[Last resort MA]

I think that this might be a little bit too sensitive. For example, I applied to the MA programs I applied to as 'back-ups' because of where they are located, and the fact that my personal preference is to (ideally) attend a direct-entry PhD. I think referring to schools or programs as back-ups reflects personal preference that could be based on a host of different things including location, fit, and funding, all of which have to do with the preferences and experiences of a particular person, and are almost never meant to condemn or belittle those who consider the same programs or schools to be exactly what they want. When I say the MA programs I applied for were my back-ups, I say it because given my situation and my personal preference, they are not my first choice. That is not to say that these programs are not fantastic and amazing and anyone would be lucky to attend them, it is simply saying they were not right for me. If I were interested in staying in Canada (where there are very few direct-entry PhD programs), then they would have been my first choice, but I am not, so they were my backups. I think eoyarbidem and ahembree were coming from the same place, in that for them PhD programs were first choice, and MA programs second. Not that MA programs are terrible and unworthy and only deserving of the lowest rank on everyone's radar and consideration. Many people, and rightly so, find that MA programs are perfect for them because of the particular needs of theirs that are met (honing down research interests, gaining teaching experience, getting a taste of grad life before committing to a PhD, the list goes on), and others simply don't, and that is just fine.

Just trying to lend some perspective

For me, I always go with, "I didn't apply to a back-up; I want to go to each and every program to which I applied, for different yet similar reasons." And I say this b/c it is true, and also b/c, as I do not like to be considered a back-up candidate for any school (I want to go the one that really wants me rather than the one that kinda wants me), I now extend that same sensitivity and tact towards my prospective programs. I also try to extend that same sensitivity towards others and refrain from name-calling, etc. when I don't agree with someone.

[Last resort MA]

Yikes! I hope I didn't come off as offensive to people applying solely to MA programs. That was not at all my intention. What I neglected to mention was that I had no idea that funded MA programs even existed (as opposed to unfunded ones) until well into the application process. I in no way mean that an MA is an inferior degree. In fact, I should have found more funded MA's to begin with, as I would love the chance to refine my interests further. I guess the phrase "last resort" is really the issue. The fault lies with me for waiting though, not with MA programs being MA programs.

I definitely found the wording of the OP to be offensive: I didn't get into a PhD program, so does anyone know of an MA program that I can apply to at the last minute as a backup? I think that's pretty insulting, although I know that it wasn't meant that way; otherwise, I would have been really snarky.

In fact, I think it's best not to refer to anything [in general, even] as a backup, safety, etc., which is not only insulting but doesn't exist when you get to this level.

While many programs are streamlined and only offer PhD's, others offer an MA and PhD; it is usually the case that, if you apply to the MA program, you plan to go onto the PhD, which is why so many programs ended up streamlining. The only drawback to the MA is getting MA funding and, then, having to (re)apply (once you've received your MA) to PhD programs. Getting into to PhD programs can be difficult if you already have an MA.

[Last resort MA]

Well, as another poster stated [on a different thread] there is no backup at the grad level: if you applied to PhD programs and didn't get in, then most likely, an MA should have been your first choice rather than a last-minute backup. This is especially true for comp lit programs, which are extremely competitive.

And please remember that it is insulting to those that applied to MA's as first choices that you refer to MA's as backup degrees. In fact, most MA and PhD programs have the same deadlines and a lot of applicants apply to both so that they do not end up in such a predicament.

The only program that I know of is Kent State; they have rolling admissions for English/Comparative Literature.

[who else is still waiting on the majority of their schools?]

Just thought that I would chime in that I am still waiting to hear from six programs (out of nine); I've received two official rejections, one interview and one acceptance with funding notification. I assume that at least two of the programs are implicit rejections b/c others have posted both acceptances and waitlist notifications from them.

The day I got my acceptance, I nearly exploded with emotion: all I could think was, "OMG, no matter what, I'm actually going now."

None of the schools that I've applied to are safety schools; I want to attend each of them, for different but similar reasons.

[UNC Chapel Hill English and Comparative Literature, PhD F2012]

starlajane, how did you find out UT has sent its Comp Lit acceptances? I saw waitlists on the results board, and acceptances for English, but nothing other than waitlists for Comp Lit.

Maybe schools string along their rejects until March in case their acceptances reject them, so they can keep some kind of entering class.

[UNC Chapel Hill English and Comparative Literature, PhD F2012]

I applied to UNC Comp Lit PhD for F12 and have received no response as yet, though I too noticed the sporadic results on the board. Check out this thread on the English program there: Not sure whether the number of applicants they have admitted is only for English concentrations, and if admissions for Comp Lit concentrations are forthcoming, or if the number they admitted is the total entering cohort.

On a related note, what about UT Austin's Comp Lit waitlists? I saw 4 go up last Thursday, but no admissions or rejections. I have an application there too and haven't received any notification.

I am also waiting on UNC and UT for comp lit; both have already posted acceptances and waitlisters, so I imagine that they are done.

It seems that schools are very principled about waiting until March to send out rejections; for whatever reason, March is rejection month, and I expect to receive both of mine then (and not a day sooner, although, apparently, the schools have already made their decisions).

[French PhD Programs (Fall 2012)]

I'm visiting Berkeley later in March. I love Berkeley's program as well. I've already been in contact with my POI and she's agreed to be my mentor should I choose to go there. What worries me most about Berkeley though is that it's apart of the UC system and I'm concerned about the security of my funding throughout the program. Penn and NYU offer generous stipends that are guaranteed for 5 years, although NYC is super expensive. I'm still trying to weigh the ranking vs. fit vs. placement record question as well. The 2010 NRC rankings put both Penn and NYU above Berkeley for French and after looking at all of their placement records, I was much more impressed by Penn and NYU. Suffice it to say, a lot of my decision will depend on how I feel after having visited all three programs. The websites can only get me so far...

Well, if the funding is sketchy, and you already have acceptances at the other two places, then I really would move it to your "maybe" pile, although I have found that rankings don't mean squat; fit really is the determinging factor. Because no one wants to attend a high-ranking program for which he or she feels absolutely no affinity.

Anyway, all of this is moo (you know, it's a cow's opinion, so it doesn't matter ( until you've visited every program and been accepted by them. I think that funding and fit (not just according to program but also according to city) should be your top priority--where you think you will thrive the most--because it is very difficult to do well in a program if you hate where you live and work and are starving to boot.

[French PhD Programs (Fall 2012)]

Hey Starlajane. It depends on the type of "interview." If you've been "shortlisted," i.e. invited to visit the school and told that their final decision will be made after the visit, while that's not a guaranteed admission in theory, in practice, it tends to be. (The other type of interview that comes to mind usually occurs earlier in the application season and if you had one of those, it probably would have been over the phone or via Skype and sometimes even in person if you happened to live near the school) The extent to which shortlist interviews should be considered likely offers of admission depends on several factors. I was in this situation for Columbia's French/Comp Lit PhD program last year. I brought along some formal attire just in case but it ended up being exactly like every other (non-shortlist, i.e. acceptance) visit I had, i.e. chats with professors, grad students, group events. When you're shortlisted, they basically want to gauge some or all of the following: the level of enthusiasm for the department you show in person; the other offers you've received and the likeliness that you would accept or turn down their own offer; your fit on a more personal and collegial level. While technically they've already decided that you'd likely be a good fit academically and intellectually, in a good friend of mine's case (who's now in Princeton's French PhD program), she and another candidate with very similar interests to hers were both invited to the shortlist visit and it seemed like only one of the two of them would be admitted (which indeed ended up being the case). Of course each department has different needs; sometimes departments may seek more than one and perhaps even several students for the same literary period (in French lit this tends to happen very frequently for vingtièmistes and perhaps to a somewhat lesser extent for dix-neuvièmistes, though it can and does happen for all other periods) and indeed sometimes departments even have the funds to admit and subsequently support more than one person per period. The bottom line is: if it's your dream program or a program which you genuinely would like to have among your options, just show them that you're excited and don't reveal too much about your other offers. (Don't be completely silent about them either; basically, if you're asked by faculty or grad students where else you're considering, just calmly mention the other places but leave it at that. You may be asked where you're leaning and it's perfectly alright to say that you're not sure yet and that you're really hoping to keep an open mind and learn a lot more about each program during these visits) My feeling is that some schools prefer "shortlisting" over just admitting candidates outright because of administrative/funding-related constraints; i.e. they want to be sure to admit a realistic number of candidates (i.e. to account for the fact that some candidates will invariably be wooed by other places) but they also want to keep in mind that if, ideally, everyone were to accept, the program would have the funding to support all of them. Over-committing one year would likely lessen a department's funds for the subsequent year. Moreover, if departments have poor yields, the university administrations can and have taken away admission slots from them in subsequent years; these are all factors that seem to go into the decision to shortlist people. Does that somewhat answer your questions?

Here's some general advice for all of you: Enjoy these visits to the max! It might all seem a little intimidating, but just remember that these departments are all celebrating and courting you; you should feel really excited about it all! Finally, I can't stress enough the importance of seeking out opportunities to talk to the grad students on any visit. I mean we all try to get you excited about our respective departments but you'll find that, in general, we tend to be one of the more candid sources of information you'll find about the strengths and weaknesses of our own department. I hope that's helpful! Bon courage à vous toutes et à vous tous !

Thanks, Joey!

[French PhD Programs (Fall 2012)]

I love big cities, so I think I would be comfortable in either NYC or Philadelphia. I haven't visited Berkeley yet, but I've always seen myself as more of an east coast person. Plus I love the idea of being a train ride away from D.C., Boston, and the like. The thing about NYU is that their program is pretty much perfect for my academic interests. I got in to do the joint PhD in French literature/French studies and I'm most interested in looking at 19th (-20th) century literature, art, and culture through the perspective of political history. The joint program is about 1/2 lit and 1/2 civ and they focus almost exclusively on post-revolutionary France. Penn's program is great too, but it's more traditional, and I don't know whether that's a good or a bad thing for me. I guess I'll know better after I visit NYU...

You've really got to visit Berkeley first; it is nothing like SoCal and San Fran is right across the bridge. And I say that being a diehard New Englander myself. Berkeley itself is suburban, though, so maybe it isn't a good fit in that regard. But I would be surprised if you didn't like it.

You will definitely know after you visit NYU. The thing that concerns me about NYC is the expense, which I think will be far greater than at UPenn. Vis-a-vis your interests, I think that most programs have that kind of focus: it's never straight up lit--culture and history are woven into every program, and a lot of programs have tracks that are divided into pre- and post-rev France (at least, UVA's program is). However, if NYU's program focuses specifically on the post-rev period, then you will definitely have more classes to choose from and more profs with whom to confer specifically about your interests. OTOH, with a more traditional program, your range may be broader, which can also prove to be an asset; I've learned a lot about nineteenth century French culture by going back to seventeenth century texts and topics and that research was not even for a French class, but a comp lit course.

But that's just me. Suffice to say, you have a tough choice ahead of you. Hope the aforementioned helps.

[French PhD Programs (Fall 2012)]

I just got back from my visit with Penn last weekend and it's made my decision that much harder. I was really leaning toward NYU, but now it's all up in the air. I really liked the faculty, the grad students were awesome, and their pedagogy program is nothing short of phenomenal. I also loved Philly and since the funding for the two programs is pretty much equal, I'm thinking I would be a lot more financially comfortable than in NYC. I'm visiting NYU March 2-3. How am I supposed to choose??

I think that you will know once you visit NYU. However, have you checked out the "Decisions, Decisions" thread as well as the "Cities" thread? You might get a lot of useful advice there...

In the end, it depends on your personality. But also remember that you will have to be living in the city in which you are getting your PhD. You want to live someplace in which you are comfortable on all levels.

If it were me, I would be torn between Berkely and UPenn; Berkeley b/c I already know (and love) it, UPenn b/c I already know (and love) it. I wouldn't even consider NYU b/c I wouldn't want to live in a very urban environment (and neither would my GSD).

[French PhD Programs (Fall 2012)]

Hey! We're already starting to meet the prospective students visiting our department. It's a lot of fun reliving this whole experience albeit from "the other side." Good luck to you all during these interviews and visits. Just have a lot of fun with it all. The places that have invited you (even if it's for an "interview") really just want to court you and convince you to attend so make the most of it while it lasts! Make sure to interact with the grad students, especially, and ask them any questions you may have. We're usually pretty candid sources of information. If anyone has any questions, feel free to hit me up. Félicitations once again, everyone!

Is this really true, for all French departments? Why wouldn't they just accept a candidate that they wanted to attend?

Mind you, I am seriously hoping that you are right, b/c if I get into the school with whom I have an interview this week, I will be over the moon! Still, I'm not going to get my hopes up; I am convinced that an interview means that they can always decide that I'm a completely inept dufus who looks better on paper than in person.

[The Silence is Killing Me!]

I actually disagree with this, although I understand the emotions behind your statement. You can never let somebody else dictate who you are, ESPECIALLY not an admissions committee. You can't expect every human to recognize your unique worth right away. You must realize that the admissions process is highly stressful for professors, and it is impossible for them to make the correct decision all of the time. They are not all-knowing beings with an unlimited supply of app-reviewing patience! The fact that you were not a 'top candidate' in their current world view (heavily influenced by many outside factors) does not mean that you are not actually a top candidate. Be grateful for any opportunity you can get and then work hard to turn it into unprecedented success.

I appreciate the aim of your post. However, I cannot agree with you.

I will reiterate that I respect those establishments that recognize my potential/worth from the beginning and want a chance to cultivate it. What I don't appreciate are people and institutions who come along afterwards--after they have rejected me yet after someone else has given me a chance through which I have blossomed--to say that I have now earned their respect and a place in their program; it's arrogant, and I have loyalty to the people and institutions who initially see my potential and give me a chance versus those that don't and only want me after I have proven myself in spite of them because of the faith and belief of others. For me, it's a question of character rather than prestige.

Thus, I am not an ambitious grad student who is going to take any and all opportunuties to suckle at the hegemonic power teet and do any and everything I can to get into the most prestigious program possible; clearly, I have a different set of criteria for the kind of program that I want to be a part of. Because, sometimes, the "best" program is not always what is "best" or appropriate for a particular student, which is why it really is (or should be) all about fit.

However, by all means, have at it. I appreciate your "concern" but being who I am is precisely why one of those top programs--and all of the [what I consider] sycophantic pandering that goes along with it--are just not for me. I will always be a candidate who understands that programs need us just as much as we need them, that a healthy relationship is one of mutual respect, rather than one in which students should be humbly grateful and deferential for being even the slightest acknowledgement; really, do I sound like someone who is ever deferential?

[The Silence is Killing Me!]

is this your first go-round applying?

Really, I think you already know the answer to this: no. This is my second app season.

[The Silence is Killing Me!]

Given everything that's happened in my life and during my undergrad career, I'll be completely content if I get waitlisted and then get in, or don't get in during the first round of evaluations. As long as I get in, I'll be able to pursue my interests aggressively, and that's sufficient for me. Personally, I don't expect to be the top choice, because I know there are issues with my application. At best, I can show them that while I may not be the top choice, that my admission was still the right choice. I plan on working very hard at wherever I end up, just out of gratitude that they were willing to work with me and all my issues to help me succeed. But this is just personal opinion. I can certainly see where both of you (Starlajane and oseirus) are coming from.

Yeah, I'm definitely getting to the point where I am ready to cop an attitude with any school that waitlists me. Mind you, I wouldn't turn it down. But, just to maintain my self-respect, in the back of my mind I'm telling myself, "And now you're on my waitlist..." or "well, I don't want you if you don't want me; your loss, bozo" to any school that rejects me. If I didn't have this attitude, I would have blown my brains out a long time ago.

[0% Confidence of Acceptance]

According to Google Maps, Jack's is now a block of plywood, Piano Forte is a "Berklee Music," and Costello's liquor (who sold to my underage self multiple times) is a T-Mobile. What the F happened to that block?

That's something that I have always loved (and miss) about the Northeast: package stores that are willing to sell to minors and clubs/bars that don't care how old you are but how old you act. Those were, indeed, the days.

[The Silence is Killing Me!]

I definitely understand this sentiment, because who doesn't want to be the first choice? But just like a good relationship can come out of something with a guy/girl you weren't attracted to at first, you can still have a great experience at a school that wait-listed you. I went to my undergrad university after getting in off the waitlist, and while it hurt not to be in the first round of choices, I was just as happy to get accepted AND I received the same education as those who got in before me. Bruised ego aside, what matters is where you feel is the best fit and which school can help you pursue your career the best.

I don't think that it's an issue of ego to not like being someone's second choice. Rather, it is about having a healthy self-esteem and respecting those who respect and appreciate you. Yes, a great relationship may come out of one with someone to whom you were not initially attracted, and that's actually the person/institution that I would rather be with instead of the one that is calling b/c others whom they considered better were not available. Do I really want to be what someone settled for? No, I don't. Hence, I would much rather be at a less prestigious school that accepts me right off the bat b/c I am one of their top choices than to get in off of the waitlist of an Ivy, the same as if I would rather be with a mate who is less attractive but who thinks of me as a knockout than the hot potential mate who calls b/c his A-list wasn't available. But that's just me.

However, it's also about the point that you addressed about being treated the same as a top choice candidate once you are in. It is refreshing to hear that, at the very least, if you are accepted off of the waitlist, you are treated like an A-lister.

[The Silence is Killing Me!]

Agreed. I got rejected from only one school so far and it upset me a little, but they gotta do what they gotta do and so do I. I keep it moving and wait for the next. Thick skin is not something that justs happens, it will take some time to learn to be composed in those situations.

All I need is one school to let me in (hopefully many won't know until later this month early march) and I will show them why I am a great choice for their school up front.

Another thing, some girl was talking about how she has all these choices and feels bad because she is "taking" people's slots. She was blowing hot air out her a**. I was so upset that people like to rub their success in someones faces and try to mask it as being concerned. She is one of those "romantics" of academia. All people want me...blah blah blah. I think that is the worst part of waiting is hearing people act like they know it all when they got in somewhere. People like that make me sick.

LOL, that's so obnoxious, that would really piss me off, too

[The Silence is Killing Me!]

no Starlajane you get an offer you take it. Think about the real story behind most successes. I don't know, anything, like a rock band. I am sure a famous rock band got booed off stage the first time they played. I heard Prez Lincoln lost tons of elections before he became prez. It is the nature of reality. The true story is never as pretty as the sanitized version that they make for TV. You get an offer you take it, and having gone through all of this you will appreciate it more than if you were a shoo in.

The way that I see it, I want to be in a place that wants me and sees me as a top choice, not a backup, the same way that I want to be with someone who sees me as a dream mate rather than something that they settled for. The analogy has nothing to do with whether something is personal or business, nor does an analogy to a romantic analogy mean that I am being "romantic;" I made the analogy because the same "pecking order" is often involved.

You might excuse/accept waitlists et al. as "reality," but such things are only a reality b/c people accept them. I actually think that schools should not be able to waitlist candidates; you either accept or reject but you don't leave people hanging on, the same as you shouldn't do that in other relationships, be they personal or business.

As far as waitlists et al. go, if you want to accept a spot after being on a waitlist, that is your prerogative. However, at the moment, my top choice school is the one that contacted me first and sees me as one of their top choices rather than a backup.

[The Silence is Killing Me!]

Well, I got my second rejection today and I can tell you that, regardless of the process, not hearing anything is not a good sign; as this is my second application season, I now know that schools actively pursue applicants that they want and contact them very early, at least for my area of interest; I've already seen them actively pursuing and contacting the applicants in whom they are really interested.

I actually don't think that the process is any different from dating: if you really think that someone is a catch, you actively pursue them and make things clear from the beginning. All of this rationalizing from people sort of reminds me of the rationalizing people go through when they are dating someone who is really not that interested in them. If a school (or a member of the opposite sex) really values you, they let you know in a fast and clear manner.

Hence, even if I do get on a waitlist, or a late acceptance, knowing that I was not a top candidate doesn't exactly endear a school to me; in fact, it's actually kinda sleazy. It actually makes me not want to go to any school that treats me that way, even if it is a top choice that deigns to offer me a spot.

[0% Confidence of Acceptance]

I want to blow my brains out.

I'm right there with you. I got my second rejection today.

Keep your chin up.

[Comparative Literature Programs]

I'm doing contemporary Persian diasporic literature, based mainly in France.

Don't feel down yet! I'm not convinced that no word means definite rejection...at least not yet! have you spoken to anyone who has heard from either penn or texas? They might just be slower this year. Where else did you apply?

Yes, another poster (from the French forum) got an interview from PSU at the end of Jan., although no one seems to have heard from UT yet.

I also applied to Chapel Hill for comp lit and have yet to hear from them; I saw one acceptance from them on the results board a week ago, so I'm fairly certain that I've been rejected; it was the only PhD program to which I applied, and I highly doubt that I will be accepted there after being rejected from Indiana's MA program. Oh well.

Persian lit sounds fabulous, I am certain that you will get in somewhere.

[Comparative Literature Programs]

Mine says "in review" too blerg. What are you specializing in, starla?

Ugh, just got rejected from Indiana (comp lit). I am so depressed; I so far have one interview and two rejections, and I assume rejections from Penn State (French) and Texas (comp lit).

I'm specializing in transnational modernism, aka comparative lit from 1850-1950 of Western Europe and the Americas, specifically trauma/memory studies, gender studies/feminism, text-image studies and colonial and post-colonial studies. My languages are English, Spanish and French.

How about you?

[Comparative Literature Programs]

On 2/8/2012 at 6:46 AM, Refresh refresh said:

hey all! I'm also applying to comp lit programs for Iranian literature (also applying to near eastern studies depts). I got into UMichigan and WUSTL, but I'm waiting on UT Austin. has anyone heard anything from them? Or does anyone have any input about the comp lit programs at either umich or washu? Any advice/insight would be super helpful! Good luck to everyone!!

No, I haven't heard anything yet nor have I seen anything on the results board. I keep checking the website but it only says "In Review." I am assuming a rejection b/c they notify acceptances/waitlists early Feb., rejections late Feb., early March.

[The Silence is Killing Me!]

Very true. I know for psych (and particularly for non-clinical areas) the time frame is January and February for the most part. If you're on the top of a waiting list and get in that way you may hear from places in March as well, though you're usually informed if you're on a waiting list by the end of February/first week of March. I actually think it's pretty cruel how many applicants are already rejected but not informed for months because of this process--my current program is a particularly bad offender in this regard.

This is exactly what I was trying to say. Some people might like to hope--in spite of all evidence to the contrary--that they have gotten in b/c they still haven't heard anything. However, I have found that it is usually in vain.

And I also agree that it is very cruel to make applicants wait like that only to receive a rejection, which was why I was trying to put anyone in that position out of his/her misery. It's a lot healthier to just accept it and move on to something more productive.

[The Silence is Killing Me!]

That is not true for all people. My programs don't inform me until later this month early March.

You're absolutely right; my post didn't really apply to those who do not hear until March.

Rather, my post was intended for those who, like me, submitted apps in December and January and who "still haven't heard anything yet" but wait, with false hope. In our cases, not hearing anything usually means a rejection in March. I just hate the idea of people waiting with false hope.