General vs Subject Rankings for PhD

[Deleted Because Useless]

Hello!

While rankings are less important when applying for a PhD, I do believe that they provide some money-saving guidelines when applying. So I am curious as to what you know in regards to rankings (general/overall vs subject). While many of the top schools retain their position even when specifying the field of study, some schools differ greatly. As an English Literature applicant, some schools that come mind are, Indiana U, Illinois UC, Rutgers, CUNY and so on. These are schools with great english programs but somewhat down the rank when considered overall.  WashU, Rice, USC are ranked in the 30s. I'm wondering how you guys spread out your applications. When you divide, for example, (top 2, mid 4, low 6), which rank do you consider? Furthermore, If Rutgers is #15 on USNews and Boston U #42, does it mean that the competition is less fierce for Boston U applicants? I am not a US Citizen so I only have these numbers to go with and I don't want to waste $$$ by applying to too many schools.

Thanks!

[placeinspace]

I didn't consider rank one bit. Especially for English (also my field!), it's much less about the school or even department ranking, and much more the scholars themselves. The leading scholar in your specialty could be teaching at a lower ranked school, but they'd still be the best scholars in your specialty. With humanities PhDs, the competition will be pretty steep at most schools, and you become more competitive based on how well you fit with the department/faculty. Sorry, I know this doesn't answer your question, but I think you should focus more on finding faculty that would be willing to advise you, rather than overall school rank.

[Warelin]

I think there are a few notes that need to be added here to better understand how "rankings" are determined.

From USNews regarding Grad School rankings in the humanities:

For the surveys conducted in fall 2016, Ipsos sent each school offering a doctoral program two surveys per discipline. Questionnaires were sent to department heads and directors of graduate studies in economics, English, history, political science, psychology, and sociology – or, alternatively, a senior faculty member who teaches graduate students – at schools that had granted a total of five or more doctorates in each discipline during the five-year period from 2011 through 2015, as indicated by the National Center for Education Statistics' Completions survey.

These are the number of schools with doctoral programs surveyed in fall 2016: economics (138); English (155); history (151); political science (120); psychology (255); and sociology (118). And these were the response rates: economics (23 percent), English (14 percent), history (15 percent), political science (24 percent), psychology (14 percent) and sociology (33 percent)."

What this essentially means is that 14 percent of DGS/Department heads decided the rank of 155 programs. This is problematic because a lot of DGS know very little of programs besides their closest peers. The DGS is often a rotating position at many schools which could also explain the low response rate. Department heads generally aren't paid to pay attention to graduate school so their knowledge may be even less.

More detailed information about Grad rankings in the humanities could be found here.

By contrast, School rankings at the undergrad level are done using a completely different methodology. 

For 2019, the following were considered for overall school rankings at the undergrad level:
Outcomes (35 percent)
Faculty Resources (20 percent)
Expert Opinion (20 percent) 

• 15 of the 20 points of this is based on assessments from Presidents, provosts, and deans of admissions. Their job generally involves keeping up to date of what other programs are doing.
• The remaining 5 points of this category are based on high-school counselor surveys. Their job generally involves helping students find great fits for them.

Financial Resources (10 percent)
Student Excellence (10 percent)
Alumni Giving (5 percent)

More detailed information about undergrad rankings could be found here.

With that out of the way, the number of applicants varies greatly by school. Applicants have different things they consider important when applying.  Some people will only consider applying to the top 10 universities (despite on whether or not there are professors that fit what they do), some are restricted to applying to certain areas, some need a big city, some consider weather to be important, some need to be somewhere more rural, some have partners to consider, some are limited by time or funding, some refuse to live with roommates so they want to ensure that stipends will be able to cover this. There are many more factors that will influence how many programs they're willing to research to determine fit. A lower applicant count does not mean a place is less competitive. It's possible that the majority of New York University's are filtered out due to it being a terrible fit and people being more interested in living in New York City than it does with what NYU could specifically provide to that student that others can't. I imagine that schools with fewer applicants get more serious applicants that have really specific reasons on why they're applying to that school.

Application season is something that I'm not sure we'll ever understand. I was rejected by schools that accepted a greater number of applicants. I was accepted by schools that accept less than 5 percent of their applicants. Fit is the most important thing in admissions and that fit changes each year based on what the department is interested in, what gaps they're hoping to fill from previous years and where they're heading.