I need genuine advice (and hugs)

[colorless]

So I am still waiting from Harvard (not going to happen bcs of many reasons but also someone mentioned that they already notified, Upenn and Michigan (near eastern studies) but I really don't think anything will happen. This has been my third time in life and life is so much in the way at 30 with dependents and I had thought this time things would be different but no I was wrong. I really have no effort, energy, time, money left for another fourth row of applications not to mention the harassment of professors for writing yet another reference letter.

Anyway Cornell has given me a potential chance to go to their M.A. but it will cost like hell and I cannot probably go there unless I get Green Card residency in the USA (hence loans) or win the lottery.

I am looking for advice.

Europe is out of question, UK is too expensive and I would not compare the education elsewhere with the USA anyway.

Should we try aaaaalllll our possibilities for this non funded Master's? Can it lead to a PhD in the future or at least help something??

Should I come there as a special student to some places I applied and audit courses to see?

Should we come with a tourist visa and see the environment and decide then?

Any other ideas? suggestions?

[sarab]

I'm curious as to why you'd need a green card? Couldn't you get a student visa and once the master ends just apply for an extension to be able to continue on to your PhD? I really don't know how you'd be able to get a green card unless:

1. you have family here who can sponsor you (and that process takes a very long time)

2. if you have a job that would sponsor you

or 3. if you came here as an asylee or refugee.

I have experience with 1 and 3, so if you have questions about it, pm me.

 

Anyway, I would recommend asking the university how many of their MA students apply to their PhD and how successful they are at getting in. If you already have a tourist visa and can afford to visit, then that'd probably be a good idea to decide.

 

I saw thread in the psych forum, and it might be useful for you.

 

Many many hugs and blessings to you <3 <3

[NOWAYNOHOW]

Hi Colorless -- I really feel for you. I'm in my late twenties, and though I have no dependents, I too have struck out of the PhD game.  I don't have the option of going for the MA (I have one already), so you have room to grow where I don't.  Do I think the Cornell MA will help you next round? Absolutely. But is it worth dragging your whole family here to go into debt without being sure that you'll get in? I'm not sure.

 

I've been doing some serious damage control with some of the faculty closest to me, and trying to get feedback as to improving.  The story I'm getting is that the funding crunch has made it more competitive than ever before, and no matter how great you are, chances are someone will always be better.  One of my recommenders said, of the 10 students she wrote for this year, only 2 have had positive results, and they both came in with either Ford or NSF funding AND publications.  So now I'm going to go for NSF funding before my next round of applications.

 

I personally know a lot of fabulous students having bad seasons in a lot of different disciplines, and I am trying not to take it to heart.  

 

I think if you choose to not go for the MA (and honestly, even if you do) the only way to be better is to be the best.  Have some publications.  I now have work under review at 3 respected graduate student journals (double blind review), and when my thesis is finished, I'm going to find a home for it at a top journal if I can.  Present everywhere.  Since my rejections started rolling in, I've gotten a paper accepted to one conference and sent abstracts to a bunch of others.  Research!  Look on the web for jobs related to your AOIs, and apply like crazy.  Keep building until it's time to send those CVs out. 

 

Another thing I heard was that my topic just wasn't "sexy" enough to grab the adcomms the way I need it to.  I admittedly played it safe, but I now know I should have taken a risk.  Find out how you can make your proposal "sexier," or more relevant somehow.

 

That's all I can say, I suppose, but just know that an MA won't do the work for you.  Mine is from a top department and it did not get me in, though it certainly is giving me the tools to do the work myself.

 

Hope that is helpful.  Keep your chin up.

Edited February 16, 2014 by NOWAYNOHOW

[MsDarjeeling]

So I am still waiting from Harvard (not going to happen bcs of many reasons but also someone mentioned that they already notified, Upenn and Michigan (near eastern studies) but I really don't think anything will happen. This has been my third time in life and life is so much in the way at 30 with dependents and I had thought this time things would be different but no I was wrong. I really have no effort, energy, time, money left for another fourth row of applications not to mention the harassment of professors for writing yet another reference letter.

Anyway Cornell has given me a potential chance to go to their M.A. but it will cost like hell and I cannot probably go there unless I get Green Card residency in the USA (hence loans) or win the lottery.

I am looking for advice.

Europe is out of question, UK is too expensive and I would not compare the education elsewhere with the USA anyway.

Should we try aaaaalllll our possibilities for this non funded Master's? Can it lead to a PhD in the future or at least help something??

Should I come there as a special student to some places I applied and audit courses to see?

Should we come with a tourist visa and see the environment and decide then?

Any other ideas? suggestions?

 

 

A few thoughts come to mind as I read your post.  First, while 3 application cycles is a lot and it is expensive there are students that have done more to finally get in.  If getting a PhD really is your dream then you can hang in there for at least another round.

 

Also your comments about the green card make me think you're an international student.  I am not an expert on how best to come to the US to study, but I do understand the cost considerations when you have a family.  I'm here in California where it is very expensive to live and work/study.  Many of the international students/employees I've met chose not to relocate their family because of the cost.  No that isn't easy and talking daily via Skype isn't the same.  However that was more feasible for them and they just saved up the money to go home during winter and/or summer break.  For many of them the separation motivated them to finish faster so they could get home faster.  This could be an option for you depending on your family dynamics.

 

As for the Cornell Masters, I'm guessing you applied to their PhD and they countered by suggesting you consider their MA?  That could indicate that they found your application strong, but not quite strong enough to handle PhD work.  They may figure that with a bit of polishing in an MA program you'd make an amazing PhD student and they want to be the ones to grab you up and take credit for that.  I do not think it is a bad option to consider especially when it will give you the opportunity to study under new professors, expand your research training, and perhaps publish.  All of those things will look good to PhD programs.  You should definitely ask them about the success rates of students in their MA program going to their PhD program or other PhD programs.  Also ask if its possible to talk to current PhD students that were formerly in the MA program.

 

Now about the unfunded MA and if it is worth it.  You'll get a variety of conflicting opinions on this and ultimately you have to decide what is best for your situation and future goals.  I went through a couple of PhD application cycles and was unsuccessful.  Finally I hit a point where I realized that my efforts to improve my application each year weren't enough to get me where I wanted to go so I needed to do something different.  I talked to my LOR writers and other professors and their advice was going the Masters route.  Many of the Masters in Psych are unfunded so I created a solid plan to finish on time, work my way through, and cut down on expenses.  Is a Masters a guaranteed ticket into a PhD program?  No, especially if your desired field is extremely competitive.  It does however give you the opportunity to demonstrate PhD readiness, a new batch of LOR writers, broaden existing skills, develop new skills, network, and expand job opportunities.  So ultimately I would say that it is a good option for someone who's been unsuccessful at a few application cycles. 

[jellyfish1]

First HUGS!  

On to your question. While it is possible that a master's at Cornell could improve your chances in the PhD game, it is so competitive and there are no guarantees. Most PhDs do not get tenure track jobs either, so a PhD in general is a risky proposition.

Consider this: You spend everything to do the Cornell master's and go deep into debt as well. Then you graduate and don't get into any PhD programs once again. Will it have been worth it? Are you willing to take that risk? If you are, then you should go for it. If it is worth it to you to spend all that money, knowing it will most likely get you nowhere, for the sake of learning and giving it your all, then go for it. But that's a decision you have to make for yourself. I wish there were a more positive outlook, but the funding situation is most likely only going to get worse in the future. PhD programs will continue to be an unbelievably competitive crapshoot, and applicants will, in the meantime, be more and more qualified, accruing more honors and publications. 

I second the other advice you've received about asking for stats. Have you considered waiting and applying to more master's programs next year? I've been looking at UChicago's MAPSS program, which is one year, boasts 90% of supported students getting into funded PhD programs (including some of the schools you've applied to this year), and often gives tuition scholarships of 1/3 to full scholarships. I'm still in the early stages of researching, and certainly they don't explain how many of their graduates they "support" for PhD programs, but it generally seems like a program geared toward grooming people for acceptance into PhD programs. They tell you exactly how to write your SOP and provide you with a recommendation letter that is supposedly very persuasive. I have not thoroughly looked into master's programs, but I'm sure there are others as well. If you are considering going for a master's to improve your chances, I would encourage you to look into all the master's options available and not just accept cornell's because it is the only offer you have right now. 

I hope this helps! And remember, you still have some schools to hear from! Don't lose all hope yet!

[Forsaken in LA]

First HUGS!  

On to your question. While it is possible that a master's at Cornell could improve your chances in the PhD game, it is so competitive and there are no guarantees. Most PhDs do not get tenure track jobs either, so a PhD in general is a risky proposition.

Consider this: You spend everything to do the Cornell master's and go deep into debt as well. Then you graduate and don't get into any PhD programs once again. Will it have been worth it? Are you willing to take that risk? If you are, then you should go for it. If it is worth it to you to spend all that money, knowing it will most likely get you nowhere, for the sake of learning and giving it your all, then go for it. But that's a decision you have to make for yourself. I wish there were a more positive outlook, but the funding situation is most likely only going to get worse in the future. PhD programs will continue to be an unbelievably competitive crapshoot, and applicants will, in the meantime, be more and more qualified, accruing more honors and publications. 

I second the other advice you've received about asking for stats. Have you considered waiting and applying to more master's programs next year? I've been looking at UChicago's MAPSS program, which is one year, boasts 90% of supported students getting into funded PhD programs (including some of the schools you've applied to this year), and often gives tuition scholarships of 1/3 to full scholarships. I'm still in the early stages of researching, and certainly they don't explain how many of their graduates they "support" for PhD programs, but it generally seems like a program geared toward grooming people for acceptance into PhD programs. They tell you exactly how to write your SOP and provide you with a recommendation letter that is supposedly very persuasive. I have not thoroughly looked into master's programs, but I'm sure there are others as well. If you are considering going for a master's to improve your chances, I would encourage you to look into all the master's options available and not just accept cornell's because it is the only offer you have right now. 

I hope this helps! And remember, you still have some schools to hear from! Don't lose all hope yet!

 

 

Wish I had more positive votes left for the day, but I'm out. 

[gradcat]

There's a lot of good advice here.  Lots of hugs to you, Colorless. We are all rooting for you. 

[strudelle]

I don't have anything to add to the great advice here, because I am not sure what I would do in your position either.

 

Just wanted to say don't lose hope yet on UPenn and Michigan and I am really really hoping you get in somewhere and can pursue your PhD *HUGS*!

[bellabean]

The master's gets you to the US....that's a big plus for your plans. There are always some type of jobs you can pick up on the campus to help defer the costs - the decisions really depend on your "end goal" outside of just the PHD.

 

We are all wishing you the best!!

[DigDeep(inactive)]

Have you applied to safety schools?  I mean, I see you have applied to Harvard, Penn, Michigan, Cornell.........these schools are ridiculously tough to get into. Are you opposed to state schools? 

 

Also, I have seen a lot of disregard for Masters programs, and I think it is silly. The MA/MS allows you the opportunity to gain valuable research, publish, go to conferences, network, learn new analytical techniques, learn multivariate statistics in various software, make colleagues, the list goes on. I get it, a MA/MS does not do much for a job, BUT it DOES do a lot for your future career as an academic. Education is a marathon, not a sprint. I would suggest not looking down on Masters programs (if you are) and apply to some. Maybe even state schools. If you ARE qualified enough for those schools you are applying to, then you can probably go to some state school with a GREAT funding package for an MA. It's not unheard of, I am doing it as we speak (Ok, so it's not a great funding package but it's free+ school). 

 

As for your decision: First, there are tons of opportunities for external funding. You should be applying to as many of these as possible anyways. Second, if you do go to Cornell without funding then I would have to say that it needs to be under the strict rule that you HAVE to be ready to do everything in your power to get funding. Talk to faculty, join research projects, apply for scholarships, fellowships, TA positions in other departments, OR even try to get a job at a local community college to offset costs. On that note, you need to KICK ASS that first semester and quarter and go WELL out of your way to do so. Turn heads. So, what I'm saying is you have to dominate your coursework (4.0, no ifs ands or buts), volunteer at a Center or Institute to get the "in" on a research group, or try to get job if you have previous experience, and try to get involved in independent research. Furthermore, you have to excel in all of these endeavors. If you do this, you WILL get funding. I guarantee it, but it's not easy....

 

You will be amazed at how many people come out of the woodworks to help genuine individuals who care about learning and share a passion for it. If you're willing to do those things, then I think you will do fine. You just have to work [bleeping] hard. I would seriously consider if you can make this happen, if not then I wouldn't do it. Time is a luxury, that not many have (especially when you have dependents) and everything I just said takes lots of it.

 

Good luck with your journey, and good luck with your other schools! 

[NoSleepTilBreuckelen]

A) HUUGGGGGSSS!

 

B)If you do decide to go the Masters route, you might want to look into archaeology Masters programs in the EU/UK - I know you've already looked into these, but when I was applying this cycle, I saw lots of programs over there I wanted to apply to for a PhD, but didn't because I wanted to stay close-ish to friends and family in the US. Many of those programs have Masters that only take a year and are less expensive than US programs, especially for EU/UK residents. Also, I know at least some of those programs are still accepting applications for this year (for example I just checked  Cambridge's website and they are still accepting applications and also offer a part-time Masters, if you'd want to work while going to school). I did a Masters in the UK, because the school offered a course in exactly what I wanted to study and it was less expensive and quicker than a US unfunded Masters program. I really enjoyed it and thought it helped me develop a lot as an archaeologist. It sounds like you've already looked into the EU/UK Masters options, but I just bring it up as another option that might give you a similar benefit to a Masters at Cornell. You can PM me if you want to discuss more.

 

Anyways, I think you have options yet, whether they be wait a year, start at Cornell, or look for other options for this coming academic year.

 

Good luck - we are rooting for you!

Edited February 17, 2014 by NoSleepTilBreuckelen

[colalalala]

Hi, colorless

I am an international applicant, I am in my late 20s and I already have a MS in another field, my results so far are not looking good (2 rejections) so you might find our situation very similar.

I think everything that needed to be said are said, so I am just gonna say if I were you, I would definitely go for the MA, it's a good program, it's a way for you to meet other scholars and do something that can be added to your CV, so that you can come out as a much stronger applicant. Just think it as a way to achieve your ultimate goal, which I assume is getting a PhD.

I applied for a few MAs myself, and I've met people with multiple MS/MAs, I think it's quite common in the field of anthropology.

As for the cost/funding part, I would suggest you maybe don't relocate your family until you are all settled in the States, once you are in the program, you can apply for funding and/or find work, just give it a year or two until you are financially stable. Maybe you can apply for a student loan(or something with very low interest rate)?

However, you have your concerns and thoughts, so ultimately you have to be the one to make the decision.

Good luck and we all support you.

[Melian4]

To reiterate what NoSleepTilBreuckelen said, a lot of very good universities still take applications in the UK. Doing a 9-month MSt at Oxford (the last application deadline is in March) in Archaeology would be far cheaper than doing a MA in the US, expand your professional network drastically, and maybe gain you a great LOR writer or two. Another non-negligeable advantage is that if you bring your family with you in the UK as dependants on your Tier4 visa, your partner can work full-time, which may ease the financial strain of doing another master's degree.

 

I really hope you find a realistic option that makes you and your family happy! Big hugs. 

 

 

[HrdyWordy]

I have no additional advice, but I give great hugs. (((colorless)))

[Gutian]

I think if you choose to not go for the MA (and honestly, even if you do) the only way to be better is to be the best.  Have some publications.  I now have work under review at 3 respected graduate student journals (double blind review), and when my thesis is finished, I'm going to find a home for it at a top journal if I can.  Present everywhere.  Since my rejections started rolling in, I've gotten a paper accepted to one conference and sent abstracts to a bunch of others.  Research!  Look on the web for jobs related to your AOIs, and apply like crazy.  Keep building until it's time to send those CVs out. 

Near Eastern archaeology differs from many other fields of archaeology in being very, very language heavy. Akkadian, Sumerian, and the like aren't easy, and it's a huge waste of money and resources if people wash out. For that reason, many programs unofficially require at least a year of Akkadian. If that's the case, no quantity of conference presentations or whatnot will make up for a glaring academic deficiency like that -- they'd much rather admit someone who's already mastered the relevant languages and can move on to more interesting and relevant things. A master's program or some language coursework at a good seminary school are the typical ways of working around this.

 

French and German are also musts, colorless. What's your language background like?

 

 

And yes, it's a very competitive field. Only about a dozen schools offer Near Eastern archaeology at all, and only about half of those are actually good at it. With 1-2 students (tops) in the subfield admitted at each school each year, it's obviously an insanely competitive process. 

[catsrgods]

Near Eastern archaeology differs from many other fields of archaeology in being very, very language heavy. Akkadian, Sumerian, and the like aren't easy, and it's a huge waste of money and resources if people wash out. For that reason, many programs unofficially require at least a year of Akkadian. If that's the case, no quantity of conference presentations or whatnot will make up for a glaring academic deficiency like that -- they'd much rather admit someone who's already mastered the relevant languages and can move on to more interesting and relevant things. A master's program or some language coursework at a good seminary school are the typical ways of working around this.

 

French and German are also musts, colorless. What's your language background like?

 

 

And yes, it's a very competitive field. Only about a dozen schools offer Near Eastern archaeology at all, and only about half of those are actually good at it. With 1-2 students (tops) in the subfield admitted at each school each year, it's obviously an insanely competitive process. 

Right on target with this response. The competitiveness is just beyond anything I even prepared for myself. It's unfortunate that some of these requirements, likes languages that aren't available in many schools, might only be possible to fulfill by people that come from privilege. I don't have a way to move to a new city to attend a school specifically to enroll in relevant, but unusual, language courses just to become more competitive for admission. I just don't have the money to make this happen and I am not interested in taking out loans to live on to do so. 

 

I don't know what kind of advice I can give for your real problem. School debt that ends in a humanities degree isn't always financially sound and I am on the cusp of completing a MA with a great GPA and I am still unsure if I will get in anywhere this year. It is all uncertain, even with an MA. Even with more languages. Even with visas, no dependents, a fantastic brain filled with knowledge, and "safety schools". In the end you need to make a choice based on your comfort zone. Are you comfortable taking out loans to complete a MA knowing full well that it will not guarantee that you move to the next academic step? If so, then do it, by all means. If not, then I would suggest reevaluating things for this year and perhaps focusing on ways to make yourself a better applicant next year or try different schools.

 

Most of all, GOOD LUCK and a huge hug from California =)

[colorless]

I love everyone of you deeply!

You know in the "outside" world many people would not even do a PhD even if you give a million dollars to them because it is too much work and boring and yet here we are struggling to get into a program and do science and try to hep the world in our own little ways. But I guess life may have different plans for us!

I still don't know what I will do, decided to wait a bit and see other options. I still have two schools pending and that M.A. (maybe they will offer some sort of funding)

We applied to the Green Card lottery so who knows we may end up there in the end but with a different option. It is just that I always thought that my career would be in academia and I was that weird student in the class who reads books and studies so it seems difficult to look at other options now beyond academics and try to come up with plan B etc. I can't imagine myself any other way but with dependents you gotta do what you gotta do. If there is something else I need to do in order to survive then it will be the way.

At least I have languages, experiences, some head start with good schools in my CV so...

 

I thank everyone who responded and took time to give advice with all my heart.