Neither Here Nor There
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Posts posted by Neither Here Nor There
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20 hours ago, Rose-Colored Dasein said:
It really depends on what you mean by a "continental" program. Programs that study philosophers typically categorized as "continental" are one thing. Programs that do philosophy in a "continental" mode are another thing. And it's not really clear what "continental" philosophy is in the first place.
The rankings aren't so bad if you consider what they are actually ranking: not the best programs, but, as the PGR website makes explicit in many words, faculty reputation. That these do not necessarily correlate should be fairly obvious. Consider the reputation of various philosophers in Socrates' day, as reported by Plato's writings.
Faculty reputation seems to correlate quite weakly with job placement, strongly with job placement into PhD-granting programs, and (in a circular fashion) strongly with job placement into top PGR-ranked programs.
Faculty reputation, it may be argued, also correlates these days with a certain way of doing philosophy, that which seems to be common in many philosophy journals and which is admittedly the opposite of what we feel continental philosophy is. Of course, whether there is a meaningful distinction between analytic and continental philosophy is controversial; one wonders, if the distinction is meaningless, what this bifurcation is that everyone seems to feel. I've been thinking recently that it has to do with which propositions a given philosopher chooses to leave implicit, and which terms he or she chooses to leave undefined.
Yes, continental philosophy, as in the study of European philosophy that is not Anglo-analytic, can be done in any program, and continental "modes," if by that you mean style, is certainly widespread, not necessarily that the majority use it but that its not uncommon and is found all around. However, I think it is fairly clear that a "continental school" is a program/school/department dedicated to studying continental philosophy and the history of philosophy.
But does faculty recognition correspond with a certain way of doing philosophy? I will place aside your good rebuttal that it may not, since the so-called analytic style can be adopted by continentalists aside. To add another point, it seems to me that there are a number of very famous faculty in continental departments who have highly original thought. William Desmond at Villanova and Richard Kearney at Boston College come to mind, and then of course, there is Marion at Chicago, who may be best philosopher alive right now, although he is not in the philosophy department. -
What I did was say that I was interested in how the areas overlap and had a writing sample that demostrated that I did them all. I also have a publication in a different but still related area. You can tie everything together, I'm sure. I don't know if its necessary to do that, though, and I did apply to continental programs. If you want specifics (that is, if you are continental), PM me.
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8 minutes ago, TorreAttack said:
I am also thinking about reapplying. My question is when people apply after they get their masters, do they typically apply year 2, so they can go somewhere else year 3, or do they apply year 3 so they already have their masters under their belt?
Most people I know did year 2. I did year 3. That made a big difference to my application too, since it gave me time to do a good writing sample. But if one has a good writing sample, and there are not other reasons said person wants to have a gap year, by all means apply in year 2.
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16 hours ago, incredulous_stare said:
I myself faced a decision between an MSt in phil theology at Oxford and the MA at Northern Illinois. While I think "don't go unless funded" rule is generally a good rule, I believe there are exceptions. For a number of factors I've decided to go for the MSt. DM if you wanna talk more!
Sure, a phil theology at oxford vs. a MA in philosophy is one reason to turn down a funded program. But for most people, headed into an academic field that may require living on $25,000 a year post-graduation until the unlikely academic job comes up, major debt would be a disaster. Small debt maybe one could wave. But certainly, it depends on a lot of factors. Not disagreeing with your post.
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I think there isn't' a "one size fits all" as far as what you need to do to improve your placements the next year. It would depend on too much, whether you are trying for a top 20 school, etc.
But I had terrible GREs and got 5 offers. Terrible as in I almost could have guessed every problem on the math section and had a higher score. My verbal was in the 150s. My AW was the only one good (5.5). I applied to continental programs and my GRE made no difference whatsoever. I got into 50% that I had applied.
The letter writers are hard to say. If you are still in graduate school, and you had new and better work for which they could comment (for example a master's thesis), by all means use new letter writers or ask them to update.
The writing sample is of course most important. I did a writing sample that drew from all my areas of interest; it was very hard to pull off, but it worked well for me. To me, my application was proof that at least in continental philosophy, it all comes down to letters and writing sample. My degrees were from no-name schools, so it wasn't my degrees that carried me.
EDIT: and yea, I think sometimes super good writing samples are overlooked because an idea is unpopular. That is unfortunate. On the other hand, maybe one should not apply to schools that don't have faculty really doing their kind of thing. -
9 hours ago, iunoionnis said:
Only because continental programs aren't placed on the ranking. Fordham is a great program with a strong reputation.
and why is it that continental programs aren't ranked? it's bullshit. But I guess it is somewhat of a blessing if programs arent' caught in the ranking crap. And yea, Fordham is a great placement.
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I had an A- in my AOI and got into 5 phd programs, a couple pretty top tier (I am continental philosophy, though). I had a thesis (talked about in my letters of recommendation) and writing sample that showed my abilities much more than coursework. I think grades matter, but I dont' think they are picking apart transcripts that closely. If GPA and GRE makes the cut, it all comes down to the letters and writing sample.
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MA GPA
in Philosophy
Yea as I said above, I don't think an A- hurts that much. A B+ might hurt if its not in logic. I'm not sure. My experience is that there is often one professor that does not like to give As and will give an A- to nearly everyone. That happened to me. My best term paper received an A- (from pain in the butt professor) and my worst term paper of the year (different professor) an A+. I think A's are important, but I don't think a single A- will shut a person out of graduate school.
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I don't have an idea, but in general, I agree with Needle in the Hay. The current slogan is vague. Something is always brewing could apply to every forum ever. We need something that covers the exhaustion (maybe not a good word) of graduate school
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I also have three programs that I never got an official WL from but did not get the rejection either. I assume that I'm on some kind of slime remote WL.
at any rate, I have other offers and think I would be unmoved by those. but I find it odd when they don't inform students. -
On 3/27/2018 at 10:15 PM, SlumberingTrout said:
Received an update from the DGS at Indiana University saying that 6 students will be admitted in the fall, and that I'm #9 on the wait list. He also said "if experience is any guide, that means that there is a good chance that, before April 15 has come and gone, I will be in a position to offer you admission to our program," and "please, don’t accept an offer from a program you like less than ours without checking with me about what your standing is at IU".
Curious what y'all's impression is. It strikes me as a little ... optimistic ... to say that #9 on a waitlist has a good chance of being offered admission. Surely it's uncommon for wait lists to be pulled from that deeply?
Maybe you are #9 counting the 6 admits which is reall #3 on the wait lists. maybe that is what he means. I agree that #9 on a waitlist doesn't sound optimistic to me, unless they tend to admit too many students that were also accepted to NYU or something.
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I still haven't heard from the University of Kentucky. I know they sent acceptances a while ago, but did anyone get a waitlist?
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And some of those people who got accepted to a bunch of top 20 schools also had a degree from Tufts or Princeton. Others of us came from no name universities. Just because you got one and they got ten doesn't necessarily mean that you are behind or less smart. That isn't to underplay the strengths that those who got into ten will bring to the field; I'm sure they will be very very successful. But you can be too.
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On 3/13/2018 at 4:29 AM, ThePeon said:
One big frustration I've had with the application process is the flakiness of my advisers and letter writers. They expressed a great deal of enthusiasm in helping me apply to graduate school when I initially asked, but then dragged their feet in actually giving me real feedback on my writing sample, to the point that I largely revised it alone. I don't know if this is a common experience, a function of my shyness and lack of assertiveness (and concomitant less close relationships with my professors), or a sign that they didn't really believe in me. Other people I knew had professors who were much more involved. Another applicant I know went through four or five drafts of their writing sample with multiple professors. I only managed to get feedback on my initial draft from a single professor after much prodding. I suspect this harmed me a great deal.
I got very little feedback too. I find it frustrating that professors help too much. It makes it such that everyone needs help to get the fair advantage and not all professors have time.
The reason I didnt' get too much feed back is in December they were too busy. -
MA GPA
in Philosophy
7 minutes ago, syn said:One Prof I spoke to said getting straight As can throw up a red flag, that it wasn't challenging enough. I tend to agree, and I think that may be one reason we see so many candidates drop out after the coursework is complete: these are good students, but perhaps not as good researchers, and to earn your PhD you truly need to excel at both.
That is everything wrong with admissions committees, randomly flaggin applicants for random things. I get a student with a 3.8 might be just as successful as someone with a 4.0., and you shouldn't automatically take the one with the 4.0 and not the one with the 3.8. But still, I wouldn't red flag a perfect GPA either. your letters of recommendation, SOp, and writing sample should explain the most about your ability to do research - also that you did a master's thesis says a lot bout your desire and ability to do research (as this person probably is, since he/she is doing a master's degree)
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MA GPA
in Philosophy
IT's too early to tell. You will probably pull through with an A- and not a B+. Most professors take things like participation into account before putting in final grades.
I had one A-. I don't think it hurts that much. -
7 hours ago, Rose-Colored Dasein said:
Did they really? I totally missed it. And I'm not the only one who's been watching this... We're talking about Boston College (not university), right?
are you talking about their master's program? I think BC just sent out master's acceptances ,so yes, if you applied to the master's, you could be hearing from them via postal service any day now. As far as the phd, they were sent out the first of February and 5 offers were made. Sorry if you were talking about master's; my misunderstanding.
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On 3/11/2018 at 12:59 AM, Rose-Colored Dasein said:
Congrats! Hopefully this means they'll be sending out PhD acceptances soon... Did you have any faculty members you were particularly interested in?
they already sent out phd acceptances last month. I wouldn't expect more than 2 people to get off the waitlists.
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7 hours ago, lyellgeo said:
Received phd funding at Memphis, So, right now, the decision is between them and GSU.
Anyone have thoughts on how to navigate that decision? Some things to keep in mind:
a) I'm not particularly concerned with eventually ending up at a research institution—teaching at a community college or elsewhere would be nice. If I had to move into the private sector afterwards, that's not a huge deal either. I get the sense that I'm somewhat unusual in this way with respect to other applicants, so any thoughts on it would be helpful.b ) GSU has great placement, though obviously even a good MA doesn't guarantee landing up in a ranked phd (and even a ranked phd doesn't guarantee TT placement).
c) Memphis is a close fit for my research interests
d) The phd funding is (as one would expect) much better than GSU's, which means I won't have to use my personal savings (unlike if I were to do the MA).
If you have thoughts, definitely feel free to discuss over PM or respond to this post
I would take the phd offer because phd applications are so stressful, and it is going to be hard to put them in in two years while writing a thesis and teaching. (This is why I neded up waiting an additional year and wasting a year of my life - it was too stressful to do the MA, get letters, and write and the SOP and edit the writing sample and do conference papers and work 20 hours a week all at the same time) But of course, as everyone said, it would depend on your career goals. I don't actually want to teach at a research university, so my priority is a close fit. Do what you need to do for your priorities and beware that your professors might not know what your personal priorities are.
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7 hours ago, Rose-Colored Dasein said:
But this means that BC is probably snail-mailing acceptances too...
I also remember reading that someone was just waitlisted at SLU on Thursday. Since some SLU decisions came out way before that, I think it's safe to say that they use some sort of hidden/expanded waitlist.
Man, I wish Fordham were giving you more time. I wonder why they have to decide next week (unless "waitlist" is a possibility for that decision). I can't accept or reject my Fordham offer until I hear back from BC, SLU, and 2 more MA's.
So is Fordham also using some kind of hidden waitlist, or were the waitlists on Fordham before just fake? I also haven't heard from them. And I don't know what is up with BC.
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5 minutes ago, eigenname said:
Yeah, hence, "probably" rejected. L. A. Paul did say something like that as well (she quoted the post from Leiter I quoted a few pages back so I didn't want to repost it), so I am holding out hope.
Though I probably should have dropped the mention about wait-listed people (since no wait-lists to my knowledge has been sent out) and instead focus on calling for offer holders to drop out in the right proportion so that my AOI will come into relevance.
I hope you get in!
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2 hours ago, eigenname said:
From UNC:
I am sorry that we can’t give you any more information at this time. At this point, we have made offers and constructed a waitlist, but we have not sent out rejections because we have not made final determinations about the applicant pool. As soon as our entering class is filled we will process rejections. I am sorry I can’t tell you anything more about your personal situation. I know this is a stressful period and UNC will be in touch as soon as it is possible to give you more information.
In other words, probably rejected (but she can't formally say), but if, somehow, everyone on the waitlist and all offer holders rejected their offers perhaps we'll have a chance. So, hey, non-zero probability!
Edit: Offer Holders/Waitlisted People: you know what to do!
Not the case. A professor at UNC commented on here recently that sometimes they will bring up someone not on teh waitlist and prioritize them before someone on the waitlist in order to balance their AOI. Or something like that. But I think the bottom line is right: the chances are slim but still possible.
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I see that some people solicited responses from BC and that they have snail mailed rejection letters accordingly. Oh lord. I haven't solicited a response but will assume I am rejected since I heard nothing. They need to not use snail mail.
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1 hour ago, Rose-Colored Dasein said:
Anyone heard back from Boston College yet? Still no??
No. It's very frustrating.
Hi. I'm in first year and sort of lost?
in Philosophy
Posted · Edited by Neither Here Nor There
I second this as I also was a Canadian applicant this year.
(1) As per above, Canadian phds do not get much teaching experience. Where I did my MA , most of the PhDs students were receiving no teaching courses. (Not sure if they will end up getting one before graduation or not - surely they will). At one of my PhD offers, my funding package said that I would have one course.
(2) You pay tuition all the way through your MA and PhD programs. After the funding runs out, for both MAs and PhDs, you are still incurring tuition fees. I had one fairly substantial funding package this year, but even then, it could not compete with a 6 year funding package in the States for $25,000 a year.
(3) If you get SSHRC, many of the programs won't guarantee TAships. Upfront, they may say you will get them, but then they might not prioritize you getting them along the way. And if you are wanting to save money for year 5 and 6, that will suck.
(4) Sadly, most new hires in Canada did their PhDs outside Canada. It's a hard choice: the programs in the States leave you with more than some can handle in teaching and researching, but it can pay off in terms of a CV.
That said, do whatever you need to do for the love of philosophy. If you aren't trying to land a university teaching job, Canada may be for you. Also, you can still do a MA Canada, and you may need to if landing a 15 program is your goal.
Other side things, which the post above also hinted at: Canadian phds do have a lighter load overall, for example, significantly less coursework and a much lighter TA or teaching load (6-10 hours a week of TAing verses teach 2 courses a semester or working 15-20 hours a week as a TA is a pretty big differences). That made me take the offers in Canada very very seriously. Honestly, even with the terrible job market in Canada, I would have accepted the offer on these grounds alone, if it wasn't for the incurring tuition fees the 5-6 years. I don't need the pressure to have to finish in 4 years, if that is even possible.