Religion PhD - Results Page

[Philmajor]

Letters were mailed on Tuesday and Wednesday. I would expect that anyone who has not heard yet to hear today. I remember when I was accepted to the MA program the letter was mailed on a Thursday and arrived in Boston on Saturday.

Keep us posted and good luck. Only 18 offers to PhD candidates this year including internal candidates; no word on the Master's class.

[idanceliketaffy]

I also will not be attending HDS MTS (Hebrew Bible). Or Oxford. Or Hebrew University.

I'm not entirely sure what to do with my life now. I'm 100K in debt from undergrad / financing my masters (specifically to get into the MTS at Harvard).

I have a 3.8 Masters GPA

I have three years of Biblical Hebrew, two years of Modern Hebrew, 1 year of German, and 1 semester of Biblical Aramaic.

I have been an adjunct for a semester in English 101 and an upper-division Religion course (Pentateuch) at a small, liberal arts college.

I've taken courses with "famous" people in my field.

I literally sold most of my possessions to finance a move from Illinois to Boston, to use the libraries here to finish my thesis (which I am preparing for publication submission) and "make connections", and am too broke to move back and eventually have to start paying loans off because I won't be in school in the fall.

I have done everything "right" that I'm supposed to do. I have worked full-time supporting myself in undergrad and in my grad program. I'm really tired of balancing everything, only to get rejected for everything that I apply for (first a Fulbright last year, now grad programs this year).

And, how am I supposed to get into top PhD programs, if I can't even get into another M.A. program?

Any suggestions?

[rook]

rook, i'm in East Tennessee and haven't heard from Chicago yet.

Thanks for the update. I'll keep you posted if I hear anything.

[rising_star]

idanceliketaffy, what's your first MA in? Have you tried contacting programs to ask how you might strengthen your application?

[idanceliketaffy]

In Jewish Studies, with a concentration on Hebrew Bible.

And yes, I will be contacting the programs once I can talk about the application without crying.

[fortunata]

You may have been rejected from the Masters programs in Hebrew Bible because they were too similar in focus to your previous MA. Other posts in this thread suggest that a second MA is usually undertaken within a different concentration (e.g. one MA in Hebrew Bible and a second MA in Religion and Ethics). With credentials as strong as yours, I can't imagine any other explanation, and I second rising_star's advice to contact the schools for further information.

[fortunata]

Btw, idanceliketaffy, did you apply for the MPhil or MSt at Oxford's Oriental Institute?

[idanceliketaffy]

I applied to the Oxford MSt....a one year program.

I explained in my Personal Statement the reason for undertaking a second M.A. would be, in addition to taking more courses about the history of Ancient Israel (my M.A. in Jewish Studies was very interdisciplinary--I had to take course in Rabbinics/Jewish Thought/Jewish History), I could use the NELC dept. to make my knowledge of language a bit broader by taking Akkadian, et cetera PLUS using the SLP program to take Greek (my statement was stronger than my incoherent ramblings right now). I talked to Jon Levenson (over the summer) who suggested that I apply for the M.A. instead of the Ph.D because I didn't have Greek.

[fortunata]

Wow, I don't know what else to say, idanceliketaffy. I wish I had more insight for you! It sounds as if your motives for pursuing a second MA are on track for our kind of discipline (I'm an Early Christianity girl, with a strong interest in Second Temple Judaism, so I know how important--and time consuming!--the acquisition of languages is). Find out what you can from the schools, and ask them how to best use your time before applying next year. You might even be in time to re-apply to Oxford under a different concentration (I know that a lot of their programs accept applications within gathered fields as late as June!). I'd suggest calling them ASAP to get their perspective on the matter.

[foureyes]

I talked to Jon Levenson (over the summer) who suggested that I apply for the M.A. instead of the Ph.D because I didn't have Greek.

Maybe I'm being really naive (it wouldn't be the first time), but I'm wondering why you didn't go ahead and apply for Ph.D. programs anyway. I don't even *have* an MA, and I got into most of the Ph.D. programs I applied to. I know this has been a recent topic of conversation, but I would never pay for another MA, especially after having already paid for one! If your ultimate goal is the Ph.D., isn't that what you should be applying for? You can pick up those extra things that you're referring to along the way (especially since you'll have more coursework to complete at the Ph.D. level.) Even if you took longer to take more language work, at least you'd be funded It's expected that you don't have all your coursework done at the Ph.D. level - that's why they require you to take more.

Sorry, I'm not trying to give unwanted advice! I guess if it were me, though, I would not set my sights on getting into an MTS/M.Div/M.St. program -- while they can be a stepping stone to getting into another program, they aren't essential and (according to my advisor's perspective, who has an MTS himself), it *can be* a waste of time if your ultimate goal is the Ph.D. (especially if you already have an MA in a related field).

[idanceliketaffy]

I didn't apply to a PhD because I consulted with different professors in my field (Levenson, Brettler, and two others) and they all agreed that my application would be stronger with a second M.A., specifically to focus on more language acquisition. I want to specialize in Semitic philology, and my M.A. in Jewish Studies was extremely interdisciplinary, so I don't have as strong of a background in linguistics that is expected at the PhD level in philology. And also that during my second M.A., I should try to publish / present, since I would have a stronger writing sample after developing my M.A. thesis.

[foureyes]

I didn't apply to a PhD because I consulted with different professors in my field (Levenson, Brettler, and two others) and they all agreed that my application would be stronger with a second M.A., specifically to focus on more language acquisition. I want to specialize in Semitic philology, and my M.A. in Jewish Studies was extremely interdisciplinary, so I don't have as strong of a background in linguistics that is expected at the PhD level in philology.

Understood. But still, the programs you've applied to (Oxford, Harvard, etc.) weren't M.A.'s - they were MTS/MSt. etc. What I'm saying is that applying to Ph.D. programs and the programs that you've applied to were not mutually exclusive (in places like Harvard, these degrees are in different schools.) You lose nothing if you apply to Ph.D. programs and don't get in (except, maybe, application fees and some time). There would be a lot to gain if you did happen to get in. I think the trick would be to illustrate why, in your personal statement, you're interested in pursuing philology when you've (thus far) gotten an M.A. in a different concentration. What they need to see is that 1) there's a logical reason you're pursuing it (given your background, you became interested in it because when you were doing an M.A. in this subfield, you found that ::blank:::, leading you to become intersted in your current subfield) and 2) that you show evidence that you are academically able to do it (and the fact that you've acquired other languages proves quite a bit.) It seems like your fear was that your interest would seem too random (that admissions committees would be thinking essentially, why is (s)he doing this now...? (S)he has no background in it!). I think you can prove why in a good personal statement. Also, next year, you could always check into applying for fully funded M.A./Ph.D. programs if you feel strongly about getting a second M.A. -- I would ask the Religious Studies departments that you're interested in if they think this is a viable option. I would just hate to see someone go more in debt if they didn't have to!

Don't know if this helps, but I don't have a background in Religious Studies. I applied to Rel. Studies programs with a background in medieval literature - and now I've decided to do modern western thought (i.e., philosophy of religion.) I illustrated in my own personal statement why my studies in medieval literature have led me to this point -- and many the top institutions that I've applied to (UVA, Chicago, UCSB, and Harvard) bought it. I think it's possible, and you have nothing to lose -- I guess that's my point.

ETA: if language is a huge barrier - couldn't you learn Greek on your own or enroll locally in a course this year and see how that improves your chances next year? You don't need a masters to acquire a language. Heck, if you're near a good institution (assuming you might be since you're conversing currently with scholars in your field), you could even take more coursework that wasn't through a degree program in your area of interest. It would be costly - but not nearly as costly as getting another M.A.

[Revolage]

GradCafers,

Sorry I've been missing in action. Got hit with a terrible case of the flu - body aches, headaches, excessive coughing, vomiting,...err, never mind.

Anyway, yesterday (Friday, March 14, 2008) I received a letter from the U of Chicago Div. School that read (in part): "...I am sorry to inform you that we were unable to offer you admission." The letter was dated March 11, 2008. I live about 45 minutes west of Chicago.

Rejections always suck, but after some of what I've read on this forum the past few days, I can't say I'm terribly disappointed. Of course, it helps that I've already gotten a few acceptances. Anyway, now I can root for Philmajor to get in off of the waitlist.

I think someone recently posted about Boston University. I received a letter of acceptance from them back on March 3, 2008 (the letter was dated February, 26, 2008). Specifically, I got into the Religion program in the Division of Religious and Theological Studies, NOT the School of Theology.

[foureyes]

Revolage -

I'm sorry hear about your illness and your rejection from University of Chicago.:cry: Congrats, though, on your acceptances! It's always nice to be able to temper the rejections with the thought that there's somewhere else for you. It's Chicago's loss, anyway.

Again, congrats, and I hope you feel like yourself again soon!

[Philmajor]

Revlolage,

I've been worried about you! I was rather hoping you were out celebrating your acceptance to Chicago and forgot to update us. Sadly, you have the nasty flu that is going around. I'm sorry you didn't get into Chicago as I was hoping you'd decline and I would get off the wait list - I only say this because I knew the acceptance you have was from an excellent school.

Hope you feel better soon and after I meet with the Dean next week I'll let you know if there is a chance in hell of getting in off the waitlist. Personally, I'm not holding out much hope. Any suggestions on what type of job I should look into?

[religiousphilosopher]

Hey everyone,

I am finishing up my B.A. in philosophy, and I've applied to Chicago, Harvard, and Yale Divinity schools to study philosophy of religion. I was accepted into all three. I'm leaning in the direction of Chicago and Harvard, but I would also like some advice. Which of these schools is most respected? Which one will give me the best experience and education? I will in a couple years be applying to a PhD program either at a religion department somewhere, including most likely the Chicago Div PhD or the Harvard Div ThD-- Yale Div doesn't offer a doctorate. I'd appreciate any advice!

[thatindividual]

What is the funding situation at each rp? If you go to U of Chicago you might be working next to me (I'm also doing P.o.R.), does that help sway your decision?

[religiousphilosopher]

Well, first of all, I applied to the Master's programs at each school. Chicago has offered me the standard 50% tuition scholarship. I haven't received the financial award letter from the other two yet.

[religiousphilosopher]

Are you currently a student at Chicago Div? If so, are you an A.M. or PhD student? Any thoughts about the school that you'd like to share... ?

[thatindividual]

Well if you get full funding and/or stipend somewhere that should take precedence unless money is no issue. Also consider faculty (are you hoping to work under someone in particular) and location and anything else that tickles your fancy. You're going to get a quality education at either of those places and, hopefully, similar opportunities after graduation. All of those schools on the same tier, though some are stronger in particular areas. At some you might get more attention and better access to professors (make sure you read pgs. 16-18 in this thread concerning U of C).

I just applied and got accepted into the A.M. program. I don't have any inside info relating to the school/faculty but that has been discussed in this thread pgs. 16-18.

[bah]

>>Which of these schools is most respected?<<

Virtually no difference.

>>which one will give me the best experience and education? <<

Hard to say. Also, much depends on the kind of philosophy you're into. Chicago is the place for continental and eastern religious thought. Yale is probably best for anglo-american philosophy of religion. I don't really know of any philosophers of religion actively working at Harvard right now. Chicago's AM program is huge and people like Marion are hard to access, so I would think Yale is probably the place to go, especially since you can do a 'concentrated' MTS in your area.

Ultimately, though, I would suggest you go where the funding is best because each of each programs will be a fine springboard for doctoral work. You might also considering favoring the program where you'd like to stay for doctoral work. It helps to be personally known and all places tend to show at least a little favoritism to their own products. Still, this is far from a guarantee, as some on this board have experienced.

[cmmimg]

On the Harvard, Yale, Chicago question...I agree that they all seem similar in prestige. Considering where you'd want to be for a doctoral program is an excellent consideration, as well as funding and general quality of life you'd have there. One thing that you should note, however, is that if you are planning to use your education to eventually teach at a college then you probably shouldn't get a Th.D. They just aren't marketable in the same way. Thus, you would be interested in the Harvard Committee on the Study of Religion and the Yale Department of Religious Study as well as Chicago Divinity (that is, for the Ph.D.).

Although you should definitely be concerned about faculty, etc. I think that with the prestige of all these programs you should consider quality of life very carefully. Will you be happier closer to friends, family? What about cost of living? Safety? Just the general feel of the campus, the campus culture?

[NTGuy]

In response to an earlier question (3 or so pages ago), I was looking at UNC-Chapel Hill, Graduate Theological Union, Univ. of Virginia, and of course Claremont. I got a letter from UNC Saturday saying I was not accepted, so I am 95 percent sure I will be heading to Claremont, as I know the faculty, school, area, etc. Best of luck to the rest of you!

[religiousphilosopher]

Oh and about half-tuition, If I understood the website correctly they do provide full-tuition awards in addition to fellowships. Unfortunately I guess I don't show that much "promise" . Oh well. I could have misunderstood the website as well.

When I talked to the Dean of Students, she told me that Master's students can only get 50%.

I am currently already at about $80k in debt from my undergraduate career. I wonder if its worth it to take out the loans to go to Chicago Div masters, with the hope that I would get into a fully funded PhD religion program in a couple years. It comes down to a... "what else am I gonna do with my life?"

Also, if I get an A.M, MTS, or MAR degree, will this mean I can only apply to Religion departments? Would Philosophy departments also accept this, assuming I take many philosophy classes (which is certainly possible at Chicago and Harvard-- not sure how "free" Yale's program is).

[Professor X]

Quote

In my search for non-MDiv masters programs in religion a few years ago I generally found that most schools, particularly those attached to a university, did not give much funding.

Pardon the intrusion, but I just thought I would comment on the misinformation previously posted.

Here is the list of MA programs in Religion / Religious Studies / Comparative Religion / History of Religions in the US, and most of them fully fund MA students with assistantships that carry full tuition remission as well as stipends. I know whereof I speak -- I direct one of these programs. Many of these programs are "feeders" to PhD programs. My program, for example, sends 75% of our MA students on to top PhD programs -- and that statistic includes our alums who opt for other careers.

With that said, here's the list. Do keep in mind that programs with non-thesis options are generally (but not exclusively) less rigorous, and/or geared toward students who do not aspire to PhD admissions.

California State University, Long Beach (exam or thesis)

Miami University, Ohio (thesis)

Missouri State University (accelerated, non-thesis)

New York University (thesis or exam)

University of Denver (thesis)

University of Georgia (thesis)

University of Hawaii, Manoa (thesis or non-thesis)

University of Kansas (thesis or non-thesis)

University of Missouri, Columbia (thesis or portfolio)

University of New Mexico (IN DEVELOPMENT)

University of North Carolina, Charlotte (thesis or portfolio)

University of South Carolina (thesis)

University of Washington (MA is actually in International Studies, oddly)

Wake Forest University (thesis)

Western Kentucky University (IN DEVELOPMENT)

Western Michigan University (thesis or portfolio)