Chances for international applicants

[Dith Vader]

So, apparently, being an international applicant may work against me because funding is more difficult to come by (?) or the school gets more funding for local students or there's limited funding for foreign students. I've also heard that enrolling more international student costs more because of all the facilities and extra help that they might require. Is there any other disadvantages to being foreign that anyone can think of? Is there a difference between private and public universities in this case? What about Master's as opposed to funded PhD?

On the plus side, international students add more cultural diversity to the campus --but economically speaking, I don't think it gives anything to the university except for more international applicants? I'm unclear about this. I know it's seen as favorable to have a culturally diverse student body, but what sort of advantage is it, really? Unless the program is something akin to history, sociology or anthropology, I can't see why having international students would be worth the trouble (I'm an international applicant here so I'm playing the devil's advocate). However, I went to Australia for my undergrad and they have a different system there. Local students study with funding from the government whereas international students pay the full fee, which is almost twice the amount that locals pay. Since funding from the government tends to take a long time to trickle down, universities there actually like admitting international students.

What's the system like in the U.S.? What's the funding like for international students --or is there any at all from the government? What are the real costs and advantages for universities admitting foreign students?

I've been browsing the forums to find a similar topic, but I haven't found any conclusive info on it. If anyone's on the admission board of any uni, your input will be much appreciated --not that I'm not interested in hearing what everyone has to say about it!

Thanks in advance!!

[katalytik]

unfortunately funding pretty much is nonexistent for international students because much of the funding given to grad students in the US is by the government

[papercuts]

unfortunately funding pretty much is nonexistent for international students because much of the funding given to grad students in the US is by the government

This is quite a strong statement. I wouldn't say it's nonexistent at all. For scholarships that might be the case but fellowships and assistantships are a common way to fund graduate school and I don't think it's nonexistent in there. Maybe it's just my wishful thinking but actually a lot of international students make it to the US. I have at least 10 friends from around the world who study there which I know isn't a great statistic, but it was like for every 2 people that applied 1 got in or something. Universities sure do want to earn money (or I mean not lose money) but they also want to attract bright young minds from abroad and make them stay there too. So you need a good research but katalytik's post sounded like "don't waster your time", which isn't true.

Master's on the other hand is a different story. Master's funding is almost nonexistent for everyone unless it's a rich private school.

[Deleted]

Doesn't it also depend on the field in which you are applying? For instance if you do a quick tour through the list of PhD candidates in Engineering and related fields of several schools, you will see that roughly 75% are international. Maybe there are more research opportunties and thus RAs available for the people in Eng?

[Dith Vader]

I'm applying to journalism school, and the programs I chose lean towards being practical instead of theoretical, which is also why I wonder if they actually need the student body to be that culturally diverse.

In a sense, however, it's good news for me if universities don't rely on government funding. It means higher fees and more debt for me in the future, but it also means that my chances of getting in isn't limited by funding --imagine, if the universities receive funding for, say, 10 international students per year, then I have to be within that top ten, but if not then the limit isn't set in stone.

ORmalv sounds right though, I know so many people from my country who are doing Engineering/Science-related graduate studies in the US right now.

Right now I'm not so worried about the amount of money I have to pay for graduate studies (I'll worry about that after I get an offer...), I'm just concerned about whether being an international applicant will make it more difficult for me to get accepted or if they'll judge me the same as they do local students. I really hope it's the latter ):

[katalytik]

yes papercuts agreed. it was a strong statement mainly because i am in biology/medicine field where a very large percentage of funding is government based. so i agree that its possible but very hard on average. stellar international students often have to go to schools that are lower than their caliber because of funding issues... i did not mean to kill all hope but its very very hard in my field to have funding from a top tier school

[genotype]

I wouldn't be too discouraged. I am applying to Ph.D. programs now as a US Citizen, but was previously in a doctoral program as a foreign student. I left with an M.A. for personal, non-academic reasons, that's why I'm applying at this point. Last time, I was accepted at most of the programs I applied to. The only difficulty that I had was the fact that I could not work part time once in grad school (due to my status), and this, combined with a rather low stipend (even by grad school standards) and high cost of living area, made it hard to pay for basic expenses. I also was not eligible to take out student loans.

Edited January 19, 2010 by genotype

[dzk]

yes papercuts agreed. it was a strong statement mainly because i am in biology/medicine field where a very large percentage of funding is government based. so i agree that its possible but very hard on average. stellar international students often have to go to schools that are lower than their caliber because of funding issues... i did not mean to kill all hope but its very very hard in my field to have funding from a top tier school

This is false because many top schools do not need to rely on federal training grants/fellowships. Using your programs as an example, both Harvard and JHU can admit relatively large numbers of foreign students, because the departments have enough of a budget to be able to pay their way until they're in their thesis lab.

[katalytik]

This is false because many top schools do not need to rely on federal training grants/fellowships. Using your programs as an example, both Harvard and JHU can admit relatively large numbers of foreign students, because the departments have enough of a budget to be able to pay their way until they're in their thesis lab.

I disagree here. The funding for those programs are limited. I have directly spoken to my programs about the funding, and they immediately asked if I am an international student. Most of the funding for their graduate programs comes from federal training grants for their PhD students, not from other grants. Unless the PI is willing to bring on people for his own grant, which often they are not willing to do. So I think you have this backwards. Most funding is federal training grants, and not PI-specific grants. Had it been the other way around, I can see your point.

[dzk]

I disagree here. The funding for those programs are limited. I have directly spoken to my programs about the funding, and they immediately asked if I am an international student. Most of the funding for their graduate programs comes from federal training grants for their PhD students, not from other grants. Unless the PI is willing to bring on people for his own grant, which often they are not willing to do. So I think you have this backwards. Most funding is federal training grants, and not PI-specific grants. Had it been the other way around, I can see your point.

You misunderstand. You are right, but my point is that big top-tier programs have a greater ability to fund students with money from outside the federal sources. The international classes at schools like Harvard, Hopkins, etc. are larger by percentage than those at schools like Michigan, UW-Madison, etc.

Edited January 20, 2010 by dzk

[katalytik]

You misunderstand. You are right, but my point is that big top-tier programs have a greater ability to fund students with money from outside the federal sources. The international classes at schools like Harvard, Hopkins, etc. are larger by percentage than those at schools like Michigan, UW-Madison, etc.

Ah, I see. Yes, agreed.