Advice on Grad School/program Choices

[TruFranco]

Hello all. Long time lurker, first time poster. So I hope this is the right place for this.

First some background, My undergraduate degree is in French with International Studies/Linguistics minors. I've been teaching English in China for a couple years now and have become quite proficient with the language. While I would love to get into top level programs around the country and work on Chinese/American relations, I'm a realist and know that I don't have the undergraduate grades/connections/proper background for such things and I'm perfectly alright with that. However, during my undergraduate senior year I had a pretty life changing 7 month experience helping Congolese refugees coming into my town. We helped them with everything they needed: applying for services, interpretation, how to recognize and properly handle blatant racism from coworkers, etc. You name it, we were there. Teaching abroad is great, but it's really not the career that's for me and based off my aforementioned experience I would like to get into NGO/INGO work. It's really the only thing I've done that left me with a feeling like I was really making a difference. Money isn't incredibly important to me. As long as I have an apartment and decent air conditioning, I'm content. 

I've got a comfortable gig working for a uni in China. My undergrad debt will be finished before Christmas and I'm now looking to start grad school in the Spring. I'm hoping to be able to do the degree from here in China to avoid further loans and so am largely looking at online/distance programs to help me break into the field. Looking at my background, NGOs that bring education to those in need are pretty high on my list (UNESCO would be a dream.) Working at home (USA) or abroad would both work for me (though I'm hoping the languages I speak could define my career geographically speaking.) Program wise, there are two universities I'm looking at, Webster University for IR vs University of York for an MPA with an emphasis on International Development. An MA in IR sounds incredibly interesting, but looking at the course requirements I feel like I'd graduate and have no actual skills to provide a company/NGO. Because of this, the MPA seems like the smartest route, but would it being from the UK hurt or help me? I'm aware of how difficult it is to break into a field like this and I'm alright with sending off job apps for some long months. For someone who is trilingual, has administrative skills, isn't primarily concerned with money, and just wants to help people, it shouldn't be impossible to get a job, right?

Let me know if this post would be more appropriate in a different forum. I'm just looking for some advice. I'm a first gen student, so my family isn't able to offer much in the way of advice. 

 

tt;dr - MPA-ID vs MA IR for a guy who wants to break into the NGO field and help educate those in need?

[went_away]

You're aiming too low. It's not that hard to get into a good International Relations program, and if you show a little more self-esteem (haha) in your application, plus good execution - that along with your Mandarin/French skills (fantastic language combination) should make you a competitive candidate for admissions to any top IR program. Name-brand NGOs are very prestigious gigs and tend to take their interns from the name-brand schools, so keep that in mind. 

You're probably right that an MPA will lend you more marketable skills than International Relations/Affairs degree, but I would counsel you to simply do the program that is most interesting to you. The good IR programs will set you up to be competitive for interesting internships that should, fingers crossed, lead to full-time employment in the field. 

While I disagree with the methodology of this ranking, it's pretty much spot on in terms of the master's programs you should be looking at. Check it out - http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/02/03/top-twenty-five-schools-international-relations/.  Every school on the list is high quality. The top schools you should probably focus on are SIPA (by the way, the MPA and IR programs there are nearly identical), SAIS, Fletcher, and Georgetown MSFS. Fletcher is extremely strong in the NGO world and probably a good fit for you. If you have high test scores and ambition, look at Kennedy, Princeton Woodrow Wilson, and Yale Jackson. NYU is also good, if expensive and a little less prestigious, and Texas A&M and Pittsburgh are great below-the-radar schools for career outcomes, and may be very cost-effective schools as well - a factor that - very appropriately - seems to be important to you.  

[TruFranco]

I guess it is possible I could be overestimating the elitism of some universities. The reason for my lack of academic confidence is a 3.15 GPA due to a couple Fs my freshman and sophomore year, ironically in Chinese 1 and French phonology (went back and took the courses again as a senior and aced them.) Beyond these two, I was a really average student in everything outside of French (3.92). Knowing that, would you still recommend me applying to those big name universities? Does name really make that big of a difference when trying to get into this kind of work? I always kind of assumed the names helped get into those high level DoS or FS positions. 

 

As for ambition, if I could to be convinced that I had a shot for those schools then there'd be an abundance of it. I pale in comparison to my wife's 3.98 GPA and our unIversity 4.0 friends, so it's been beaten down a bit. Test scores are currently nonexistent. A GRE in China, while not impossible, is a pain in the ass, so the programs I mentioned don't require them. Are any of your recommended programs online? I'm getting close to C1 level proficiency for mandarin and am hoping that by staying here I could get C2 in a couple years while pursuing the MA (hopefully not losing my C1 French in the process.) 

 

Also, mildly unrelated to my original question, but you said French and Mandarin are a good language combo. What kind of position would be able to use this particular language combination.

 

Thanks for all the help. 

[Ben414]

It seems to me that MPP/MPA programs are more difficult to get into in general (although Yale's Jackson looks to be an exception), so IR might be the best choice both in terms of job outcomes and admission chances. I think went_away is underselling MPP/MPA admissions in terms of the relevant work experience of the average matriculant, but you can look at the admissions results posts to see how people with similar profiles fared. A lot of people with good profiles have been turned down at WWS, HKS, and Yale. I don't know as much about what IR schools are looking for, but it doesn't seem that SAIS, SIPA, Fletcher, Georgetown are nearly as tough to get into as Princeton, Harvard, and Yale.

Even though money isn't important to you, I would consider the results of taking out a six-figure debt if you don't receive funding. It may prevent you from being able to take a low-paying job you like, and you should look into what loan repayment assistance plans are available.

Edited October 23, 2015 by Ben414

[ajak568]

The 3.15 GPA may ding you a bit, but I think you may still stand a shot at getting into a solid program, especially if you mention in your application that you went back and retook those courses that you did poorly in your freshman year and point out that you've done a ton of good since then! Definitely give yourself a lot more credit for the language proficiency and international experience. Mandarin and French (and English, obviously) is a killer combo if you want to go into something related to Chinese foreign investment in Sub-Saharan Africa. I might give my pinky toe to have your language skills, because I'd like to make a professional career going into that direction!

As far as big name schools getting you into DoS/FS--nope. At DoS, nobody really cares where you went to school, they just care how well you do your job. You don't necessarily need a grad degree to work for State, but a solid policy program can definitely teach you some skills that may make you more competitive for FS. With your experiences, if you have interest in going into FS and are willing to take on the lifestyle that comes with it, I might look into that.

As far as NGOs, I agree with went_away in that NGOs might be more likely to put weight on a name-brand institution on your resume, so that may be something to keep in mind if you're looking to go that route.

To add to the discussion above, MPP/MPA degrees are very different from IR degrees (as someone mentioned), which seems like it would be obvious, but I don't think that people understand that sometimes (even people in the degree programs!), so give that some thought when thinking about which programs to apply to. MPP/MPA programs may be a little tougher to get into, but there are still some good ones that aren't crazy competitive to get into. Policy programs just tend to care a little more about your quant background.

Also wanna double down on what Ben414 said about funding. It matters!

Best of luck!

[TruFranco]

Perhaps I should rephrase a bit. The cost of a program isn't incredibly important to me because the program I choose will, in all likelihood, be completed online. Because it's online I will be able to continue earning a salary here in China and thus be able to pay for it all up front. A six figure masters degree isn't worth it to me. I'm aware of far too many countries with free tuition for international students to be able to justify something as egregious as that (no offense intended for those who are paying for a degree on that level, it's just not for me.) Unfortunately though, the online programs I've seen don't offer funding.

For the universities I mentioned (Webster and U of York), are they really that low on the totem pole? I wouldn't really be that surprised if Webster were, as their admission requirement for all grad programs is only a 3.0 undergrad GPA. But from what rankings I've been able to find, University of York does pretty well inside the UK. I've been seeing top 10, top 15 rankings.  Most of the world's top name schools obviously are in the USA, but I would think a bit of a melange in academic culture may carry some weight as well. What do you think?

For ajak568 -  Comparing the course requirements, they're definitely quite different. I'd be lying if I said the MPA courses (outside of the ID emphasis) sound more interesting than IR, but being able to provide some administrative skills would go a long way towards employment. The MPA program I'm looking has an emphasis in International development, which should help distinguish me from the MPAs seeking work domestically.This may come across poorly to some of you, but I'm not looking to become an expert on IR issues or study under the most brilliant of professors. Being knowledgeable is a requirement, absolutely, but self study can go a long way. What I'm really looking to become an effective and reliable tool for an organization. 

[went_away]

It seems to me that MPP/MPA programs are more difficult to get into in general (although Yale's Jackson looks to be an exception), so IR might be the best choice both in terms of job outcomes and admission chances. I think went_away is underselling MPP/MPA admissions in terms of the relevant work experience of the average matriculant, but you can look at the admissions results posts to see how people with similar profiles fared. A lot of people with good profiles have been turned down at WWS, HKS, and Yale. I don't know as much about what IR schools are looking for, but it doesn't seem that SAIS, SIPA, Fletcher, Georgetown are nearly as tough to get into as Princeton, Harvard, and Yale.

Even though money isn't important to you, I would consider the results of taking out a six-figure debt if you don't receive funding. It may prevent you from being able to take a low-paying job you like, and you should look into what loan repayment assistance plans are available.

Ben, where did I undersell necessary work experience for MPA applicants? I said that the OP was underselling himself and that gaining admission to public service grad programs is much easier than he had made it out to be. I have no clue where you're getting your data on MPA programs having more competitive admissions than IR programs. And as I clearly stated - Princeton and HKS are among the most competitive programs in this space and only the more ambitious/successful applicants gain admission. I do agree with your point on $$ and debt - a point I constantly make on here is that grads of elite public service oriented programs make very little money commensurate with the cost of the education. 

The 3.15 GPA may ding you a bit, but I think you may still stand a shot at getting into a solid program, especially if you mention in your application that you went back and retook those courses that you did poorly in your freshman year and point out that you've done a ton of good since then! Definitely give yourself a lot more credit for the language proficiency and international experience. Mandarin and French (and English, obviously) is a killer combo if you want to go into something related to Chinese foreign investment in Sub-Saharan Africa. I might give my pinky toe to have your language skills, because I'd like to make a professional career going into that direction!

As far as big name schools getting you into DoS/FS--nope. At DoS, nobody really cares where you went to school, they just care how well you do your job. You don't necessarily need a grad degree to work for State, but a solid policy program can definitely teach you some skills that may make you more competitive for FS. With your experiences, if you have interest in going into FS and are willing to take on the lifestyle that comes with it, I might look into that.

As far as NGOs, I agree with went_away in that NGOs might be more likely to put weight on a name-brand institution on your resume, so that may be something to keep in mind if you're looking to go that route.

To add to the discussion above, MPP/MPA degrees are very different from IR degrees (as someone mentioned), which seems like it would be obvious, but I don't think that people understand that sometimes (even people in the degree programs!), so give that some thought when thinking about which programs to apply to. MPP/MPA programs may be a little tougher to get into, but there are still some good ones that aren't crazy competitive to get into. Policy programs just tend to care a little more about your quant background.

Also wanna double down on what Ben414 said about funding. It matters!

Best of luck!

A couple of nit-picks here. First - I fully agree with the remarks on language, and hadn't even considered the China investment in East Africa angle. Regarding DoS and name-brand schools - I think this is one of those urban myths out there that State hires based on performance/test scores and that pedigree doesn't matter. Couldn't be more mistaken! In fact, DoS is likely one of the government agencies most highly attuned to pedigree. Take a look at feeder schools on the State Department LinkedIn page or look at pages of specific schools to see where grads go. Apart from a few local schools (the George Masons and UMD types and GWU to some extent), you'll see an extreme preponderance of schools from the top echelons of foreign affairs, places like Georgetown, Fletcher, SAIS, Harvard Kennedy, SIPA, and Princeton. This myth comes about because the Foreign Service selection process supposedly considers all candidates equally without regard to background. However the FS makes up only a tiny portion of the Department. In addition, as of a couple years ago, Georgetown SFS alone sent more candidates to the FS than the next three schools combined; also, the Department's fellowship and diversity programs that send hires directly to the FS recruit nearly exclusively from top-tier foreign affairs grad schools. Finally, the selection process for the FS has changed in the last several years, and the Department no longer exclusively judges candidates based on oral/written test scores, but also assess them holistically, looking at past professional and educational experiences.

I do agree that MPA programs are usually very different from IR programs, but that still depends on the program in question. For example, as I pointed out above, Columbia SIPA's MPA and MIA programs are identical with the exception of one course and the differentiation is there exclusively so students can brand themselves professionally in the way they would like. 

Perhaps I should rephrase a bit. The cost of a program isn't incredibly important to me because the program I choose will, in all likelihood, be completed online. Because it's online I will be able to continue earning a salary here in China and thus be able to pay for it all up front. A six figure masters degree isn't worth it to me. I'm aware of far too many countries with free tuition for international students to be able to justify something as egregious as that (no offense intended for those who are paying for a degree on that level, it's just not for me.) Unfortunately though, the online programs I've seen don't offer funding.

For the universities I mentioned (Webster and U of York), are they really that low on the totem pole? I wouldn't really be that surprised if Webster were, as their admission requirement for all grad programs is only a 3.0 undergrad GPA. But from what rankings I've been able to find, University of York does pretty well inside the UK. I've been seeing top 10, top 15 rankings.  Most of the world's top name schools obviously are in the USA, but I would think a bit of a melange in academic culture may carry some weight as well. What do you think?

For ajak568 -  Comparing the course requirements, they're definitely quite different. I'd be lying if I said the MPA courses (outside of the ID emphasis) sound more interesting than IR, but being able to provide some administrative skills would go a long way towards employment. The MPA program I'm looking has an emphasis in International development, which should help distinguish me from the MPAs seeking work domestically.This may come across poorly to some of you, but I'm not looking to become an expert on IR issues or study under the most brilliant of professors. Being knowledgeable is a requirement, absolutely, but self study can go a long way. What I'm really looking to become an effective and reliable tool for an organization. 

I don't know anything about University of York. Webster has a reputation as a school for government/military professionals who just need to check the master's degree box and are in no way looking to use the degree to obtain a job. I would strongly recommend you not go to either of those schools (ditto for any online degree) with the expectation it will help you gain a position at an elite NGO. In terms of rankings, I think I was quite clear in my earlier post and included a link to the world's most comprehensive IR schools rankings system. LSE, SOAS, IHEID, and Sciences Po are all top-tier institutions in Europe and that have both strengths and weaknesses that have been extensively discussed elsewhere on this board. To be brutally honest, it sounds like you really need to buckle down and 'do your homework' in terms of really researching the programs that are interesting to you and determining if they contain the content and pull to enable you to achieve your professional goals. 

[Ben414]

Ben, where did I undersell necessary work experience for MPA applicants? I said that the OP was underselling himself and that gaining admission to public service grad programs is much easier than he had made it out to be. I have no clue where you're getting your data on MPA programs having more competitive admissions than IR programs. And as I clearly stated - Princeton and HKS are among the most competitive programs in this space and only the more ambitious/successful applicants gain admission. I do agree with your point on $$ and debt - a point I constantly make on here is that grads of elite public service oriented programs make very little money commensurate with the cost of the education.

I think you undersold it when you said:

... if you show a little more self-esteem (haha) in your application, plus good execution - that along with your Mandarin/French skills (fantastic language combination) should make you a competitive candidate for admissions to any top IR program.

You explicitly stated he can make it into any IR program he wants.  We do not know enough about his profile to say that conclusively, and (based on the info he gave us) I doubt that his current profile is good enough for HKS or WWS or Yale Jackson.  I like that you are telling him he should aim higher, but it's not helpful to say he can get into any IR program because he knows Mandarin and French.

For reference, here's the profile of someone who got rejected by HKS last year: 3.5 GPA in Political Economy from Berkeley, 167 V/163 Q/5.5 AW, 1.5 yr of consulting and 2 yr at a think-tank, he had taken stats, calculus, intermediate micro and macroeconomics, he knows Mandarin and basic Spanish.

I think it's most helpful to acknowledge that MPP/MPA/IR programs aren't as difficult as some other degrees and he should aim higher, but we shouldn't be telling an applicant with a low GPA, no GRE to use as reference, and non-great work experience that he can pick whichever program he wants. The best way for OP to estimate his chances is to look through here: http://forum.thegradcafe.com/topic/53232-government-affairs-2014-wrap-up-final-decisions/ That link provides links to prior years as well so he can look at a larger sample size.

Edited October 25, 2015 by Ben414

[went_away]

Ben,

You write - 'You explicitly stated he can make it into any IR program he wants.' I said nothing of the sort, as my quote below clearly shows. I said good execution (ie good test scores and essays) along with what we know about him should make him COMPETITIVE for any top program, not that he could make it into or get into any program. Please read my words more carefully. Here they are again. 

You're aiming too low. It's not that hard to get into a good International Relations program, and if you show a little more self-esteem (haha) in your application, plus good execution - that along with your Mandarin/French skills (fantastic language combination) should make you a competitive candidate for admissions to any top IR program. Name-brand NGOs are very prestigious gigs and tend to take their interns from the name-brand schools, so keep that in mind. 

In addition, I also explicitly stated that only those with high test scores and great professional experience make it into Princeton/Harvard/Yale. Read my quote again, noticing that:

The top schools you should probably focus on are SIPA (by the way, the MPA and IR programs there are nearly identical), SAIS, Fletcher, and Georgetown MSFS. Fletcher is extremely strong in the NGO world and probably a good fit for you. If you have high test scores and ambition, look at Kennedy, Princeton Woodrow Wilson, and Yale Jackson. NYU is also good, if expensive and a little less prestigious, and Texas A&M and Pittsburgh are great below-the-radar schools for career outcomes, and may be very cost-effective schools as well - a factor that - very appropriately - seems to be important to you.  

Finally, I specifically guided him toward SAIS/SIPA/Fletcher/MSFS as the programs he should be targeting, and as well at Texas and Pittsburgh as less competitive programs that are still good for career outcomes. Again, I did not say that he or anyone 'can make it into any IR program he wants' (your quote, not mine).  

One last point - I'm not necessarily surprised that the example you gave failed to gain admissions to Kennedy (lowish GPA and no compelling leadership experience from that bit of info), however that individual was certainly competitive for any top program, but certainly not guaranteed anything. 

Edited October 25, 2015 by went_away

[Ben414]

Ben,

You write - 'You explicitly stated he can make it into any IR program he wants.' I said nothing of the sort, as my quote below clearly shows. I said good execution (ie good test scores and essays) along with what we know about him should make him COMPETITIVE for any top program, not that he could make it into or get into any program. Please read my words more carefully. Here they are again. 

In addition, I also explicitly stated that only those with high test scores and great professional experience make it into Princeton/Harvard/Yale. Read my quote again, noticing that:

Finally, I specifically guided him toward SAIS/SIPA/Fletcher/MSFS as the programs he should be targeting, and as well at Texas and Pittsburgh as less competitive programs that are still good for career outcomes. Again, I did not say that he or anyone 'can make it into any IR program he wants' (your quote, not mine).  

One last point - I'm not necessarily surprised that the example you gave failed to gain admissions to Kennedy (lowish GPA and no compelling leadership experience from that bit of info), however that individual was certainly competitive for any top program, but certainly not guaranteed anything. 

I'm not going to argue semantics with you.  "Competitive" to me means not just any chance, but a chance that has a high enough probability as to not be unexpected.  Maybe 33% or higher if I was forced to come up with a hard cutoff.  I don't think he's reached that plateau with his current profile, and I still think your wording would be commonly interpreted as saying as much.  But, as I said, I'm not going to argue semantics with you, so we can just agree to disagree about how the wording would be normally interpreted.  The important thing for the OP is that we agree he should be aiming higher.

[ajak568]

I like the different opinions for some thread. Sheds some light on the debate surrounding the best path to getting into good policy schools/getting cool policy jobs.

Ben, where did I undersell necessary work experience for MPA applicants? I said that the OP was underselling himself and that gaining admission to public service grad programs is much easier than he had made it out to be. I have no clue where you're getting your data on MPA programs having more competitive admissions than IR programs. And as I clearly stated - Princeton and HKS are among the most competitive programs in this space and only the more ambitious/successful applicants gain admission. I do agree with your point on $$ and debt - a point I constantly make on here is that grads of elite public service oriented programs make very little money commensurate with the cost of the education. 

A couple of nit-picks here. First - I fully agree with the remarks on language, and hadn't even considered the China investment in East Africa angle. Regarding DoS and name-brand schools - I think this is one of those urban myths out there that State hires based on performance/test scores and that pedigree doesn't matter. Couldn't be more mistaken! In fact, DoS is likely one of the government agencies most highly attuned to pedigree. Take a look at feeder schools on the State Department LinkedIn page or look at pages of specific schools to see where grads go. Apart from a few local schools (the George Masons and UMD types and GWU to some extent), you'll see an extreme preponderance of schools from the top echelons of foreign affairs, places like Georgetown, Fletcher, SAIS, Harvard Kennedy, SIPA, and Princeton. This myth comes about because the Foreign Service selection process supposedly considers all candidates equally without regard to background. However the FS makes up only a tiny portion of the Department. In addition, as of a couple years ago, Georgetown SFS alone sent more candidates to the FS than the next three schools combined; also, the Department's fellowship and diversity programs that send hires directly to the FS recruit nearly exclusively from top-tier foreign affairs grad schools. Finally, the selection process for the FS has changed in the last several years, and the Department no longer exclusively judges candidates based on oral/written test scores, but also assess them holistically, looking at past professional and educational experiences.

I do agree that MPA programs are usually very different from IR programs, but that still depends on the program in question. For example, as I pointed out above, Columbia SIPA's MPA and MIA programs are identical with the exception of one course and the differentiation is there exclusively so students can brand themselves professionally in the way they would like. 

I don't know anything about University of York. Webster has a reputation as a school for government/military professionals who just need to check the master's degree box and are in no way looking to use the degree to obtain a job. I would strongly recommend you not go to either of those schools (ditto for any online degree) with the expectation it will help you gain a position at an elite NGO. In terms of rankings, I think I was quite clear in my earlier post and included a link to the world's most comprehensive IR schools rankings system. LSE, SOAS, IHEID, and Sciences Po are all top-tier institutions in Europe and that have both strengths and weaknesses that have been extensively discussed elsewhere on this board. To be brutally honest, it sounds like you really need to buckle down and 'do your homework' in terms of really researching the programs that are interesting to you and determining if they contain the content and pull to enable you to achieve your professional goals. 

I'm going to continue to disagree about the DoS recruitment point. It may be true that a number of DoS employees come from big name institutions, but that seems to be more due to correlation than causation. Capable policy professionals who get into good schools are also likely to be solid candidates for State and succeed in the application process, but the name on their degree is not what gets them in to the door. A demonstration of good skills and relevant experience help more than anything, regardless of where your graduate degree came from. As far as the diversity recruitment tools (I assume you're referring to Pickering and Rangel Fellowships?) those candidates are chosen before they've committed to a graduate institution (often before they're even admitted anywhere), and candidates come from a variety of undergraduate institutions (state schools, Ivys, HBCUs, liberal arts, etc.). It may be true that a lot of them end up going to big name policy schools, but fellows aren't chosen based on where they attend school. It's a correlation thing, not causation. (i.e.: Strong candidates who do well in the fellowship app process may tend to do well in the grad school app process as well.) State markets themselves to a lot of policy schools, but I don't think there's any mechanism by which it intentionally selects candidates from any certain school. 

Of course, if you're trying to get into State as a political appointee, throw everything I said out of the window because that's a whole different ball game that I know nothing about.

I guess what I'm trying to get across is that yes, where you go to school may matter in that it may help prepare you to be a competitive on the job market, but the name alone is definitely not worth paying for if you're looking to go into government service. That logic holds true for policy careers in general, I think, though (as I mentioned before) I think going to a big name school may matter more for those looking to go the NGO route. A well connected school may help you get your foot in the door for some places.

But that's just my two cents! Feel free to disagree.

[ajak568]

Oh, and that's a good point about MPA v. MPP v. MIA programs. There's not a whole lot of consistency in the policy world about how degrees are named, so it's important to really look at the curriculum of a program to figure out whether your course of study will involve more policy analysis or more political theory, more policy memos or thesis papers, etc.

If it's a policy analysis program, they'll definitely care more about the quant. Public Administration and International Affairs degree may place less emphasis on that particular part of your app, but of course, it depends on the program!

[FredMims]

I worked for DOS before on a temporary appointment and have worked with many DOS FSOs and civil servants, On the topic of FS hiring, went_away is completely correct when he says it is one of the government agencies most highly attuned to pedigree. In fact, I agree with everything went_away has written based on my experience working in the DC area. Capable policy applicants who go to schools outside the beltway have a much lower chance. That's just the reality. The article in the link below has the chart of feeder schools and it is not just crazy, wacky coincidence that so many Georgetown, GWU (a few blocks from DOS), American, etc. graduates working in DOS just happen to hire so many other graduates from the same universities. While you might call it corruption in another country, here it's called a network. If it was actually a level playing field, you would have far more FSOs from outside the DC area. I have read many hopeful posts on here from people who haven't worked in the DC area claiming "university doesn't matter for govt jobs" and things like that but graduates from DC area schools often help out those from their schools.

https://newsdesk.gmu.edu/2015/02/mason-ranks-seventh-country-placing-foreign-service-officers/

[went_away]

I'm not going to argue semantics with you.  "Competitive" to me means not just any chance, but a chance that has a high enough probability as to not be unexpected.  Maybe 33% or higher if I was forced to come up with a hard cutoff.  I don't think he's reached that plateau with his current profile, and I still think your wording would be commonly interpreted as saying as much.  But, as I said, I'm not going to argue semantics with you, so we can just agree to disagree about how the wording would be normally interpreted.  The important thing for the OP is that we agree he should be aiming higher.

Fair points. I'm not keen to get into a close reading exercise either. 

Also, having read the additional entries from the OP I would increasingly lean toward your assessment of his chances at the top schools (though he doesn't seem particularly interested in the top-tier programs; anyway it's a good discussion for others) while continuing to agree that he should set his sights higher. 

Edited October 26, 2015 by went_away