Improving My Chances of Acceptances for next Year

[Thanks4Downvoting]

Ladies and Gents,

I'd really appreciate your help in letting me know where my time would be best spent over the summer and during the fall strengthening my application for my M.Div.

My Stats:

Currently Attending: University of Tennessee - Knoxville, flagship state University

GPA: 4.0 (Major complete, excluding Thesis)

Major: Religious Studies - Honors, Chancellor's Honors Program (Honors College)

Minor: History

Language Proficiencies: Classical Latin, Medieval Latin (will use in Senior Thesis)

Research: 30 page paper on Theological changes in the German Evangelical Church during the Third Reich, will be doing Senior Thesis: Merovingian Hagiography: Sanctity and Political Power (will be presented at the very least at the University level)

Extracurriculars: Fraternity President, Founding Father, Secretary, National Governing Council (3 undergrads in the entire nation), Greek Week Chairman, Historian's assistant, Director of Curriculum - Interdenominational Bible Study

Honor Societies: Mortar Board, Eta Sigma Phi (Classics), and Order of Omega (applied, interview pending)

Ministry Experience: This summer I will be doing an internship at my Church as Assistant Youth Pastor and will help plan curriculum and activities, sitting on major boards of the church and helping in overall direction. (Great opportunity) Perhaps my Director of Curriculum - Interdenominational Bible Study could go here as well.

LoRs: Strong: Options between a well-published and known professor who graduated from one of my top choices, Well-published Classicist who can attest to my latin proficiencies, and a Lecturer I took most of my Early Christianity/Christianity in late antiquity classes from, and who I'm extremely close to and has directed research for me previously. (might need help choosing between these, so any input would be appreciated.)

Denomination: CBF (I get to choose my MDiv program, not really much oversight)

Will apply to (alphabetically): Claremont, Drew, Duke, Emory, Harvard, Mercer, Union, Wake Forest, and Yale (Perhaps a few more)

So, what's in the most need of strengthening? What should I focus on? You can tell me what you think my chances are as well. I'd really appreciate it you guys, and I hope my application season next year is as fruitful as some of yours this year!

[Febronia]

Your chances are very good, but obviously there are no certainties in this game....

Areas to improve?

GRE. Harvard might be the only program you're applying to that requires it, but at most others you can choose to submit it, and if you score well then it's a good plan to do so. This is worth spending some time on, because scores are good for 5 years, and there is much to be said for not having to retake it again later.....!

Languages. Honestly, Latin is probably sufficient to be admitted....I applied to M.Div. programs with hardly any language background...but I would start another language (Greek or German or French) in the fall if you can. It not only looks good, but it will save you trouble down the road....!

If anything, more ministry experience would probably help you, but I don't think it's essential, and I'm not sure what to recommend.

Probably the most important thing will be to really spend some time with your statements of purpose. You're applying to some very different programs, which is fine, but you'll probably want to be crafting quite different statements of purpose for them, rather than a generic one with a "fit paragraph".

[Sparky]

Dude, my application to M* programs was about 1/3 the quality of yours, and I got in everywhere I applied. You'll be fine.

The biggest thing "missing" I can see is a scholarship language. German or French; which one doesn't particularly matter for admissions purposes.

Most places let you submit up to 4 LORs, so I wouldn't stress too much about who to ask yet. Just make sure you get your LOR writers in line early. One thing you might want to keep in mind is that some MDiv programs prefer one of your recommendations come from a pastor. I don't know if that's in addition to academic ones, though, or a substitute for one of them.

For PhD applications, I would make sure that you used Latin (or another primary source language, or at the very least a secondary source in another language) in your writing sample--every school I contacted specifically said they wanted to see this. However, recalling the writing sample I submitted to MA/MTS programs, there was not an ounce of anything but English in it, and I did fine.

Start your SOPs early, over the summer, even. Have at least one person look over each draft of all of them.

Keep your grades up, including next spring! Undergrad GPA matters for PhD admissions, too--a 4.0 or near-4.0 graduate GPA is sort of expected, so schools look to UGPA again. No senioritis for undergrad religion PhD hopefuls, unfortunately. You can get 'masteritis' after your Ph.D acceptance.

Good luck and blessings! It's intimidating, but exciting. And most importantly: it is SO, SO WORTH IT.

[Thanks4Downvoting]

GRE. Harvard might be the only program you're applying to that requires it, but at most others you can choose to submit it, and if you score well then it's a good plan to do so. This is worth spending some time on, because scores are good for 5 years, and there is much to be said for not having to retake it again later.....!

I'm going to be working on this during the summer, and I hope to have a good score.

I'm also going to be working on my SOP during the summer. They're all different programs, but they are all programs that appeal to me in one or more of their foci.

Appreciate the reply, Febronia, and congrats on your acceptances! You were an HDS MDiv'er right?

Dude, my application to M* programs was about 1/3 the quality of yours, and I got in everywhere I applied. You'll be fine.

The biggest thing "missing" I can see is a scholarship language. German or French; which one doesn't particularly matter for admissions purposes.

Most places let you submit up to 4 LORs, so I wouldn't stress too much about who to ask yet. Just make sure you get your LOR writers in line early. One thing you might want to keep in mind is that some MDiv programs prefer one of your recommendations come from a pastor. I don't know if that's in addition to academic ones, though, or a substitute for one of them.

For PhD applications, I would make sure that you used Latin (or another primary source language, or at the very least a secondary source in another language) in your writing sample--every school I contacted specifically said they wanted to see this. However, recalling the writing sample I submitted to MA/MTS programs, there was not an ounce of anything but English in it, and I did fine.

Start your SOPs early, over the summer, even. Have at least one person look over each draft of all of them.

Keep your grades up, including next spring! Undergrad GPA matters for PhD admissions, too--a 4.0 or near-4.0 graduate GPA is sort of expected, so schools look to UGPA again. No senioritis for undergrad religion PhD hopefuls, unfortunately. You can get 'masteritis' after your Ph.D acceptance.

Good luck and blessings! It's intimidating, but exciting. And most importantly: it is SO, SO WORTH IT.

Yeah, I know my languages probably aren't in perfect condition right now, but I also feel like my proficiencies in Medieval Latin are standout quality for Undergrads, so I hope that those proficiencies overshadow my lack of Greek/Research languages coming out of undergrad.

Thanks for the advice about keeping the GPA up, and the GRE. I'll be working on the GRE this summer, and hope to come away with a score I want to send out to programs, even ones that don't require it.

My SOPs should be pretty much complete by the end of summer, and as far as my LORs, my pastor will write me an outstanding one!

Thanks for your help!

[Febronia]

Appreciate the reply, Febronia, and congrats on your acceptances! You were an HDS MDiv'er right?

Yes, I'm finishing up my last semester now. I've really loved it here, so I definitely highly recommend it.

[Thanks4Downvoting]

Yes, I'm finishing up my last semester now. I've really loved it here, so I definitely highly recommend it.

Yeah, I remember you talking specifically about the program's flexibility, which really interests me in preparing for my PhD.

[Postbib Yeshuist]

I'd say you have nothing to worry about. M.Div. programs are not going to be anywhere near as competitive as you might think. Your résumé looks just fine. If you'e worried about the top-tier schools like HDS, etc, see if you can get a paper presented somewhere. A regional AAR meeting might be a good goal. If you think you can get your thesis published, do that as well, even if it's in a lower-tier journal.

Edited March 22, 2010 by Postbib Yeshuist

[vanidyam]

Going along with what other people are saying-- I'm pretty sure you're fine. I went to a school that has no grades/GPA, I have zero language experience, my GRE scores were embarrassing, and I'm going to HDS with full tuition this Fall.

I guess my only advice is that you have good recommendations. I had really great relationships with several of my professors, and though I didn't see the recommendations, I can only imagine they were pretty great and really, really helpful.

[Thanks4Downvoting]

I'd say you have nothing to worry about. M.Div. programs are not going to be anywhere near as competitive as you might think. Your résumé looks just fine. If you'e worried about the top-tier schools like HDS, etc, see if you can get a paper presented somewhere. A regional AAR meeting might be a good goal. If you think you can get your thesis published, do that as well, even if it's in a lower-tier journal.

That's one of my really big goals. I really hope I'm able to attend my top schools!

[lovethequestions]

In terms of publication--I have actually gotten the opposite advice on two separate occasions from professors (that is, they suggested I be cautious about publication). Their reasoning was that, whereas with conference presentations, if it goes poorly, it's over, when you've published an article, it will never go away. So if you have a less-than-mature scholarly perspective (as I know I still do) or even flat-out errors, those will count against you in your future career. Their advice was, present away; but be very cautious about what you seek to publish.

[Thanks4Downvoting]

In terms of publication--I have actually gotten the opposite advice on two separate occasions from professors (that is, they suggested I be cautious about publication). Their reasoning was that, whereas with conference presentations, if it goes poorly, it's over, when you've published an article, it will never go away. So if you have a less-than-mature scholarly perspective (as I know I still do) or even flat-out errors, those will count against you in your future career. Their advice was, present away; but be very cautious about what you seek to publish.

Thanks for you input! That's a good thing to keep in mind as well.

[Postbib Yeshuist]

Thanks for you input! That's a good thing to keep in mind as well.

Yeah, I'd have to agree with that assessment now that I think about it. Presenting at a local AAR is going to ut you in good standing. But honestly, trust us on this, MDiv's are pretty easy to get into. Harvard is going to be looking at how you "fit" as much as grades, etc. For example, if they have a lot of Methodists that year and you're the Baptist, you're in. Let's say they have a large number from big universities and you're from Nowhere Kansas U, you're in (not your situation, of course, but you get the idea). Your grades, etc won't be what would hurt you (not that anything would given what you've posted), but what experiences and personal life stories do you bring? How do you complement the program? Your "story" will be as important (if not more so) than grades, etc. I hope that makes sense. If not, please feel free to ask for clarification. I'm not saying grades are meaningless, but I am saying that institutions like Harvard value diversity (or are at least beginning to). Who you are is perhaps more important than what grades you got in undergrad.

In the end, however, please don't stress over MDiv. You're more than likely "in" before you even apply.

Edited March 24, 2010 by Postbib Yeshuist

[Presbygeek]

I just had a minor stroke thinking that this is the caliber of application I am going up against.

I'm DOOMED!

[Postbib Yeshuist]

I just had a minor stroke thinking that this is the caliber of application I am going up against.

I'm DOOMED!

Nah. Again, it's "just" an M.Div. Diversity is often as important as grades. Harvard will obviously be competitive, but your statement of purpose, letters of recommendation, "status" (e.g. male/female, minority, etc) will all factor in. You obviously can't be a C student, but decent grades and a good presentation of yourself in your app will help quite a bit.

[newtothegame]

Here's an insider tip for all of you applying to Harvard. You can start out in the MTS program which does not require the GRE and move over to the MDiv later with no formal application process. I know because I am a student there now and I did it.

Yes, I was admitted with NO GRE SCORE.

Good luck

[pepper]

GRE's are required for both MDiv & MTS programs at Harvard for the first time this year. Previously, only the ThD applicants needed to submit the GRE.

[sacklunch]

True, Harvard required the GRE for the MTS (started this year). I have a 3.75, good recs, good SOP, good writing sample, and was denied. I think a lot of it had to do with my GRE score (at least I think).

-Nick