vigilante Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 (edited) Hi all, I will be applying for my PhD this year in Sociology to top 15 schools, though I need your best advice as this problem has been concerning me for many months. I would like to combine Sociology with another field for personal, but primarily, career reasons (academia is my top choice but one day I can see myself without it). Sociology is often combined with Public Policy, though often Organizational Behaviour. I have a very strong interest in the public sector (I’m a politics junkie, enjoy reading policy reports time-to-time, and have been involved in community my whole life). I have a little interest in business, though tends to focus on business processes such as strategic thinking and organizational behavior; I don’t really like the “business culture” of networking etc. Problem: My personality and skill-set is strongly geared towards business (more variety; forward-thinking; excellent communicator and charismatic; I cannot sit in front of a computer the whole day doing ‘policy’ and struggle in bureaucracies), though my interests are towards public sector. At the heart of the issue, I am a people-person that is a macro-level, deep thinker. Is there a way of combining Public Policy and Organizational Behavior in Sociology? Are there programs that tend to be more interdisciplinary? (I have interests in Social Psychology and Political Science, particularly Political Philosophy). Thanks! Edited January 18, 2013 by vigilante Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohgoodness Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 PAM at Cornell might geared towards your interests: http://www.human.cornell.edu/pam/academics/phd/index.cfm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amlobo Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Take a look at Harvard's Organizational Behavior PhD program - it's a joint venture of sociology and the business school. http://www.hbs.edu/doctoral/areas-of-study/organizational-behavior/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertrollins Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 (edited) I don't recommend a PhD for anyone who isn't committed to working at an academic research institution, or doing nearly exclusively research work for a non-academic organization long term. A PhD will leave you with no skills for anything else, and what is quite often perceived as a negative hiring signal for anything else. If you can't picture yourself sitting in front of a computer and/or book all day -- a PhD is not for you. Edited January 18, 2013 by econosocio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomDood Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 I don't recommend a PhD for anyone who isn't committed to working at an academic research institution, or doing nearly exclusively research work for a non-academic organization long term. A PhD will leave you with no skills for anything else, and what is quite often perceived as a negative hiring signal for anything else. If you can't picture yourself sitting in front of a computer and/or book all day -- a PhD is not for you. Agreed 100%...Don't think twice before trying to get a PhD, think thrice :-) If you even just think you could be happy working outside of academic research, there are 100 reasons to just take another route, in my humble opinion.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertrollins Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 My opinion is characteristically not humble, but especially so on this matter. A PhD is emotionally and intellectually brutal, and offers little reward outside the intrinsic satisfaction with one's daily activity -- reading, writing, and discussing ideas. It is also a lonely and unsure experience. If you feel your personality and skill-set is best geared toward business -- then you ought to go into business. There are plenty of intellectually challenging roles in the business world that allow you to think critically, and even do a bit of research. In fact many firms are increasingly research driven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbrown0315 Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 There is a growing trend among business schools of hiring sociologists, which should be an indication that there is a place for sociologists in the business world. As a matter of fact, Boston Consulting Group mentions sociologists on its advanced degrees recruitment page. Many thinks tanks and polling institutions prefer that their senior researchers hold PhDs. Just go to the job listings posted by Gallup or Pew and check out the specifications. Here is an example (they don't specify the field in which the PhD is earned, but they do specify a background in social science research). This also applies to some extent for market research firms, though that's trickier. Private foundations are also often interested in hiring sociologists. Last but not least, there are plenty of government jobs available to sociologists. Go to usajobs.gov and type in "sociology." The American Sociological Association even has a program that helps to place sociologists on congressional committees. I think it's difficult to discuss sociology seriously as a single discipline these days. On the one hand, you have those sociologists who spend much of their time describing and critiquing social constructs and institutions (family, sex, religion, race, etc.). On the other hand, you have sociologists who are doing some really groundbreaking, math-heavy work involving organizational behavior and social network analysis. The former continues to dwell almost exclusively in the academy. The latter flourishes both in and out of the ivory tower. There are fields in sociology (generally those relying more heavily on quantitative methodology and empirical work, not so much theory) that are very interesting to policymakers and businesspeople. If you consider yourself business-minded, I would seriously consider going for an MBA and specializing in market research. However, there is plenty of room for you and your interests in sociology doctoral programs if you choose to focus on the right subjects. gilbertrollins 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vigilante Posted January 20, 2013 Author Share Posted January 20, 2013 Thanks for your replies, but I wanted to clarify something. My query did not revolve around whether I should undertake a PhD or not - I know exactly what I'm getting into and have thought about it on-and-off for 5 years, seriously for one year. My question, as you can see, was are there top 15 programs in Sociology where you can combine Public Policy and Organizational Behavior in Sociology? Are there programs that tend to be more interdisciplinary? ohgoodness 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertrollins Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Most fields in sociology touch on public policy. If you want to do organizations case studies and such, you'd be well served by a PhD in Business with a specialization in organizations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amlobo Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 I applied to the Sociology & Social Policy joint programs at Harvard and Princeton. Not sure if those would serve your interests - perhaps the Harvard one more than Princeton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertrollins Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 What are the origins of this term "lifecourse?" It sounds silly and redundant to me. A life by definition follows a course. LainieB, rnmack and joosemoore 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohgoodness Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 What are the origins of this term "lifecourse?" It sounds silly and redundant to me. A life by definition follows a course. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_course_approach and then read this http://www.springer.com/social+sciences/book/978-0-306-47498-9 but you should really know better. It grew out of various major developments in various disciplines, especially hägerstrands time-geography. I hope you're not applying to Yale or UNC gilbertrollins and rnmack 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertrollins Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Ha. Nope, no Yale or UNC. I've always thought it would be really interesting to see how life expectancy influences the timing of major life decisions. Say people consider the estimated time remaining in their life as currency ("spending time"), then the opportunity cost of making major life decisions goes down as technology and economic growth expand life expectancy (which has trebled in 150 years!), thus "buying" one more time to make major decisions, hence pushing marriage, kids, and college back, and making career changes more common. You could potentially develop indices of variance in those stage-changes, and regress the time series on life expectancy data, all with other controls. Old idea of mine. Probably wrong. Anyway, thanks for the links man. Bump knux. LainieB and joosemoore 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohgoodness Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 (edited) Ha. Nope, no Yale or UNC. I've always thought it would be really interesting to see how life expectancy influences the timing of major life decisions. Say people consider the estimated time remaining in their life as currency ("spending time"), then the opportunity cost of making major life decisions goes down as technology and economic growth expand life expectancy (which has trebled in 150 years!), thus "buying" one more time to make major decisions, hence pushing marriage, kids, and college back, and making career changes more common. You could potentially develop indices of variance in those stage-changes, and regress the time series on life expectancy data, all with other controls. Old idea of mine. Probably wrong. Anyway, thanks for the links man. Bump knux. http://www.yale.edu/ciqle/PUBLICATIONS/Brueckner%26Mayer-Destandardization.pdf Herr Mayer at your service. and then: http://www.journals.elsevier.com/advances-in-life-course-research/most-cited-articles/ <- specifically the "now or later" (at the bottom) article and the "towards a new pattern of entry into adulthood" btw - I thought you economists had given up on rational choice theories? (sorry for hijacking this thread - life course makes me randy and raucous) Edited January 21, 2013 by cherub gilbertrollins 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertrollins Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 (edited) Gimme a break. Your intentions as a social advocate are not an ethical defense of your work, and are generally considered by the scientific community to be the primary reason to disregard sociology. You do realize that history is full of people who have been shot because some intellectual thought they were saving the world? I want to save the world too. But I don't run around acting like empirical and theoretical assertions I make deserve some kind of prima facie respect just because my intentions are good. Intentions, especially those infused into scientific policy recommendations, have unintended consequences, often terrible ones. I asked what lifecourse meant and said it sounded like a silly neologism. Every discipline is full of these, and criticism of them is widespread in just about every academic style guide available. Check in for instance with Richard Lanham's Paramedic Method, or Zissner's On Writing. Social science isn't day care. If you can't handle people jabbing at work that you find useful, you're going to have a rough go of it. I still think "lifecourse" sounds silly, at least as silly as the terms "performativity" and "operationalize." But as I said in my follow up post, I have a reasoned interest in the allocation of work and leisure time, career and familial decisions, etc. So I'm not sure what you're concerned about me condescending to, other than a popular name given to demographic research I otherwise have a great deal of respect for and interest in. Edited January 21, 2013 by econosocio LainieB, joosemoore and rnmack 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohgoodness Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Richard Lanham's Paramedic Method *drools* gilbertrollins and LainieB 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertrollins Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 (edited) Really? "Boo hoo - you're a bully because you don't agree with me and pointed out the flaws in my reasoning after I called you condescending." I'd love to have you at my defense. I'm looking forward to getting ripped to shreds. I'm certainly not going to storm out of the room sobbing about the level of criticism of my ideas. Edited January 21, 2013 by econosocio LainieB, joosemoore and rnmack 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronM Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 these mixing sociology threads deteriorate rather quickly, don't they? amlobo and LainieB 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertrollins Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Sure do. People from the "umbrella discipline" have a curious tendency to approach criticism of the intersection of sociology with anything else with open hostility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amlobo Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 To be fair, I do not think the deterioration or hostility in this thread actually had anything to do with a discussion of the intersection of disciplines. The comments that were actually directed toward the OP's question were mostly helpful. Willows, gilbertrollins and rnmack 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amlobo Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 I, for one, am all for true interdisciplinary work... though, that may be apparent from my Sociology/Social Policy joint program apps, lol gilbertrollins 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertrollins Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 "You have reached your quota of positive votes for the day" ^I tried. amlobo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vigilante Posted January 22, 2013 Author Share Posted January 22, 2013 I would greatly appreciate it if you could resume your conversations through private messages. I came onto this board looking for support and advice and would appreciate your most insightful comments. Please stop hijacking this thread. amlobo, johnjohnson, gilbertrollins and 1 other 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blogstarphd Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 these mixing sociology threads deteriorate rather quickly, don't they? They do. People can be really disrespectful... johnjohnson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomDood Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 these mixing sociology threads deteriorate rather quickly, don't they? (Sorry, I HAD to. Now back on topic.) Willows, ohgoodness and gilbertrollins 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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