Withdrawal

[diamedic17]

Hi,

 

I have been enrolled in a PhD program for the past year and have been doing well in my classes and seem to be on track with my research project. I joined a lab in May after my rotations were finished and feel like I am on the way to a good career. My wife is unhappy with where we are living and wants to move away. I've exhausted every possible option that I can think of and when I tell her I want to stay she tells me I am being selfish. Her reasons for being unhappy are that it is obscenely expensive to live here, we both want to have another child (we have a two year old girl) and we have no family support here. I tell her that if we can suck it up for 4-5 years we will be home free but it hasn't made a difference. So I've been essentially given the choice of stay in grad school and lose my wife and daughter, or leave grad school and keep my family. It really isn't much of a choice since I will pick my wife and daughter 100 times out of 100 but I am extremely unhappy about leaving school. I'm 30 years old and while I plan on applying to schools closer to family, I really don't want to start again and I really like my current research project. That all said, the decision has been made and we will be moving come early August. I've applied for a few jobs and even interviewed for one so that I can have a source of income until next year when I hopefully get into school somewhere else.

 

My questions are:

When and how do I approach the subject with my PI and program director?

Do I stand a chance at getting into another program next year being that I will have already done a year of grad school and withdrew?

Does anyone have any other advice they'd like to send my way?

 

Thanks for the help!!

[TakeruK]

Hi there,

 

This sounds like a very tough situation. My spouse and I have similar concerns about our ability to eventually afford children and our current living costs, but we are currently happy with where we are. But, I think both of you have valid concerns about your current and future lives! I bring this up because I think there is one thing about your post that really stuck out to me and it is when you say:
 

 if we can suck it up for 4-5 years we will be home free

 

I don't think this is true. I can see why it has not made a difference because I really do not think life is magically going to get better for academics after grad school. Grad school is not a time in your life where you can just put everything on hold and resume it in 5 ish years. Maybe some people can do it, but not us. When I first started grad school, my spouse and I felt that way too (i.e. let's just tough it out for awhile) but we have since changed our way of thinking. Life is happening now! If you continue the route for an academic job, post-docs are even more work and I know the tenure track is more work still, from the people I know following this path.

 

Although each person's priorities and ideal balance of family happiness and career happiness is different, and no one can really give advice on that, I think it is really important to not consider grad school as a "phase" you have to get through in order to reach whatever goals you have for your PhD. Instead, grad school is a part of the journey towards that goal! I think allowing yourself to be unhappy during grad school and hoping things will get better afterwards is a good way to remain unhappy for a long time. 

 

For your actual questions:

 

1. I think you should be as direct with them as possible. August is in one month, there's no time to dally now. Let them know that you are leaving and provide as much details as you want. If you want to get into future grad schools, you will definitely need strong recommendation letters from this school and you need to give them as much notice as possible so they have the least amount of impact. In addition, the department is probably scheduling TAships soon and all that, so they need to know you won't be around. 

 

2. Having quit a prior grad program will affect your application. You can definitely still get into other programs though, if that is what you want. You will need very good recommendations from your current school (see above) and as long as you demonstrate that you chose to leave for personal reasons, and not academic or research reasons, then it should not hurt you too badly. They would justifiably be worried that you will leave again because you are unhappy, but at the same time, they know that if you are in a place where you and your family are happy, you will be much more likely to stay.

 

3. I guess I answered this question with the stuff at the top. I'll add that I am like you, I will choose family over school 100% of the time if it came to an ultimatum. But a healthy work-life balance, to me, means not having ultimatums such that you always have to choose one or the other. I would strongly encourage you and your family to consider all options moving forward and pick a path (whether it's grad school or not) that will make everyone happy. I am a little troubled by your words that it sounds like you want to "convince" your wife/family that grad school is the right path, instead of actually making a decision together. I hesitated to write that since it seems like a very personal situation that I really don't know anything about and I don't mean to be all judgmental, but I hope that is helpful. If not, obviously just dismiss this paragraph

[RunnerGrad]

I agree with what TakeruK said.  I also have some added comments of my own, based on the information you've provided.

 

What are your long-term career plans?  Assuming you do get into another PhD program, what are your plans post-PhD?  The market for most TT jobs in academia is absolutely horrible.   People go wherever they can get a post doc position, and then wherever they manage to secure a full time TT position, if they are lucky enough do do so.  What happens if the only post doc or TT position you can find is an an area that your wife objects to?  What are you going to do then?  What if the only jobs you can find are far away from family?  What if you do find a PhD program, or a job, near family, but you end up absolutely hating it there or your wife ends up absolutely hating it there? 

 

I think you need to have a long discussion with your wife about what the two of you want to do moving forward, and how you see your lives and careers together evolving.  Most individuals working in academia, unless they are superstars, move to where the jobs are.  Most of them (again, unless they are superstars) can't pick and choose. Be honest about the realities of graduate programs, post docs, and TT positions.  Decide together if a PhD is something that is worth pursuing.

 

I've only been able to return to university, and to pursue graduate school, due to the support of my husband.  This was, however, a decision we made together, as a family.  That's what you and your wife need to do:  make decisions, together, as a family.  Each of you will likely need to make some sacrifices.  There may be no perfect solution that makes both you and your wife 100% happy.  There's no guarantee your wife will be happy even if you move closer to family.  Sure, she may have their support in raising your child/children, but there may be other things she doesn't like.  Have an honest discussion and make sure you both know exactly what you are getting into.

 

One quick question:  is there any way you and your wife can have a long distance relationship while you complete your PhD, if she does not want to live where you are?  Long distance relationships are not easy, but as a military wife, I've had to deal with them at different points in time, and I know lots of people who have done so as well.  I even know some academics who only see each other on weekends, because they haven't been able to find jobs in the same city or even the same province.  It's not for everyone, and it's not easy, but it is something that people do.

[diamedic17]

Thank you both for your responses. I am not going to be looking for an academia position when I complete my PhD, my goal is to be a government researcher in a biodefense program. We both have talked several times and have agreed that we want to move to the Washington DC area when I am done with my schooling, I do have the fear that she will do this again however if we do end up moving there. I know that this is a decision we both have to make. I do feel like I had no choice in the decision though, she decided it and no matter what I said we were moving. It is what it is, I still and always will love her I just am worried I won't get into another school and I don't want to have to start over from scratch again. Long distance isn't an option, I refuse to miss my daughter's childhood just so I can go to school, we've talked about it and I am the one who said no to that. Again I thank you for your advice, it helped more than you may realize as I didn't look at it in some of the ways you brought up.

[Crucial BBQ]

I am older than you (not saying by how much, though).  Let me give you some advice.  I can understand that you do not want to miss out on your daughter's childhood but the reality of the situation is that you are simply doing what your wife wants and not what you want.  I've been there, done that.  Let me tell you: no one who truly loves you would ever say that you are being selfish when in reality they are only manipulating you to get what they want.  The bottom line is that anyone who claims someone else is being selfish has their own selfish agenda they are attempting to accomplish. 

 

If you think New York City is expensive....you won't be happy in DC.  I live 20 minutes north of DC...I'd take NYC any day of the week over that place. Not the greatest advice but if you ask yourself how will you feel about your "choice" five years from now and give yourself an honest answer that you can live with, well, then, so be it.  Otherwise you will carry around with you a ton of regret.  

 

For what it is worth it says a lot that your wife was wiling to move to NYC in the first place.  Not sure where you guys moved from but my guess is that she is simply homesick and making too many mental comparisons between why NYC sucks and why "home" rules.  If I were in your position, and I was in many ways similar, I'd try to come up with a compromise:  you two stick it out for one more year and if at the end of the year she still wants to move, then you will move no questions asked.  This would give you the opportunity to leave with a Master's, which would be enough to get you that job in biodefense (my current SO is also a microbiologist, and works for the Fed. Gov.  Trust me on this; Ph.D.s are not required). 

 

To answer your questions:

 

1:  As soon as possible!  Yes your PI will be upset, but he/she will be even more upset the longer you wait.  You need to be as professional as possible and you want this person as a reference.  Do not wait and be honest. 

 

2:  Yes, of course.  But it will all depend on how you explain the situation.  Grad school is essentially training grounds for academia, even if you do not wish to go into academia it does not matter.  College in the U.S. has changed little over the last 200+ years.  On the one hand academics are expected to pick up and go at a moments notice either for employment, research, sabbatical, and so on.  So for you to leave a program that you love and are doing well in at a moments notice says a lot about your ability to "get up and go as needed".  

 

On the other hand if the prospective programs even sense that you only left your current program "because of the wife" would be bad in terms of your chances for acceptance. It is one thing to move to keep the family unit together, it is another because the misses said so.  In short, it is not professional.  

 

Another thing to consider, as already mentioned, is that it is fairly common for couples, married or otherwise, to go into long distance status when one or both enter graduate school.  Not every couple does this but it is generally viewed as the mature, and professional, thing to do. 

 

3.   I know that I am coming across as harsh but as I wrote above I have been there. As long as you can live with the decisions, then that is all that really matters in the end.  I suggest you talk to your PI ASAP and begin the search for a suitable program in your home town area.  

 

I would also gently push the idea of sticking it out for one more year and perhaps suggesting moving out of the city to cheaper area that is still within a reasonable commuting distance. 

 

Good luck. 

[bsharpe269]

Have you looked into doing your dissertation long distance? Some schools allow this. If you could stay for another year and finish courses then maybe you and your wife could both get what you want!