program advice

[aartsy5050]

Hey guys, 

The programs I am thinking of are listed in the top 20 from this list of rankings I was given. Is that good? Thanks!

1 Princeton

2 Columbia

3 Harvard

4 Yale

5 Cal Berkeley

6 Chicago

7 NYU

8 MIT

9 UCLA

10 Northwestern

11 Penn

12 North Carolina

13 Michigan

14 Duke

15 Wisconsin

16 Johns Hopkins

17 Texas

18 Bryn Mawr

19 Delaware

20 Stanford

21 USC

22 CUNY

23 Brown

24 WashU (St. Louis)

25 Pittsburgh

26 Illinois

27 Penn State

28 Minnesota

29 UCSD

30 Emory

31 Stony Brook

32 Cal Santa Barbara

33 Maryland

34 Cornell

35 Indiana

36 Boston University

37 Rutgers

38 Kansas

39 Ohio State

40 Temple

41 Virginia

42 Washington

43 Florida State

44 Case Western

45 Georgia

46 U of Florida

47 U Iowa

48 U Illinois at Chicago

49 UCSC

50 New Mexico

51 SUNY Binghamton

52 Virginia Commonwealth

53 U Louisville

54 Missouri

55 UCR

56 U Arizona

57 ASU

[random_grad]

what's ASU?

[brown_eyed_girl]

1 hour ago, random_grad said:

what's ASU?

I assume ASU = Arizona State. 

Aartsy, what is your question exactly? In general, yes, the top 20 programs listed here are well-respected, but whether they are the best places for you to apply/attend really depends on your subfield and other factors. For example, in some fields CUNY (ranked 22 here) or Brown (#23) might be significantly stronger than UCLA (#9) or Wisconsin (#15). The top 7 or 8 on this list look fairly hard to dispute to me, while some others seem surprising (for example, I'd rank Stanford above North Carolina, but again I'm sure it depends on field). 

Edited December 2, 2015 by brown_eyed_girl

[theartman1193]

I totally second brown eyed girl. CUNY has some top notch scholars in 20th century. I also would look into departmental methodologies. Some departments are quite intense with their practice of social art history while others are quite indebted to psychoanalysis. Sorry to bring up a cliche, though many of these rankings promote comparing apples to oranges. Each scholar and each department have different things to offer. I would urge you to pick a position that puts you in a decent funding position and a helpful advisor.

[Joan Callamezzo]

Where did you get this list? I don't think its accurate at all. I don't think a single Art History faculty member would say that Princeton is the top program. I'm not even sure if Princeton would say they are the top program (they are having a LOT of problems lately). The top ten is right more or less, but I would disagree on the order. I also think Penn and especially Stanford should be much higher, and Wisconsin much lower. WashU has great placement, but its such a different sort of program that I'm not even sure you can rank it with traditional AH depts. 

Long story short - it's weird list. I wouldn't let this have any sort of real bearing on how you make your program choices. 

[aartsy5050]

Thanks so much! The list was given to me by my department. Programs in the top 20 here seem to have larger departments. But I can see how difficult it is to rank them. I am interested in queer theory in modern art, so a place like CUNY, Wisconsin, or a Rochester even could be a stronger choice for me than a place like Northwestern or UCLA.

[betsy303]

Also, for what its worth the ranking game is ridiculous. It doesn't really take into account student outcomes, funding situations, and satisfaction. This list seems more comparable to the one US News came out in 2013 for history programs. Also, one should look at related departments for a potential doctoral minor. A place like UW-Madison has the Nelson Institute and a killer history program. This could be helpful for someone interested in performing historical analysis. Even smaller department like WashU have some really fascinating folks working at them as well...its a shame it comes down to these ranking politics. One program's strength is another weakness.

 

Stay nice kids. 

[betsy303]

I've been thinking about this as I have been continually (and silently) reading other threads. I wanted to REINFORCE that I currently attend a 10-20 program and have seen many of colleagues go on to pursue wonderful things (without being too particular, tenure track jobs at eminent liberal arts college and some pretty great "big city" curatorial gigs). Every SINGLE one of my colleagues has gone on to pursue a fabulous job over the last decade or so. I did not get a MA along the way. Roughly, 50% of my colleagues did (many from the Cortauld). I am so glad I didn't go as I found many of my colleagues repeating course level work that they did as part of the MA. But again, it works for some and for others it does not. Its about what works for you. The top ten "elite" comes with assumption of working at a  high power research institutions. Not everyone wants that kind of job. Many people really enjoy working at liberal arts colleges, smaller museums, galleries, and community colleges. Its disappointing how many people look down on jobs that are very much needed, but tis is life. Also for what it is worth, it is most definitely true that there are more top 10 program folks floating around then the next "batches" of programs. However, this assumption doesn't distinguish between programs that currently have 100+ PhD students enrolled verses those with 20-30, or less. Job placements don't lie.

 

I hope this helps assuage many fears and best of luck to all! It works out! I promise!

[future art grad]

On 12/2/2015 at 9:47 AM, Joan Callamezzo said:

Where did you get this list? I don't think its accurate at all. I don't think a single Art History faculty member would say that Princeton is the top program. I'm not even sure if Princeton would say they are the top program (they are having a LOT of problems lately). The top ten is right more or less, but I would disagree on the order. I also think Penn and especially Stanford should be much higher, and Wisconsin much lower. MIT has great placement, but its such a different sort of program that I'm not even sure you can rank it with tradition AH depts. 

Long story short - it's weird list. I wouldn't let this have any sort of real bearing on how you make your program choices. 

What sort of problems does Princeton have?  I've just been admitted and am trying to get more info