Accepted into nonfunded clinical program. Should I turn it down?

[Wotan]

Howdy all (long time lurker, finally posting).

After applying to 10 schools, I was interviewed and accepted into only one clinical psych PhD program. My dilemma is that it is 1) unfunded and 2) I'd probably graduate with a quarter million dollars in debt 5-6 years from now 3) I'm questionable about some facets of the quality of education.

I like the faculty, the interview was fantastic, and the research prospects are definitely interesting. Hell, even the idea of moving (west coast school) is a strong positive consideration. After discussing with my advisor, she strongly suggested I decline it if I don't get funding through a scholarship or fellowship. She explained to me that I am a strong applicant, and that if I apply again next year after possibly publishing some manuscripts I'm working on and boosting my GRE, I should have a better array of options. I'd have to take out a GradPlus etc. My credit is not so good (recently fallen into collections with my bank - was out of a job for awhile). Not even sure I could borrow the money (no cosign available)

What terrifies me is that if I turn this down, there won't be a future offers next year. I've seen the rejection letters I have received, where record numbers of applicants have applied for a scant number of spots. I don't see things getting "better" for me next year. I could possibly improve my GRE scores, but I'm not optimistic about this (I had more time when I studied over the summer, now that I'm working and trying to volunteer I don't see it happening). Publications are always variable, so I'm on the fence with them.

My CV in a nutshell:

GPA: Summa cum laude (honors thesis completed), BA

GRE: mediocre (1k)

Volunteer work:

Crisis Center (1+ years, I train new staff, received award for service, related with concentration of study)

2 years in mid tier university as RA (becoming more coordinator like position)

2-3 manuscripts pending publication

1 international poster presentation

1 university poster presentation

1 year top tier university as RA

1 national poster presentation pending

work with known researcher in my specialty

Currently employed with two clinical / behavioral positions (private).

I think many of you can appreciate the anxiety I'm going through regarding this. Honestly, I don't think I'm any better applicant than most. Since any change would be so negligible, I think, I don't see my status really improving.

Advice?

[neuropsych76]

Howdy all (long time lurker, finally posting).

After applying to 10 schools, I was interviewed and accepted into only one clinical psych PhD program. My dilemma is that it is 1) unfunded and 2) I'd probably graduate with a quarter million dollars in debt 5-6 years from now 3) I'm questionable about some facets of the quality of education.

I like the faculty, the interview was fantastic, and the research prospects are definitely interesting. Hell, even the idea of moving (west coast school) is a strong positive consideration. After discussing with my advisor, she strongly suggested I decline it if I don't get funding through a scholarship or fellowship. She explained to me that I am a strong applicant, and that if I apply again next year after possibly publishing some manuscripts I'm working on and boosting my GRE, I should have a better array of options. I'd have to take out a GradPlus etc. My credit is not so good (recently fallen into collections with my bank - was out of a job for awhile). Not even sure I could borrow the money (no cosign available)

What terrifies me is that if I turn this down, there won't be a future offers next year. I've seen the rejection letters I have received, where record numbers of applicants have applied for a scant number of spots. I don't see things getting "better" for me next year. I could possibly improve my GRE scores, but I'm not optimistic about this (I had more time when I studied over the summer, now that I'm working and trying to volunteer I don't see it happening). Publications are always variable, so I'm on the fence with them.

My CV in a nutshell:

GPA: Summa cum laude (honors thesis completed), BA

GRE: mediocre (1k)

Volunteer work:

Crisis Center (1+ years, I train new staff, received award for service, related with concentration of study)

2 years in mid tier university as RA (becoming more coordinator like position)

2-3 manuscripts pending publication

1 international poster presentation

1 university poster presentation

1 year top tier university as RA

1 national poster presentation pending

work with known researcher in my specialty

Currently employed with two clinical / behavioral positions (private).

I think many of you can appreciate the anxiety I'm going through regarding this. Honestly, I don't think I'm any better applicant than most. Since any change would be so negligible, I think, I don't see my status really improving.

Advice?

HI, I seriously considered clinical psych for awhile and I know how competitive it is. It is EXTREMELY competitive. Your stats are great (assuming your GRE is 1200+) but there are lots that look just like you applying to those programs.

My advice: DO NOT attend an unfunded clinical phd program. you will be in an awful position down the line. clinical psychologists nearly as much as MD's so 250k in debt is a big deal when you'll start off making hopefully 25-30k at a post doc and then 50k your first job. If you really only want to do clinical work, I'd suggest a masters because it just makes more sense financially. clinical psych is in a tough spot right now and the worst thing you can do is go into it with tons of debt

[neuropsych76]

HI, I seriously considered clinical psych for awhile and I know how competitive it is. It is EXTREMELY competitive. Your stats are great (assuming your GRE is 1200+) but there are lots that look just like you applying to those programs.

My advice: DO NOT attend an unfunded clinical phd program. you will be in an awful position down the line. clinical psychologists nearly as much as MD's so 250k in debt is a big deal when you'll start off making hopefully 25-30k at a post doc and then 50k your first job. If you really only want to do clinical work, I'd suggest a masters because it just makes more sense financially. clinical psych is in a tough spot right now and the worst thing you can do is go into it with tons of debt

oops, i meant clinical psychologists DO NOT make nearly enough as much as MD's

[jynx]

I would definitely turn it down if I were you. It's just not worth it to saddle yourself with that kind of debt. You have a lot of good experience (quite a bit more than me, actually, and I applied to clinical programs as well), so you stand a good chance of getting into a good program if you try again. Ask your advisor about how you can strengthen your application - it sounds like you already have great credentials, but she might have some insight into how you can improve your chances in the future. Maybe you can retake the GRE and up your scores a bit? DId you have a great research fit with all the programs you applied to? Applying to only 10 programs is also a little on the risky side; I applied to 14 myself, and I've heard 15-20 is a good range to aim for. Although you seem to be a really strong applicant, there are probably a couple of weak spots that you can address and then apply again. Don't give up, it sounds to me like you have a lot of potential.

[nessa]

I think your advisor is right- once your papers are actually published, and if you can get the GRE up in any way possible, you would be more competitive. You said some of the academics are questionable- what do you mean by that? If you're getting a bad feeling about that already, that's a red flag.

[arkel]

I used to really want to be a clinical psychologist, and the advice I always heard from my mentor in that field was that nobody should ever have to pay for a PhD in clinical psychology.

I tend to agree with her...Unlike some professional degrees (medicine, law), you are not guaranteed a well-paying job when you are finished.

It's also important to consider how the stress of having so much debt would affect your work. I know that if it was me, I would feel incredibly overwhelmed, and it would undoubtedly have a negative impact on my performance in grad school.

It sounds like you have so much going for you in terms of academics and research experience! I'm not on any admissions committees, but it sounds like you would be a competitive applicant if you applied again next year (even in the incredibly competitive world that is clinical psych)!

[Wotan]

First off, thanks for the kind words. I've been feeling really confused and down about this the past week. My mantra this entire process was, "just one is all I need!" now that I have it and seriously consider the financial aspects, I realize it's more complex than I made it out to be.

The sad thing about this is that I *really* like the research going on there, and I'm afraid I wouldn't find that elsewhere.

When I applied I felt like I had a good fit for all but maybe 2 Programs. I suppose maybe not good enough a fit

I'm skeptical about the education in the sense that they offer a quarter long class on projective testing (I have strong feelings against its place in Psychology) as well as about half of the faculty report they are psychodynamic in orientation. Without going into a protracted discussion about this, we could say ny feeling about that mirror my feelings concerning projective testing

I've inquired about the financial award letter, so hopefully they provide something. I'd hate to delay a year (I'm itching to get moving ahead) but it may be the best option.

I'll keep you all posted.