Do You Feel You Deserve a Reason for Rejection?

[DefinitelyMaybe]

As I sit here waiting for these rejections or acceptances to come in the mail, I've been thinking.

Is it considered inappropriate to ask a school you were rejected from why you were rejected? Has anyone ever attempted to do this? If so, were you successful?

The way I see it, these AdComs are not looking over my applications for free or as a charity case. All of us have paid pretty hefty application fees, which is hard to do during this recession. If I paid $75 or $100 for you to review my application, then if I'm rejected, I think an explanation for said rejection is the LEAST these schools could do.

I haven't been rejected yet, knock on wood, but this got me to thinking.

Any thoughts?

[deianira]

I actually emailed UCSF asking for a reason or reviewer's comments after I got my rejection. No response, of course. So yes, I agree the process could be a lot more transparent. On the other hand, these are such important life-and-careere-changing decisions, that I can see how admissions committees would want to stay as anonymous as possible.

[socialpsych]

If you look at the applyingtograd community on LJ, there have been a few posts about this. The bottom line is that some people have done it, and the response seems to depend on how the department is feeling. You could get no response or a frosty response, but you could also get something constructive.

[belowthree]

I don't really feel like it's important schools tell me or that I deserve reasons. Then again, I already know what the largest downside to my admissions file is, so maybe it's understandable that I don't feel the need to know as much.

That said, if a program where to reject me for a reason *other* than my GPA I'd be very curious what it was, though I certainly don't think they owe me an explanation.

Also I think if they were to actually hand out explanations it would just cause people to complain more. Can you really blame them for not telling you anything? Even if you personally wouldn't, many of your peers would. It'd be a nightmare.

[Dinali]

Absolutely I do. The $120 I paid buys me a reason at the very least. Not giving reasons just contributes to the shroud of mystery surrounding this medieval process. Not giving a reason just keeps me from improving my apps for next year, and the only purpose for that would be if they really want to keep me out of the field entirely. If I'm not a good fit there, let me know; I'll be more careful about next year's locations. No funding? I'll search more strenuously for external funding next year. GRE too low? I'll take a class and do it again. But no explanation? I'll just be making the same mistakes next year. How does that benefit anyone involved?

[DefinitelyMaybe]

Dinali, I completely agree with your post.

Belowthree, I do see your point, though, about how giving out reasons can basically be an invitation for a student to argue with you. Plus, if a student felt your reason was b.s., they could make a big stink about it and possibly even pursue legal action (which I'm sure some folks are crazy enough to do ).

[Tinyboss]

It would be nice to get constructive feedback with every rejection. But realistically, the admission committees are incredibly busy, and writing an essay for every rejected application would take an unreasonable amount of their time. What would be reasonable would be to indicate how far the application got before being weeded out. That wouldn't take any additional time, and would provide some useful feedback to unsuccessful applicants.

[DefinitelyMaybe]

It would be nice to get constructive feedback with every rejection. But realistically, the admission committees are incredibly busy, and writing an essay for every rejected application would take an unreasonable amount of their time. What would be reasonable would be to indicate how far the application got before being weeded out. That wouldn't take any additional time, and would provide some useful feedback to unsuccessful applicants.

I wouldn't necessarily expect a formal letter. I was thinking that for $75, I should be able to call someone and speak to them or get a quick e-mail.

I like your idea about getting feedback on how and when an application was weeded out, though.

[Abiogenic Gas]

I'm fairly certain I know the reason for my rejections, but I'd like to get some feedback on how I can make up for it on future applications (if possible).

[dragynally]

This sounds odd but I don't like information that doesn't allow me to change my situation. Like when teacher's put comments on how to improve a paper that you can't rewrite. Some would argue that you could take that info to the new paper...or the info about why you got rejected to the new app. The problem is each paper and app is completely different and new. For example if you don't get in b/c of you writing sample do you turn in a different writing sample or try to make the old one better? I hope this makes sense. :?:

[Tonights]

Well, I don't necessarily feel like I deserve one, but I sure would like one. Not that I'm so desperate to hear my own failings, but hearing "there's no funding" or "there's no professor match" would be way better than my imagination telling me that the committee roundly mocked me and read my statement out loud to laugh at! :shock: Plus, I'd like to hear what the problems were so I'd know if it was worth it for me to try again, or if it was something I'd never be able to change about myself.

[GirlattheHelm]

I feel no need for a reason for rejection. And I won't put a reason here for not needing a reason.

[Jakrabite]

I think it would just make me feel more worthless knowing why I got the boot. I'd rather follow the obamaesque blind faith approach and keep shootin in the dark.

[dherres]

Personally, I think that if you plan on reapplying the following year then it's a great idea to ask for feedback. I just emailed the coordinator of my top choice program if she would be willing to identify strengths and weaknesses of my application for me so I could possibly improve my credentials, i.e. if I needed more work experience, better GRE scores, etc. (I also made sure to say "thank you for the admission to the MA program" and that it's a strong possibility for me, so as to not appear confrontational.)

[miratrix]

There's nothing glaringly wrong with my application, so I think the reason would have to be along the lines of "not a great fit," "not taking people in your subfield this year," "well...your application wasn't bad, it just wasn't among the best," or "we really, really liked some other people and didn't like you that much." Hearing that the response to my application was a general lack of interest would not be terribly helpful. There are just a lot of applicants for not very many spots, there may not be clear and helpful reasons that are memorable to the committees for every rejection.

[Emma2003]

There's nothing glaringly wrong with my application, so I think the reason would have to be along the lines of "not a great fit," "not taking people in your subfield this year," "well...your application wasn't bad, it just wasn't among the best," or "we really, really liked some other people and didn't like you that much." Hearing that the response to my application was a general lack of interest would not be terribly helpful. There are just a lot of applicants for not very many spots, there may not be clear and helpful reasons that are memorable to the committees for every rejection.

I agree.

[HisRoyalHighness]

The Fletcher School at Tufts offers those it rejects a reason for the rejection.

[MDLee]

As I sit here waiting for these rejections or acceptances to come in the mail, I've been thinking.

Is it considered inappropriate to ask a school you were rejected from why you were rejected? Has anyone ever attempted to do this? If so, were you successful?

The way I see it, these AdComs are not looking over my applications for free or as a charity case. All of us have paid pretty hefty application fees, which is hard to do during this recession. If I paid $75 or $100 for you to review my application, then if I'm rejected, I think an explanation for said rejection is the LEAST these schools could do.

I haven't been rejected yet, knock on wood, but this got me to thinking.

Any thoughts?

One of my committee members actually suggested that this was a GOOD thing to do. Especially if you end up doing a second round...then you can apply again and fix their issues.

[slowbro]

The Fletcher School at Tufts offers those it rejects a reason for the rejection.

My current program offers a reason to rejected applicants who ask, and will encourage them to apply again -- a practice I think more schools ought to adopt, if only because people tend to think more highly of programs that reject them respectfully. It's even part of the program's admissions policy, although I don't think applicants have any way to see the policy.

[dragynally]

We're assuming that the schools have a small enough amount of applicants that they can even remember who applied let alone why they didn't take them. We're also assuming that the reason is something useful. Some schools have GPA GRE cutoffs. Art schools are WAY subjective. So I guess if the school you applied to had a small number of apps then I guess they can help you out. Otherwise you're just another app in the stack. :roll:

[HisRoyalHighness]

My current program offers a reason to rejected applicants who ask, and will encourage them to apply again -- a practice I think more schools ought to adopt, if only because people tend to think more highly of programs that reject them respectfully. It's even part of the program's admissions policy, although I don't think applicants have any way to see the policy.

I agree - it seems respectful and kind. Fletcher puts it that way and actually encourages people to reapply after meeting the concerns of the Admissions Committee. I wish more schools would adopt that policy.

[aria880]

I applied to two schools last year and was rejected by both, which came as a surprise both to me (obviously...who applies in the expectation that they're going to get rejected?) and to my faculty advisors in my MA program. On their advice, I contacted both programs to inquire about what I might do to strengthen my application for the future. I received a fairly prompt reply from rejection issuer #1. The DGS responded that they'd had 400 people apply and were looking to fill only ten spots, and that if my stats were good (which they were) I was likely rejected because they believed there wasn't a satisfactory faculty match for me. Obviously, there was nothing concrete there to help me fine-tune my application beyond the implication that I might not be an ideal fit. Foolishly I applied again this year and had an identical result. I never heard a peep from rejection issuer #2, so I was essentially relegated to speculating on why I was rejected and settling on a thing or two to polish up in my application (I switched out my writing sample and wrote what I think was a much stronger SOP), though I am confident that fit was not the issue at this school. Still no verdict on this year's application from that program, though I'm rapidly losing hope thanks to some nasty rumors.

[ridgey]

I'm uncomfortable with the term "deserve" in the question (I lurk on the Chronicle forum and a common theme is a sense of entitlement in students) but I really would WANT to know why.

The reality is that when there are so many more applicants than spaces, it may very well be that the schools can't give a reason. In any applicant pool, only some can be the best. A school can't know in advance what standard that best will be in any given year. If they said I need to do X, that's all very well, but how do they know that next year I won't be compering against the inventor of X.

But, having said that, I don't think it can hurt to ask. Be prepared, though, for a lot of vague answers.

[feisty]

Honestly I feel like in a number of cases there isn't a good reason. I'm sure a lot of people have some glaring flaw, but for many of us I think a rejection is the result of minutiae that, when articulated, are just a number of factors just out of our control that ultimately come down to not being a "good fit".

[brosenth1984]

I think it depends on the program. While we do pay hefty application fees, if we are clearly not good candidates for the program, I think it is a lot to ask faculty to spend more time with our applications to decipher exactly what makes us a bad candidate. Maybe I am less sensitive about rejection, being an artist and all, but for us it could be a number of factors that are very personal and relate to meshing with the group dynamic. I have friends for example from the same undergraduate graduating class that are applying to the same schools, and they can't let everyone in, only one (for diversity's sake). But don't expect them to admit that...

For programs that are score-based, i think it is somewhat rational to ask, and i think they should tell you about any bad recommendations you may have (not the names or anything). For all you know you have a professor you think likes you, but has a vendetta against you.