how do you feel about athletes being forced to go to school?

[Guest Gnome Chomsky]

This is an important distinction to make. The vast majority of athletic departments are net costs. Only 7 athletic departments from 2005 to 2009 were profitable. I don't know how many would be profitableif you stripped away all sports but football and basketball, but i would that with the exception of the perennial national championship contenders the majority would be net costs.

http://www.acenet.edu/news-room/Pages/Myth-College-Sports-Are-a-Cash-Cow2.aspx

That's the distinction I'm trying to make. I don't consider the majority of football/basketball players to be student-athletes. These are people who would be playing in or trying out for a professional league if they had the opportunity, not being a dual-student. I'm not saying all of them, but many of them. I can't think of any other position where you can have an All-World expertise and not be allowed to partake in the field for a living (i.e. earning an income). 

 

The sports that don't make money (volleyball, swimming, lacrosse) are full of students who probably consider themselves student-first. These are people who partake in extracurricular activities while going to school. Kinda like how it is in high school. You can play on the soccer team if you want, or the chess team, or the debate team. You're there to be a student, but you can engage in other activities if you want.

 

But these football and basketball players are there to make a living. And I'm tired of hearing that "most of them don't go pro." That's very untrue. There are many leagues other than the NFL. And every team in the NFL has a practice squad full of players you've never heard of before. There are many more football players making a decent living who aren't well-known NFL stars. And if they aren't playing, many of them go on to coach or partake in some aspect of the sport. I would argue that a majority of the college football players who don't become NFL stars are making a living doing something related to football.

 

I can't think of any other thing where 1) you're 18 years old, 2) you're good enough to make a living, 3) you're not allowed to make a living.

 

And, Boba felt, I don't think it's sad that "some players across many sports take easy classes so as to not distract from their main reason for going to school: sports." I think it's sad that they have to waste their time in class in the first place. Believe it or not, not everyone needs to go to school. A lot of geniuses did very little school. And lots your favorite people (comedians, actors, bands, sports stars) never went to school. 

[Boba felt]

I think it's sad they waste their time and that of their teachers by not focusing more on schools instead of sports, but they're following the money. Lots of geniuses may not have gone to school, but most college sports athletes are not geniuses, so not sure how that's relevant. Like I said, it would be nice if there were more options in regards to community college for young people to learn a trade and then try the pros.

I think the NCAA tries to give high schoolers a chance to mature and have some type of plan b in the form of an education before funneling into the pros for football. Many student athletes can only afford college because of their athletic skills. According to NCAA less than 4% of high school football players go on to play in college. Less than 2% of those end up in the pros, even just as a bench warmer for any time. The majority of college student athletes go on to use their college degrees to get jobs in the world not involved with pro sports.

[DropTheBase]

I think the NCAA tries to give high schoolers a chance to mature and have some type of plan b in the form of an education before funneling into the pros for football. Many student athletes can only afford college because of their athletic skills.

 

Aside from athlete compensation issues, I really like the idea that athletes have to take classes for the reason mentioned above. For the ones who decide not to become professional athletes, at least they have an education.

 

While there are certainly many jobs that don't require a college degree, you're very likely to make much more money over the course of your life with one.

 

 I would argue that a majority of the college football players who don't become NFL stars are making a living doing something related to football.

 

Can you show us some statistics to back up this argument?

[Boba felt]

off topic, but i love your avatar.  Gave me many lols, which were much needed

[spectastic]

they were saying there's a $17k gap b/t those with college degree and those without it. college is becoming a necessity... for survival. those undisciplined, airheaded athletes can complain all they want about having to go to class. in the end, a college degree will help them do more than flip burgers for the rest of their lives. they should be grateful that they're getting a free ride, and have so much support from their coaches and the student body, for doing something that they love.

 

Also, if you take school away, there'd be nothing to stop the coaches and their staff to go to town on these kids. forget about college, it'll just be a junior NFL. there's already enough scandals going on behind NCAA (particularly football) about coaches coaxing recruits and players through unethical means. Taking away school would give the coaches complete control, considering they all want to get to the championships by any means necessary.

[Crucial BBQ]

It seems better to recruit players for college teams without forcing them to attend and earn a degree if they are not interested. If they are spending most of their time training or playing they only have time to get bullshit communications degrees anyway. I doubt this will ever change though.

For what schools?  When it comes to college athletics, schools are "members" of one of three Divisions.  Div 1 schools can recruit up to 80%-100% by use of athletic scholarship, Div 2...not sure of numbers, but they have the ability to partially recruit based on athletic scholarships, and Div 3 schools cannot recruit based on athletic scholarships.  College athletes are amateurs, and as such, not "allowed" to get paid to play.  That is why there are athletic scholarships, to attract the best talent...it is the work-around.  College athletics are not developmental leagues.  Without the "college" part, there is no way the could exist.  

[Crucial BBQ]

That's the distinction I'm trying to make. I don't consider the majority of football/basketball players to be student-athletes. These are people who would be playing in or trying out for a professional league if they had the opportunity, not being a dual-student. I'm not saying all of them, but many of them. I can't think of any other position where you can have an All-World expertise and not be allowed to partake in the field for a living (i.e. earning an income). 

 

The sports that don't make money (volleyball, swimming, lacrosse) are full of students who probably consider themselves student-first. These are people who partake in extracurricular activities while going to school. Kinda like how it is in high school. You can play on the soccer team if you want, or the chess team, or the debate team. You're there to be a student, but you can engage in other activities if you want.

 

But these football and basketball players are there to make a living. And I'm tired of hearing that "most of them don't go pro." That's very untrue. There are many leagues other than the NFL. And every team in the NFL has a practice squad full of players you've never heard of before. There are many more football players making a decent living who aren't well-known NFL stars. And if they aren't playing, many of them go on to coach or partake in some aspect of the sport. I would argue that a majority of the college football players who don't become NFL stars are making a living doing something related to football.

 

I can't think of any other thing where 1) you're 18 years old, 2) you're good enough to make a living, 3) you're not allowed to make a living.

 

And, Boba felt, I don't think it's sad that "some players across many sports take easy classes so as to not distract from their main reason for going to school: sports." I think it's sad that they have to waste their time in class in the first place. Believe it or not, not everyone needs to go to school. A lot of geniuses did very little school. And lots your favorite people (comedians, actors, bands, sports stars) never went to school. 

Not sure about volleyball, but I know a few people who were swimmers.  For the most part they did it as an extracurricular, but did so with the hopes of one day swimming "professionally" on the competition circuit.  Unlike other sports, swimming is one of the few where 0.01 seconds can mean everything.  As such, swimmers spend an insane amount of time practicing and working out in order to gain that 0.01 second edge.  Everyone I knew who played lacrosse did/does because of a love simple for the game and nothing more.  

 

While it is true there are many (American style) football leagues around the World, the fact remains that most college players do not go on to play professional football.  That does not mean they do not end up doing something relating to football, if even playing it, but according to the NCAA only roughly 1.7% of college football players go onto the NFL.  Granted, the NCAA acknowledges that they do not keep track of those who go on to play professionally in leagues outside of the U.S..  Still, if only 1.7% of U.S. college players go onto the NFL, and the NFL is the largest football league in the world....and...

 

There are just under 70K college football players during any given year.  As you can see, there are a lot of college football players leaving college ball every single year.  There is simply too  many of them for the majority to end up doing "something" for football after they leave college. 

[FestivusMiracle]

You've never heard of that? You must not follow football. People fight it all the time. Maurice Clarrett from Ohio State fought it not too long ago. Also, there were a few articles from this past season about the top players in the country wishing they could go to the NFL straight from high school. There were even rumors last year that Jadaveon Clowney would sit out his sophomore year to ensure his health since he was predicted by everyone to be the #1 overall pick in the next year's draft.

 

 

If I have heard it, it's been so quiet that I've forgotten.  It seems like all I hear about is how college players should be paid.  

[gr8pumpkin]

I've never completely understood why one can't just major in football or basketball as a form of study, the way that one can major in other high-risk, ultra-competitive would-be occupations like music or theater.  Someone wants to be a famous concert pianist, so he or she goes to some music program and focuses on that pursuit knowing the risk that it may not pan out.  And someone goes to a college to play football or basketball or whatever, hoping to make the pros but knowing the risk that it may not pan out.  What's the difference?  If it doesn't pan out, the would-have-been concert pianist winds up teaching piano lessons and the would-have-been NBA star winds up coaching middle schoolers.  My solution is to treat sports like any other would-be occupation and let students pursue it as a real study.  This would keep them out of rocks-for-jocks type BS classes the same way music majors in conservatories never have to see a day of calculus or chemistry.

[gr8pumpkin]

Actually, ha, I could imagine a course where football players and basketball players have to study and write essays about famous games of the past and famous coaching gambits those entailed; papers on particular players and the techniques they employed, etc.  Why not?