Masters GPA vs. Bachelor's GPA. How does it work when applying for PhD?

[soc1]

Hello,

Just wondering. I have a strong Graduate GPA but a low BA GPA, and I would like to apply for PhD.

What are your thoughts on what they do with an applicant's GPA from an MA program? Do they average it out? Thanks for your feedback!

[didion10]

I would like to know this as well. Hope someone can help.

[NotMyParty]

With the caveat that I have never served on an admissions committee, here are my thoughts:

1- An upward trajectory in grades is always looked at as a good thing (This is usually discussed in the context of Fr-Sr years in college). So, be thankful you aren't coming into the application process with your grades the other way 'round.

2- Any sustained pattern of low grades, unless they are in the very distant past and remediated by a more recent record, will be cause for concern.

If the low grades are relatively isolated (one particular semester, year, or difficult subject), this will be less concerning than if you consistently performed poorly on all fronts.

3- Perhaps most importantly: All grades are not created equal.

Some schools are more notorious for grade inflation than others. This is where the reputation of your BA & MA institution will come into play. If your schools are less well-known, you'll want to make sure that your application contains some external verification of quality. (High GRE's can help you some, but what you really want are LOR writers who know you well and can stand behind your abilities and achievements). Incidentally, some MA programs are notorious for rampant grade inflation. PhD adcomms know this. Good grades from an easy program will only help you if you have a stellar LOR.

4- My guess is that the admissions bar is set higher for those with an MA record, but grades are only part of the picture. MA students will be expected to have a more clearly demonstrated potential for research and scholarship in the field, whereas BA students will be competitive with more rudimentary types of research experience (As an RA on someone else's project, or a senior thesis).

5- Keep in mind that grades are merely a one-dimensional signal of knowledge and ability. As you advance in your academic career (which includes work at the MA level), you will be increasingly evaluated on your research potential, publications, and contributions to your chosen discipline.

[heathenist]

4- My guess is that the admissions bar is set higher for those with an MA record, but grades are only part of the picture. MA students will be expected to have a more clearly demonstrated potential for research and scholarship in the field, whereas BA students will be competitive with more rudimentary types of research experience (As an RA on someone else's project, or a senior thesis).

This is what I've been assuming as well, particularly because the grading system is so much different at the graduate level, where a B really isn't comparable to a B in undergrad, and a C is essentially an F.

[Lilac13]

I am applying to PhD programs in Education Policy and have a similar issue (lower undergraduate GPA and great graduate GPA). I don't know if the following statement would also apply to Sociology admissions, but I spoke to an admissions officer at one of the schools I am applying to about my undergraduate GPA and she said "Your graduate GPA is more telling than your GPA from undergrad". This helped to boost my confidence.

[ohgoodness]

I am applying to PhD programs in Education Policy and have a similar issue (lower undergraduate GPA and great graduate GPA). I don't know if the following statement would also apply to Sociology admissions, but I spoke to an admissions officer at one of the schools I am applying to about my undergraduate GPA and she said "Your graduate GPA is more telling than your GPA from undergrad". This helped to boost my confidence.

Heard the same thing over and over again.

I'm not entirely sure I understand the argument about a steeper hill for graduates than bachelors but yeah

[RiseofthePhoenix]

This is the case with me as well. Sub 3 uGPA, 3.7 MA GPA applying to phd programs. I honestly think this is a non-issue in the sense that, while the adcomms will surely glance over the uGPA most are interested in the most recent transcripts and there is no doubt that a graduate transcript is a more accurate determinant of your abilities than and undergrad one. In my case, four long years passed between my undergrad and my grad career. Young people are dumb, crap happens, you learn and grow wiser. Academics realize this.

I second the note about strong LORs, letter of intent, research potential and writing sample. I'd go as far as saying that the gpa and GRE scores are probably the least important parts of the application. Fit, research potential and your professors vouching for your academic abilities are the most important aspects IMO.

[magicunicorn]

Unfortunately, many graduate programs have greater grade inflation than undergrad programs, so an increase in change in GPA between the two might not be read as improvement by the candidate, but just the grading scale changing and inflating between the two.  

 

If you have a poor undergrad GPA (below 3) - I think this needs to be explained somewhere, somehow.. perhaps in a letter of rec by an advisor who knew you as an undergrad.  Was it one bad semester?  What kind of crap happened.  Yes, young people are dumb, but you are also competing with other people who have 3.8 undergrad GPAs where the crap that happened did not as severely affect their grades.  While I say that GRE's are less important, and to some extent GPAs, they actually do matter when they put you at a strong disadvantage against other candidates.

 

On the other hand, the 4 years off from school, the masters work, etc.. will of course help.  

[soc1]

Thank you all for your advice, and your knowledge on the matter.  I do have strong LORs, with people whom are well known in the field.  I also have a few publications in the school forum. I still have yet to take the GRE, but I'm studying like crazy, so we shall see!  Hopefully all goes well.  I will be sure to let you know my outcome. 

 

Thanks again, and good luck to all of you!