hmmm...painting MFA, perhaps for a different type of applicant

[kristlynnej]

I've been watching these forums for awhile in true anxiety stricken readiness, just the same as every applicant, for news that could change everything. They have been helpful to me and I am grateful to everyone who has posted info. I've noticed that some schools haven't been mentioned as much, and it seems that the individuals getting interviews/admission offers at one place are also getting them elsewhere. Bravo! and excellent job, your portfolios must be astounding. I, on the other hand, out of perhaps a natural inclination towards shyness, or fear of a blow to my pride, have posted nothing, waiting on good news in order to post something worthwhile on here. Never mind that, I am past the point of caring who is best and who is better--here is my list, I hope those that haven't heard any good news as of yet will feel some sense of camaraderie, because all of us, even those with the odds against us, are dealing with the same worry.

UW: rejected

SAIC:rejected

Berkeley:rejected

Hunter: no word

RISD: no word

SUNY Albany: no word (likely won't be anytime soon, since the deadline hasn't even passed yet)

MICA: no word

NYAA: no word

UCLA: no word

Univ. Hawaii @ Manoa: no word

[intelly]

I also got rejected from UW! The letter said they had 400 applicants! that's double what the website said they had for last year.

I'm also in the same boat as you, this is my lineup so far:

UW: rej

UNM: rej

IU-Bloomington: rej

UT-Austin: rej

CCA: no word (assuming I'm rejected since people on here got emails about 2 weeks ago)

Northern Illinois University: waiting

Pacific Northwest College of Art: waiting

Kendall College of Art (Ferris State): waiting

I feel like such a loser, everyone else is getting into schools

[sophiab]

I am feeling very similar to you! I have gotten a lot of rejections so far, and it has been really stressful. My undergrad is not even in a field close to art, and I made my application portfolio in literally 7 months after working in a completely unrelated field for years. I feel really self-conscious about my work and applications too.

I have been rejected so far from: cranbrook, cmu, ucsd, berkeley, calarts.

I had interviews with SFAI, UCSC, CCA, and am very happy I got accepted into CCA. I had three rejections before I got an acceptance, and I felt really terrible up until then (and the rejections still feel pretty bad). I was convinced I was going to have to reapply next year.

I'm also still waiting to hear from UCLA, RISD, and San Jose State.

[alizarin]

I feel the same way too. I got 3 rejections in a row last month for painting: Yale, SAIC, & UC Berkeley. Berkeley felt like the biggest blow. I started to feel really depressed and my confidence went down the drain. I was thinking of just reapplying again next year. I wasn't really expecting anything anymore. The only positive thing that happened a week after that, was an interview offer with RISD. And now, I'm still waiting to hear from these schools: Columbia, UCLA, CCA, & SAIC (printmedia). Now I wonder if I should have applied to more schools.....

[sophiab]

I feel the same way too. I got 3 rejections in a row last month for painting: Yale, SAIC, & UC Berkeley. Berkeley felt like the biggest blow. I started to feel really depressed and my confidence went down the drain. I was thinking of just reapplying again next year. I wasn't really expecting anything anymore. The only positive thing that happened a week after that, was an interview offer with RISD. And now, I'm still waiting to hear from these schools: Columbia, UCLA, CCA, & SAIC (printmedia). Now I wonder if I should have applied to more schools.....

Berkeley's rejection felt especially awful to me too, though when you look at how few students they accept and the paid tuition, I guess it makes sense. Good luck with your RISD interview. I am applying to Digital Media there, and I am not sure if they contacted anyone yet.

[pionkowskig]

To all - please don't get down on yourself. The beauty about art is that it is unique and personal. You all have braved sending your work out into the world to be judged, which is the hardest thing to do!

The reality is that schools have politics, professors have interests and often professors at like universities share those interests. Maybe you don't fit into what is going on with the program (ie - maybe they love theory and your work does not speak to theory). Not to mention a million other factors (connections people might have that you don't ect ect). Point is - there is little to no merit in letting rejections get you down about the quality or worth of your work. In the end it is the making that matters. Sooner or later you will find where your talents fit in - and believe me - everyone on this board is still navigating the hectic, often hurtful, but beautiful world of art.

I say keep your head up and realize that since you all are so concerned about getting into a program and making art it means you have passion - you really care! Don't let anyone strip that from your hearts!

[grad_wannabe]

There is no logic to grad school apps. There are SO MANY different factors, and it is SO subjective... don't get down on yourself.

There was one guy in my graduating class who was a department star - he knew all the right professors, took all the right classes, placed in lots of exhibitions, produced intelligent and thoughtful work, got the honors studio space, did tons of extracurricular stuff, had an internship, and even founded a pretty big gallery on campus.

He got in NOWHERE. TWO ROUNDS of applications (applied the year he graduated, and again the year after that). Nothing.

There was a girl, same year, who was kind of a bitch. Her work was juvenile, repetitive and self-absorbed. She was argumentative and confrontational. Never seemed to contribute anything of value to any class I had her in. She had no idea how the graduate system or art system worked, and not only that but she was proud of her ignorance. "What? MFA Thesis show tonight? What is that? I don't follow all that ART stuff you guys do!" (and she was an art major).

She got into UCSD, with a full-ride fellowship.

You just never know.

Edited March 10, 2010 by grad_wannabe

[sophiab]

Thanks for the encouragement both of you! It's good to hear the perspective of people who have more experience than me.

[nathancotephoto]

I have to agree with grad_wannabe and pionkowskig. Ive seen the 'all star' art students go no where in the art world but make great baristas. Americano, extra shot, black please. I dont think as they reject the grad candidates they are thinking good work, bad work. I think they are looking for developed artists who fit best in their programs. Its business or at least thats what i hope it is. Grad school wont make you an artist. If the panels at the schools I applied to dont think my work will fit very well into their program, then Im glad they reject me. My work is my work and if they dont like it Im going to move on. Last year I was 1 of 4 and i deferred my acceptance. This year I got one rejection and one acceptance with one to go. I didnt apply to any of the top tier private schools this year(if im going to work as an artist, im not going to work under the 100k in debt). I want funding. And why not.

[Grafeef]

Sorry--I'm getting a little teary here thinking about your post because I know how painful it is--

I just had to chime in here with some additional words of support from another painter. I went through the process last year and was rejected from every place (with the added bonus of 1 agonizing waitlist). The whole process really left me doubting myself and the quality of my portfolio. I, too, was really shy and intimidated by the excited posts of people who were getting good news all the time (though this board certainly helped me through the process of eliminating false hopes).

After working on my portfolio for another year and getting more recommenders, I'm going through the process again this year and was getting rejections left and right--until I finally got one acceptance, to the perfect place for me. I expect still more rejections to come.

I really think the other posters are right--admissions have only a little to do with "quality." These programs are looking for people that will make a good fit with the current direction of the program and with their faculty. And some schools (I hope this isn't sour grapes talking, but I don't think so) seem to be very much invested in what (or who) is fashionable right this minute. And we can't help it if we're not that.

So please don't question your portfolio or your decision to go through the process. Believe me--we are still EARLY in the process (unfortunately), so there are many steps to go before this year's cycle is over. And whatever happens, you are one step closer.

[jcs]

I hear you, this whole process can be pretty discouraging. I just received my first rejection letter from Carnegie Mellon a couple days back, and I know that this is just the first of many more. CM was especially hard for me because they don't ask for recommendations, so I felt like getting accepted would have been based soley on the strength of my work. So that would have been a nice affirmation. I was really depressed about it until I remembered that the reason I'm applying to grad school is because I want to further myself as an artist. I'm passionate about what I do, I love to do it, and I want to grow in my ability to articulate and more clearly understand what I'm so passionate about. So if a school doesn't want my type of work, it's a good thing that they rejected me. Because the whole point of going to grad school is to strengthen yourself as an artist, not to conform to the kind of work that a school might be interested in at the time.

The problem with this whole application process is that it takes away from the joy of making art. Pretty soon we (or me, anyways) get so worried about whether our stuff is "grad school" worthy, that we stop enjoying the process and we start overthinking things way too much. It's hard to switch back and forth between these two mind sets, and I haven't figured out how to do it all that successfully yet. But I just wanted to reiterate what everyone else has been saying about not being discouraged (and I'm saying this as much for myself as I am to anyone else on this forum). We are going into this field for a reason, and to be honest, most likely it's not because we want to be encouraged, understood, and accepted every step of the way throughout our careers. We might not even want to be in this field to begin with, except that we need to for our sanity. So the most important thing is to continue making things and to remember to enjoy that process. The rest will fall into place eventually. And it's nice to know that there are so many encouraging and supportive people on this forum who are hoping for the best for each of us, too

[brianmc]

Everyone is right. You don't want to get in just to "get in." It is important to get in somewhere that is interested in your work and wants to watch you develop it. It is important to be with faculty that are going to be as encouraging as they are critical. I had a bad experience working with faculty that weren't right for me as an undergrad. I transferred into MICA as a junior painting major and things went well the first year and the faculty were great for the most part. I received the second biggest scholarship award that they offered in the returning students scholarship competition. As a result of doing so well, I was invited along with about 20 students from various majors to participate in a pilot program my senior year, where instead of taking five 3 credit classes, we would all be in a 9 credit seminar where we would work independently for the studio component and have weekly crits and we met to discuss critical readings once a week as a group for an art history/liberal arts component. The seminar had four faculty. One was a studio teacher who was highly conceptual, one was an art historian/ critic who was more or less into highly conceptual art, loved works such as re-enactments of grocery store checkout lanes in art galleries etc., another was a curator who had worked with Fred Wilson and other such conceptual artists, and the fourth was the school's resident philosopher. As a painting major this was the worst possible thing I could have ever gotten involved in. It became very apparent that the group of faculty had sort of assembled themselves and pitched the idea of this program based on their own common interests in conceptual art and boring rhetoric (boring to me, I don't mean to offend anyone who enjoys that sort of thing.) We were required to write a ten page thesis. I never really knew what I was supposed to write about. I felt like they wanted us to trace our bloodline back through art history and link our work to issues in contemporary criticism which was very hard considering the whole "death of painting" that had taken place. The more I critiqued with these faculty the more and more I edited my work down until it was almost barren of meaning to me. By the beginning of the Spring semester when other students were applying to grad school, I just couldn't wait for school to be over. All of the painters in the program were frustrated. Thank god a few of them still applied to grad school. One got into Yale. He was probably the most combative with the conceptual faculty and I think he was still working with some good painting faculty in his other classes outside of the seminar who were encouraging him and writing him recommendations. He was an awesome painter and deserved to go wherever he wanted to. I unfortunately was just trying to graduate as a transfer and didn't have the leisure of taking classes with the faculty that I liked in my final semester. Once I got out, I didn't pick up a paint brush for about 10 months and when I finally did I was only making one picture a year for about six years. The only good thing that I could see that came out of that program was that my anger and frustration coupled with the fact that my work had reached a complete dead end led me to an interesting and rebellious place when I started painting again. I have since fully recovered and have been working regularly for a little over two years now. I guess the point that I'm trying to make is that if that same seminar had been led by a painting faculty and an art historian who loved Philip Guston and Max Beckman like I do and a curator who had put together a Carroll Dunham / Lari Pittman show I probably would have loved it. I have a feeling that getting into the wrong graduate school would be very much like my experience as a senior undergrad at MICA. I was bitter for many years and didn't say a lot of good things about the school. It is only recently that a friend of mine has started attending MICA and has some of the same faculty that I had in my junior year that I have started to regain the many positive memories from my junior year. MICA was awesome. I wish I would have just taken their normal senior independent program with faculty from my department like the other 130 seniors did that year. I feel like I was sort of robbed of my childhood as an artist/painter being exposed to all of that tired jargon about consumption and surrogate simulacra or whatever they were talking about. I'd would really have rather argued about the meaning of the personal symbolism in Bosch's "Garden of Earthly Delights" and have the faculty tell me that I was too heavy handed. Instead I had a disinterested art critic telling me to look at David Salle because he killed painting and no one cares anymore. Everyone keep your heads up and who cares what is cool and fashionable right now in the art world. The beauty of the whole situation is that we will be the ones to decide the future. If you're tired of the rhetoric, you can contribute in the effort to change it. The general atmosphere of pluralism in the contemporary art world is pretty exciting. I hope everyone finds their niche and a program where they can thrive. I only applied to one school this year. It was my back-up school on my original list. I decided I would be perfectly satisfied going there, but didn't get in. They weren't even ranked by U.S. News. They were listed at the bottom with all of the n/a rankings. Major blow to the ego. But I will trudge on. I don't really care what they think. I don't really care what anyone thinks. I like making my work and it alone inspires me to continue and always raises a new question that keeps me going. If I never sell anything again and never get offered to show, I will still paint because I have to so that I can go to sleep with a satisfied conscience. There is value in all of our work. I'm thrilled that so many of my co-workers who have never studied art or been to a museum, like my work. I guess that makes me low-brow, but so what. I am the proud son of a ditch digger and an administrative assistant who have one semester of college between them. My grandfather never finished high school. I could give a crap what an art history PhD thinks, or a bunch of people running an MFA program. I want to make art so I do. I've never wanted to make art just for others. I want to make art that serves me and for others to look at.

[littlenova]

@brianmc: If we were on Facebook...I'd "like" your comments. My close friend applied to 4 top programs after college and got in everywhere...She deferred admission for a while for personal reasons...This year she applied again, and she had not-so-great luck. She is AMAZING. She has an INSANE vita...but, for whatever reason...It's been tougher this time around. It is no reflection on the quality of her work.

Trudge on. Indeed.

[nathancotephoto]

@brianmc After reading that post I feel like we all need to go out for a drink... or two! I too had a very hard last year as an undergrad. I got a C- in the first half of my senior photo year followed by a B- the next semester(which i had to explain in my interview with UNLV). My professors didnt quite get what i was doing and I barely did but the images were very successful in a technical and conceptual sense. That being so I dont care how the school that I will attend is ranked. Some day its going to be a foot note just above my repeat solo shows at the MOMA in NY on my CV. Gotta Dream. Like you I want critical eyes and minds viewing my work with encouraging words to help it all grow into a more developed body of work.

[kristlynnej]

Update:

UW:rejected

SAIC:rejected

Berkeley:rejected

Hunter: no word

RISD: no word

SUNY Albany: called today, finalist of preliminary review (final review after April 15th) encouraged to come out

MICA: no word

NYAA: no word

UCLA: rejected

Univ. Hawaii @ Manoa:rejected

[crey01]

Update:

UW:rejected

SAIC:rejected

Berkeley:rejected

Hunter: no word

RISD: no word

SUNY Albany: called today, finalist of preliminary review (final review after April 15th) encouraged to come out

MICA: no word

NYAA: no word

UCLA: rejected

Univ. Hawaii @ Manoa:rejected

I am also waiting to hear back from HUNTER and Steinhardt...has anyone interviewed with them? I also applied to UCLA, what emphasis did you apply? painting?

[Spaced Out]

To all - please don't get down on yourself. The beauty about art is that it is unique and personal. You all have braved sending your work out into the world to be judged, which is the hardest thing to do!

The reality is that schools have politics, professors have interests and often professors at like universities share those interests. Maybe you don't fit into what is going on with the program (ie - maybe they love theory and your work does not speak to theory). Not to mention a million other factors (connections people might have that you don't ect ect). Point is - there is little to no merit in letting rejections get you down about the quality or worth of your work. In the end it is the making that matters. Sooner or later you will find where your talents fit in - and believe me - everyone on this board is still navigating the hectic, often hurtful, but beautiful world of art.

I say keep your head up and realize that since you all are so concerned about getting into a program and making art it means you have passion - you really care! Don't let anyone strip that from your hearts!

Yeah! Its great to hear this. I have had such a love/hate relationship with this forum because on one hand its great to hear the experiences people are going through but on the other hand it gets me thinking and analyzing way way too much. Thanks for reminder that there is a lot of chance, politics and just plain BS that goes on during this process. And by the way this shit doesnt always stop once you get into a prog. There is plenty of hoops to jump through then as well

[Spaced Out]

I am also waiting to hear back from HUNTER and Steinhardt...has anyone interviewed with them? I also applied to UCLA, what emphasis did you apply? painting?

I havent heard from Hunter either. I did however recieve something a week and half ago about filling out some special application for CUNY finacial aid, but the site was all messed upi and I tried a few times to fill out the form and havent gone back to try in a while

[Spaced Out]

I hear you, this whole process can be pretty discouraging. I just received my first rejection letter from Carnegie Mellon a couple days back, and I know that this is just the first of many more. CM was especially hard for me because they don't ask for recommendations, so I felt like getting accepted would have been based soley on the strength of my work. So that would have been a nice affirmation. I was really depressed about it until I remembered that the reason I'm applying to grad school is because I want to further myself as an artist. I'm passionate about what I do, I love to do it, and I want to grow in my ability to articulate and more clearly understand what I'm so passionate about. So if a school doesn't want my type of work, it's a good thing that they rejected me. Because the whole point of going to grad school is to strengthen yourself as an artist, not to conform to the kind of work that a school might be interested in at the time.

The problem with this whole application process is that it takes away from the joy of making art. Pretty soon we (or me, anyways) get so worried about whether our stuff is "grad school" worthy, that we stop enjoying the process and we start overthinking things way too much. It's hard to switch back and forth between these two mind sets, and I haven't figured out how to do it all that successfully yet. But I just wanted to reiterate what everyone else has been saying about not being discouraged (and I'm saying this as much for myself as I am to anyone else on this forum). We are going into this field for a reason, and to be honest, most likely it's not because we want to be encouraged, understood, and accepted every step of the way throughout our careers. We might not even want to be in this field to begin with, except that we need to for our sanity. So the most important thing is to continue making things and to remember to enjoy that process. The rest will fall into place eventually. And it's nice to know that there are so many encouraging and supportive people on this forum who are hoping for the best for each of us, too

Well put! I have and continue to be on an emotional rollercoaster throughout this process and I have to continue to remind myself what is most important and you state it well

[stofo]

Well put! I have and continue to be on an emotional rollercoaster throughout this process and I have to continue to remind myself what is most important and you state it well

Grad school, if you get in, is not the last art thing you will apply for that can discourage you and make you question your art, etc. Grad school is the first application in a career for an artist that will be plagued with applications for grants, residencies, and gallery representation. I'm sure all those things are quite filled with politics, board members with certain tastes, etc. You will be blindly competing against many other artists by putting a lot of time, effort, and money into art related applications for the rest of your art career. How will we deal with these issues?

[littlenova]

@stofo: You said it...My photo professor at undergrad applied for the Guggenheim fellowship 9 years in a row before she won. She said she hoped I didn't get into my residency so that I could taste rejection---it's "good training"----she'd say. This is why grad school should be more than prepping for a career in teaching or defending a thesis...It REALLY IS about solidifying your point of view enough to be confident in your direction no matter the obstacles.

[mbadger]

I agree completely with what has been said. I really feel like this process is almost as important as the end result. It really does help you to solidify your point of view and take the big jump of being brash and honest and putting yourself out there. It's courageous and all of us should have some sense of pride in the personal momentum created in that act alone, regardless of the outcome of acceptances. After all of this, more than anything I feel a total assurance in what I want to do. That's a pretty valuable souvenir.

And of course, like everyone else has said, getting rejected is not always a comment on the value of your work. There are so many factors...and who wants to be stuck at a school where the fit is way off? Getting an MFA at a top private art school is hardly the only road to success. In no way do I mean to trivialize those getting in to that...It's obviously a great honor and speaks a lot about the quality of your work. And of course that road may be a little easier in terms of the getting to the goal but still...

One of the best teachers and best artists I have ever met, Keith Carter, didn't go to grad school. He didn't even get his undergrad in art. He is from my small hometown in Texas. However, he has been extremely successful with international success, numerous awards and honors, galleries representing him all over the U.S and abroad, published numerous books, and holds a university teaching profession based solely on his success without an art degree to speak of.

And on that same thread...all this knocking of this school or that school as being lesser than...not everyone wants the same things out of a school and not everyone will have the same experience at the same schools. Sure going to a school with a great reputation is amazing. But it doesn't mean that going to a school without any reputation at all dooms you to a fruitless education or future. I received my BFA from a small town university with zero national reputation. However, I whole-heartedly believe that I got an outstanding education and worked with amazing professors. I wouldn't trade it for anything, even an art superstar school with loads of connections.