[Help!] Quant. Background for MPP, MPA

[Kile]

Hello everyone, how are you?

Glad Ive found thegradcafe, am honestly a bit lost with so much information on Mpps, Mpas and Mpa-ids - I would very much appreciate "hearing" your opinion on this topic and my story.

Im starting to prepare myself to apply to a MPP or MPA-ID in HKS, Stanford or Columbia, probably in 2-3 years from now. But here's the fun, challenging thing:

Ive graduated a couple of years ago in Social Communication - Advertising/Marketing (GPA 8.5 out of 10) and, honestly, had no quantitative background from grad school. Recently, Ive moved from working with consumer good to working at a 3rd sector foundation - where I work as a project analyst, focused on implementing management courses and consultancy at education secretariats; while also managing impact evaluation of these initiatives.

I do love the job and have been exposed to a lot of economics and public policies contents - which has awaken an honest interest for these areas, and one of the reasons Im seeking a MPP or MPA.

My question: Im considering taking micro, macro, statistic, econometry and math classes to fill the quantitative gap, but how much depth is required? Is it enough to have a good GRE quant and  introductory calculus, micro and macro?

Since I still have 2-3 years to go under preparation, I will decide wether to:

 

1. Take a 2-years-Masters in Economics (tough and complex one);

2. Take independent classes (no diploma) at local University; or

2. Take a 2-years-especialization Economics course - aimed at jornalist, lawyers, where I can have introductory classes in these subjects.

 

Would very much appreciate having your opinion on my historic and this matter.

Thanks a lot in advance,

Caio

Edited March 21, 2017 by Caio Poli

[LifeOnMars]

I got into a bunch of top schools (including SIPA and HKS) with a kind of weak quant background, though I may have been helped by an unconventional an interesting background/work experience.  I studied history in undergrad, and took no math/econ whatsoever.  I scored low 160's on GRE math last fall, but I haven't taken a proper math class since high school (I'm 31 now).  Currently I'm taking junior college classes in microeconomics and statistics, which is mostly just for my own benefit (though I did inform the schools when I applied to show them that I could make the effort). I also did a bunch of self-study in economics a couple of years ago out of personal interest (reading and listening to podcasts, etc), and I learned a lot but it was totally informal and on my own time. 

 

The point is, you can still get into top schools without a stellar quant background.  They seem to focus on a lot of aspects of your application, with work experience that's somehow related to the public interest seemingly pretty important.  You certainly don't need to get a masters in economics to get into a MPP/MPA program, and I'm not sure how useful it would be to have both degrees (though I guess this depends on your goals and all that).  Get the other aspects of your application together, and choose whichever quant study program seems most interesting/feasible to you.  Showing some effort and initiative is a good idea, but tou don't need to worry so much about how it's gonna look to MPP/MPA admissions officers... there is no perfect or foolproof course of action anyway!  good luck

Edited March 21, 2017 by LifeOnMars
organization

[DogsArePeopleToo]

I got into a couple of MPP programs reputed to be quant-heavy with my GRE quant score in the 150s. I had, however, taken calculus in high school (2003-2004) and intermediate econ in college (2009-2010). I also had about seven years of professional experience in the US and overseas.

Most MPP programs only require that you take some economics and math in college. Many people with this qualification and good GRE quant scores do get into top programs. Unless you absolutely love to, there's no need to do a costly 2-year econ master's to prepare for HKS MPP (although that would give you a definite edge).

Your second option of taking independent courses in econ and math (stats and some calculus) would be fine as long as you have good grades in them.

Another option is to take a mock GRE test to see where you stand on the quant section. A five-point increase is doable with effort. People with strong work ethic and adequate time have jumped 10 points. Exceptional people have jumped 15 points from their trial score. It is possible that with a good undergrad GPA and strong GRE quant, you could get into a top school.

[mpamppquestions]

I'll probably go to CMU, but they are requiring that I take stats + pre-calc or college algebra before enrolling. In stats right now. Terrified that I won't be able to hack it with the quantitative work load is going to kill me, but we will see.

Edited March 21, 2017 by mpamppquestions

[ExponentialDecay]

A 2 year master's in economics to prepare for an MPA is definitely too much. You'll be more qualified than any MPA at the end of that.

[Obecalp]

Is your goal to be prepared for the program or to get in? 

I can't say how prepared I will be for the program, and I didn't apply to Stanford or Columbia, but I got into HKS and I haven't taken a math class since I graduated high school 12 years ago. I got a 160 on the GRE quant, so it's not like I had a huge showing there either. Also, nothing in my job history is really related to quantitative work. Having to submit a quantitative resume was pretty depressing.

I guess what I'm saying is that it's not the end of the line if you don't have a quant background, as long as you have other experience that bolsters your application. 

[Kile]

Thanks a lot guys for the inputs. The ~superficial~ (i.e. introcutory quanti) 1-year especialization course in Applied Economy is looking much better after reading this..

I think that for someone who hasnt had the quant., it's really "scary" when you read something like this in their MPP/MPA brochure:

So having a couple of years to prepare myself the question has been: what do they consider enough?

3 hours ago, Obecalp said:

Is your goal to be prepared for the program or to get in? 

I can't say how prepared I will be for the program, and I didn't apply to Stanford or Columbia, but I got into HKS and I haven't taken a math class since I graduated high school 12 years ago. I got a 160 on the GRE quant, so it's not like I had a huge showing there either. Also, nothing in my job history is really related to quantitative work. Having to submit a quantitative resume was pretty depressing.

I guess what I'm saying is that it's not the end of the line if you don't have a quant background, as long as you have other experience that bolsters your application. 

That's a great question - and I find myself questioning the same. My goal is to prepare myself to get in; of course learning more about this subjects if great, but maybe Im loosing the hand with an expensive 2years Masters.

Having such a similar background (by that I mean no background), what do you think that got you into HKS?

[Ella16]

Ok Caio, so although the quant background is important it's not the most important thing. You work experience, international exposure, motivation, GPA, and GRE are all important. Having a masters in economics if the rest of your profile is only so-so won't get you in, actually nothing you do can make you an absolute shoe-in, short of winning a Nobel prize or something along those lines. You have to follow your own path and try to make your entire profile as appealing as possible. If you truly love economics and want to do a two years master regardless of whether it gets you into a top MPP, go ahead and do it. However, if you would only do one if it got you into an MPP, don't do it because there is no guarantee it will and you'll end up feeling like you wasted two years in something you don't like/won't use. 

If you feel like you don't really want to do a masters in economics, then just take a few economics/quant classes to fill the gap. Either independently or through some sort of certificate program. Lots of people fulfill the requirements by taking long-distance or community college classes, these will be enough. 

TLDR: Choose whichever path you will enjoy the most and will be most helpful to your career regardless of whether or not it will get you into an MPP. You have to make sure you are happy with your choices and your life in the present as there is no guarantee when it comes to the future. 

[Obecalp]

4 hours ago, Caio Poli said:

Thanks a lot guys for the inputs. The ~superficial~ (i.e. introcutory quanti) 1-year especialization course in Applied Economy is looking much better after reading this..

I think that for someone who hasnt had the quant., it's really "scary" when you read something like this in their MPP/MPA brochure:

So having a couple of years to prepare myself the question has been: what do they consider enough?

That's a great question - and I find myself questioning the same. My goal is to prepare myself to get in; of course learning more about this subjects if great, but maybe Im loosing the hand with an expensive 2years Masters.

Having such a similar background (by that I mean no background), what do you think that got you into HKS?

I only had a 160 Quant, but had a 170 verbal, so that was a piece of it.

I think what it came down to for me was experience. By the time I start school in the fall, I'll have 6 years of experience working in nonprofits, plus I'm on two boards for three and four years now. 

That and just finding the right way to sell myself despite the lack of Quant background. I think creating a strong narrative is extremely valuable. 

[Kile]

On 21/03/2017 at 9:06 PM, Ella16 said:

Ok Caio, so although the quant background is important it's not the most important thing. You work experience, international exposure, motivation, GPA, and GRE are all important. Having a masters in economics if the rest of your profile is only so-so won't get you in, actually nothing you do can make you an absolute shoe-in, short of winning a Nobel prize or something along those lines. You have to follow your own path and try to make your entire profile as appealing as possible. If you truly love economics and want to do a two years master regardless of whether it gets you into a top MPP, go ahead and do it. However, if you would only do one if it got you into an MPP, don't do it because there is no guarantee it will and you'll end up feeling like you wasted two years in something you don't like/won't use. 

If you feel like you don't really want to do a masters in economics, then just take a few economics/quant classes to fill the gap. Either independently or through some sort of certificate program. Lots of people fulfill the requirements by taking long-distance or community college classes, these will be enough. 

TLDR: Choose whichever path you will enjoy the most and will be most helpful to your career regardless of whether or not it will get you into an MPP. You have to make sure you are happy with your choices and your life in the present as there is no guarantee when it comes to the future. 

Thanks Ella, this is refreshing - I do agree with you. I think the pressure of making the right choices right now kind of got into me.

Anyways, you're rigth! Im rethinking this path thanks to all of your contributions..

On 22/03/2017 at 0:41 AM, Obecalp said:

I only had a 160 Quant, but had a 170 verbal, so that was a piece of it.

I think what it came down to for me was experience. By the time I start school in the fall, I'll have 6 years of experience working in nonprofits, plus I'm on two boards for three and four years now. 

That and just finding the right way to sell myself despite the lack of Quant background. I think creating a strong narrative is extremely valuable. 

Nice! That's a great way to look at it, by the time I apply I'll also have 6-7y of previous experience. Do agree with how important a good storytelling is..

Thanks Obecalp!