of which will not excuse you from required coursework for having a Master's) but which could matter if you end up deciding to leave academia.

[Arcadian]

I think a lab manager position might be better for you than an MS, assuming you are sure you want to do the PhD. Either of those would DEFINITELY help you out, but I think being a lab manager would look like more research experience than an MS since you would not also be doing coursework, and having a close relationship with a faculty mentor could result in an awesome letter. Since you already know exactly what research you want to do, why not try to work with someone who does that type of research, instead of taking a general psych curriculum? Of course, the downside is that you don't get a master's degree at the end...which doesn't matter for PhD programs (most of which will not excuse you from required coursework for having a Master's) but which could matter if you end up deciding to leave academia.

Honestly, I had never considered that option, mainly because I have never heard of anyone doing this. How would one go about acquiring a position as a lab manager with just a BA in psychology? Also, I don't know of any labs where I live that do cognitive or neuroscientific research outside UTSA...and the only way to participate in those is to be a student.

[neuropsych76]

Honestly, I had never considered that option, mainly because I have never heard of anyone doing this. How would one go about acquiring a position as a lab manager with just a BA in psychology? Also, I don't know of any labs where I live that do cognitive or neuroscientific research outside UTSA...and the only way to participate in those is to be a student.

I'm just an applicant too (as you know by my other post) but I think either an MS or lab position could be a good fit before the PhD. If you don't get into any MS or PhD programs this time you can work in a research lab with a BA. Though in my experiences I think it may be harder to become a manager of a lab with just a BA. However, you may be able to work in a good lab as a paid research assistant in your field of interest. Like the other poster said, you would get great research experience. I'm just not sure if you can become manager with a BA but that might not make much of a difference if you get great experience as an RA.

[socialpsych]

I'm just an applicant too (as you know by my other post) but I think either an MS or lab position could be a good fit before the PhD. If you don't get into any MS or PhD programs this time you can work in a research lab with a BA. Though in my experiences I think it may be harder to become a manager of a lab with just a BA. However, you may be able to work in a good lab as a paid research assistant in your field of interest. Like the other poster said, you would get great research experience. I'm just not sure if you can become manager with a BA but that might not make much of a difference if you get great experience as an RA.

Maybe things are different in neuro, but in personality/social lab managers are almost always college graduates hoping to go to grad school...I only know of one who actually has a master's degree.

[neuropsych76]

Maybe things are different in neuro, but in personality/social lab managers are almost always college graduates hoping to go to grad school...I only know of one who actually has a master's degree.

That's just my experience.

I know one lab where they wanted the lab manager to have a MS. But it was a major neuroimaging lab in the region. I'm not sure if that's an exception or the rule. It probably varies

[Arcadian]

Alright, thanks for the suggestions. How does one go about acquiring a position as a lab assistant or manager? I wasn't even aware that you could do such a thing as a non-student.

[neuropsych76]

Alright, thanks for the suggestions. How does one go about acquiring a position as a lab assistant or manager? I wasn't even aware that you could do such a thing as a non-student.

My understanding is that you can contact professors at your school (if its big enough) or others you are interested to see if they have any positions. Or you can try simply searching for a research job at a hospital or research institutions. I know the local hospital where I live has several research positions listed on their website for people with a BA among other jobs.

[socialpsych]

Also, I don't know whether it is possible to do this if you're not currently a student, but see whether you can get yourself subscribed to any professional society mailing lists. The Society for Personality and Social Psych list always sends out tons of announcements about lab openings. There must be an analogue in your field.

[Arcadian]

Also, I don't know whether it is possible to do this if you're not currently a student, but see whether you can get yourself subscribed to any professional society mailing lists. The Society for Personality and Social Psych list always sends out tons of announcements about lab openings. There must be an analogue in your field.

So there is.

Cognitive Neuroscience Society

Even without becoming a paying member, I was able to view last month's newsletter which has a listing of RA positions. The requirement is usually a bachelor's degree. I'm glad I found this, thanks for the advice.