Chicago MAPH - thoughts?

[Minnesotan]

I realize, after looking back at my comment, that my joke about the funding at Chicago could deter people from applying. I merely meant that you should go into the decision with eyes wide open. Although the MAPH program is something of a cash cow, it can also be very rewarding.

I have a friend who went through the MAPH and was extremely happy with the atmosphere and rigor of the program. Sure, he's probably even more in debt now, but it might have paved the way toward a better academic future.

I would think carefully about what you want, and how many loans you're willing to take out to get there.

[conor610]

I completed MAPH last year and have now been accepted, in English, to PhD programs at Virginia, WashU, UCLA, and Michigan. I have MAPH friends who have also gotten in (again, in English) to Berkeley, Penn, and Princeton. So it does seem to be a useful program, anyway, for those who are interested in continuing their graduate study.

It was also a great year in its own right. The rigor was incredible--we worked harder, by a wide margin, than first-year PhD students--and my fellow students were challenging, engaged, and also quite a lot of fun. The preceptors were (or mine was, anyway) fantastic resources and always eager to help defuse any moments of terrible stress. I really can't say enough good things about the program--the opportunity to work with great professors like Richard Strier and Bob von Hallberg (most profs are excellent about taking time to work with MAPHers and really take your research seriously) and to do high-level graduate work for a year before deciding whether to pursue a PhD is unbeatable, in my opinion. (I did apply to the UC PhD program, not directly to MAPH, but in retrospect I am so glad things worked out like they did. Now I know for sure that the PhD route is right for me.)

If anyone else has any questions about the program, I'd be happy to answer them.

[earlyamerican]

Ah, UChicago: Just doing their small part to ensure that the ruling class keeps its death grip on the intelligentsia.

I've worked in several admissions offices, and their whole "No PhD, but we luuuurve you and will give you 20% off your MA if you BUY NOW!" is some ghetto-style 3-card-monte setup. Scandalous. I've seen more sophisticated maneuvers from For Profit Universities.

I reconsidered applying when I saw their bullshit financial aid application. I forget the wording now, but it was something like "You're not likely to get funding, so please list your sources of funding (parents, friends, trust funds, etc.) available to you in the upcoming year."

They annoyed me with "trust funds." I mean, we all have them, right? Like who doesn't? *eyeroll* But "friends?" This made me laugh. WTF? That's some friend to shell out 45,000 a year. Please. Or do they intend their educational services for those with wealthy grandfatherly benefactors, all Mr. Brownlow style?

So just because I couldn't resist, I honestly wrote:

Source: California Lottery (pending winning numbers)

Amount: Mega Millions

If I had known about their cheeseball recruiting strategy with the MA consolation prize, I probably would have said "screw em" and applied elsewhere. I already had GRE scores and letters being sent, but what a turnoff. The faculty I want to work with seemed lovely, despite having some kind of bailout-sucking AIG executive in charge of MA recruiting and application wording.

ETA: I realize I'm about a year late to the party on this, but I was frankly horrified to discover this little MA trick via the archives for Chicago admissions/rejections.

[Genghis]

Ok, rejected for philosophy, but accepted with half tuition into MAPH as well as a super personalized e-mail explaining why they wanted me. Plus, parents in the area so no rent expenses, etc. (Really, the cost isn't much of an issue because of this.) Still waiting on five schools, but I'm wondering if people have thoughts on this ... if it comes down to this and a "safety" that I am interested in but not in love with and that isn't well ranked, what should I do? I think I'm a pretty good applicant with a few holes that could be cleaned up by spending another year in this program. I would also find it difficult to start a program at a safety and leave with just an MA, and not even sure that it's the best move if I want to get into stronger programs. I know there are people out there who are very critical of this program as a cash-cow, but I've also heard very good things. In my case, the cost issue isn't so bad. Any thoughts?

OP, if you have no problems affording it, which you seemed to indicate, and don't have better options, why not go for it? I'm sure it will be a great educational experience. On this site, and in the admissions process in general, it' s easy to become obsessed with future potential, placement, prestige, etc- and I am no exception to such. But when we step away from that, we are all here because we love learning. That is what it comes down to for me- what is the best education you can afford? Most of us have to rely on full-funding packages, but if you don't, why not take a year out of your life to study with some of the finest scholars in the world? Who cares if the program is not as well-respected/advantageous to our careers as we would like?

If MAPH would have been a financial reality for me (which it isn't, as they only offer at most half-tuition), I would have applied there, and possibly had the best year of my life studying with academics I hold in high regard. As it is, however, I will very likely end up at a second-tier school with second-tier academics.

[personable]

Hey there,

I did MAPH in 2006-7 and just want to say that I had an amazing time. I met the most wonderful people. Yes, it's $$$, and yes, it's intense for many, but it was one of the most worthwhile decisions I've ever made. I do want to note that I was there when the "old guard" left and new directors came the following year. This will be their third year, I think, coming up, so they will have worked out kinks and have gotten more established, which is good. The main thing about MAPH was the sense of community that it fostered. If you go, take advantage of all the community-oriented stuff they have going on, like the weekly open bars on Fridays in the first quarter. You will meet really special, smart people, and have a MAPH alum community for the rest of your life, if you want it. The staff/admin are awesome, too.

Advice: Visit during campus days!!! The vibe you get that weekend will define the vibe of the following years in many ways, so get there and decide if it (and the campus) feels like YOU.

However, if you go, don't go with the sense that you didn't get into a PhD program and are there by default. Rather, be proud to be there. It's very rigorous and and you will learn a lot.

Good luck!

[Swagato]

Hi everyone.

I figured after successfully completing (well, almost) the first quarter at the MAPH, I would post a short update.

First off: yes, obviously it's expensive. If money is your deal-or-no-deal factor, then you should decide based on that. I live off-campus so my living expenses are lower, and so far my budget indicates I am well under the "sticker price" quoted by UChicago. So I'm basically paying their tuition price and all, but saving on the residential factor. I'm not working part-time. More on that later.

The program itself: I'm in the Cinema and Media Studies track. I'd hoped for PhD admissions right after BA, but I just didn't have the credentials and experience. 2 undergrad film courses combined with a dodgy GPA, etc. I had mitigating factors, and I definitely have extremely strong reasons for wishing to pursue an academic career, which evidently were successfully conveyed in my application since I ended up waitlisted at Emory for their MA program and admitted to Chicago. I will say that the MAPH is ridiculously intense. My assigned readings for one film course alone have more (by volume) than the readings for the 'Core' course. By assigned readings I mean readings assigned by my professor in addition to the required texts. And this does not include suggested readings. I will say that, based on the three courses I'm taking for credit this quarter and the fourth course I'm sitting in on, I have easily had an average daily reading quota of 2-300 pages. Probably more since it doesn't take into account online research/library raids, etc. That is why I, at least, cannot combine a part-time job with this. Your mileage may vary.

The MAPH is what you make of it. I'm told that about 118 were admitted out of a total of nearly 900 (which includes PhD redirects and direct-MAPH applications). Is it selective? Clearly, since it is about 1 for every 9. Is it hyper-selective? No. Is it worth it? Depends on your motivation. I've grouped the people around me into two categories. One includes people who don't really have a clue but they have money. They're lured by the Chicago cachet. There's a guy in my film track who has absolutely no clue what he wants to do later, yet he's asked a superstar to be his advisor. I have no clue why he's even here. He finds theory boring, he rarely has any contributions, and sleeps in half the classes. Then there's another chap who's more into documentaries (making them)...well hello, Chicago isn't that interested in -making- film. And then there's a friend of mine and myself, who are hell-bent on theory and analysis and what not, and I would say we're the only two in the CMS track who are really set on a PhD after this. This is the second group. People who are able to exploit the MAPH for its great opportunities for cross-disciplinary work and work with leading scholars (who are surprisingly approachable) to their benefit.

The Core course and the weekly social hours do foster a great sense of community, whether academic or otherwise. Yes, Chicago has its parties too. The vast majority of people here seem to be in English or Philosophy. CMS has just 5 people. Surprisingly low, but hey, less competition...

I understand there is no bias (at least in CMS) against MAPH applications to Chicago's PhD. They try to take at least one from the MAPH and the rest from outside.

So if you're planning on a PhD and you just don't have the credibility yet, or if you want to test the waters first, then the MAPH could be the single-best shot of mojo you need. We really do more work than the first/second year PhDs, because we're the ones covering a standard two-year program's worth in a single year, while they..have more time. Survive and best the intensity, and live on Ramen (or learn to cook, you scrubs), and the MAPH can get you into those dreamy top-5 programs.

[Bill H.]

As a potential MAPH person for next Fall (redirected from the Committee on Social Thought), I've got some questions for those of you out there who did the program:

1. How'd you afford it? Are there many TA/RA options? Is it feasible to have an on- or off-campus part-time job?

2. My long-term goal is a PhD -- is MAPH a reasonable venue for this?

3. In general, especially for you English/Philosophy/Theory folks, what are your pro and con thoughts on the program?

Thanks!

Bill

[blackshirt]

As a potential MAPH person for next Fall (redirected from the Committee on Social Thought), I've got some questions for those of you out there who did the program:

1. How'd you afford it? Are there many TA/RA options? Is it feasible to have an on- or off-campus part-time job?

2. My long-term goal is a PhD -- is MAPH a reasonable venue for this?

3. In general, especially for you English/Philosophy/Theory folks, what are your pro and con thoughts on the program?

Thanks!

Bill

I don't have much information for you, as I didn't actually do the program, but 2 acquaintances of mine did. One is now a PhD student at Stanford; the other is working in arts administration, though I believe she plans to reenter academia in a few years.

The former of the two spoke to me a bit about her MAPH experience, which she definitely enjoyed and was thankful for; she found it to be fast-paced but good for her, and she thought it did a good job of helping her further develop her interests.

I believe there have also been a few other threads about the MAPH here on gradcafe; you may want to comb through them for a wider variety of perspectives.

Good luck!

[Bill H.]

I don't have much information for you, as I didn't actually do the program, but 2 acquaintances of mine did. One is now a PhD student at Stanford; the other is working in arts administration, though I believe she plans to reenter academia in a few years.

The former of the two spoke to me a bit about her MAPH experience, which she definitely enjoyed and was thankful for; she found it to be fast-paced but good for her, and she thought it did a good job of helping her further develop her interests.

I believe there have also been a few other threads about the MAPH here on gradcafe; you may want to comb through them for a wider variety of perspectives.

Good luck!

Thanks, blackshirt -- I appreciate the info!

[Bill H.]

I don't have much information for you, as I didn't actually do the program, but 2 acquaintances of mine did. One is now a PhD student at Stanford; the other is working in arts administration, though I believe she plans to reenter academia in a few years.

The former of the two spoke to me a bit about her MAPH experience, which she definitely enjoyed and was thankful for; she found it to be fast-paced but good for her, and she thought it did a good job of helping her further develop her interests.

I believe there have also been a few other threads about the MAPH here on gradcafe; you may want to comb through them for a wider variety of perspectives.

Good luck!

Out of curiosity, blackshirt, what is your acquaintance at Stanford doing the PhD in? I applied to and was rejected from MTL this year.

—Bill

[merelynn]

I just got a letter from the MAPH people, too, re-directed from art history. I can't even figure out how much it costs. They said they were sending an email, but the letter is dated a week ago and I haven't received any emails. Where's all this convenient information on the website they're talking about?

[Swagato]

I just got a letter from the MAPH people, too, re-directed from art history. I can't even figure out how much it costs. They said they were sending an email, but the letter is dated a week ago and I haven't received any emails. Where's all this convenient information on the website they're talking about?

Costs are indeed tricky to figure out since they are measured per course + other expenses (living, etc.). See the financial aid/related areas of the University's main site.

The MAPH's website is, simply, http://maph.uchicago.edu

Good luck.

[Chi-grad]

There are a lot of wide ranging opinions about MAPH, and as a recent graduate of the program, it is certainly a to each-his/her-own type of program. Namely, there is UofC and then there is MAPH. The program does not garner respect from the university faculty at large. Many regard it, quite accurately, as a cash cow intended to finance research. As such, many members of the program get the occasional supercilious glare from faculty. Yet, the program still distinguishes itself for its usefulness to certain "buyers."

I was one of those buyers. Out of a highly ranked northeast liberal arts college, my gpa suffered due to early collegiate merrymaking. The Ph.D. applications were a bust despite near perfect GREs, but I got a 1/2-off MA scholarship offer at Rochester and a not-a-dime-off offer at UofC. I could take the discount at Rochester, but be left with a mid-range MA and some debt. Or I could attend the cash cow, but have the luxury of proving that I could handle the rigor of a top-tier university. I chose MAPH because of the upside: it could give me a chance to show doctoral programs that I was serious about improving my gpa while also amassing more experience in my field. The 9-month pace and austere surroundings nearly broke my spirits on many occasion. My emotional health, though awkward to discuss here, was not well because of the pressures of taking 8 courses and finishing a thesis in such a short window. But in the end, I found an advisor who encouraged me and I developed a thesis that would eventually serve as a strong writing sample. My advisor even went so far as to critique my paper post-MAPH. With his support, I am now attending a top 10 doctoral film program with full funding.

So choosing Chicago was the right one for me, despite the debt I incurred, because it opened up the potential of pursuing a Ph.D. at a top university.

However, MAPH is not deserving of this praise. It was my advisor who took an interest, not MAPH. When I asked a member of the MAPH department if she would be willing to help my application by drafting a letter of recommendation, she acted abrupt and rude in her refusal. She said it was not her place to help, but the faculty's. With such a short program, getting letters is a difficult endeavor; thus, having the comfort of one coming from the program would certainly be appreciated. But MAPH would not deign to help, while at the same time, film professors within my chosen field were very willing despite their short time knowing me. This made me lose respect for MAPH, yet gain respect for Chicago professors at large. MAPH is there to generate cash and they act accordingly. If you attend MAPH because you expect it to help you, it will not. For example, a friend and member of my cohort also got no support from the program, but managed to get into an Ivy Philosophy program because of the caring support of one professor. This trend of individual professors stepping up in the place of MAPH is common.

Furthermore, be warned that the MAPH CORE course can serve to derail your transcript. This "edifying" course is by far the most frustrating because of its vague and unwieldy pedagogy. It neither elucidated scholars nor provided us the tools to elucidate these scholars to others. And in this failure, the required course also had the added bonus of "rewarding" students with harsh grades. In more simpler terms, this is not like the UofC version of gym class -- it is the most difficult for many attendees despite being a required course. My Chicago transcript, along with my friend's, found its only blemish in this non-discipline requirement. We were among many. How the program justifies giving out B's and B-'s to students getting A's and A-'s in their chosen fields is appalling considering this B or B- can irreparably damage an otherwise impeccable transcript. It is as if this one slipshod class is designed to keep students back from doctoral success, not to urge them forward. As a sidenote, the course's harsh/arbitrary grading criteria makes no sense from a business point of view. Shepherding more students onto doctoral success via clarity and consistency in CORE would make MAPH more desirable to applicants, not less. Hence, wouldn't improving the quality and grade distribution of CORE be a pressing priority because of its benefit to the program long term?

To reiterate, it was Chicago's faculty, not MAPH itself, who I credit with my doctoral success. Keep this in mind if you attend MAPH -- do not get bogged down in the program's song and dance. Play your own game at Chicago and you will get ahead. Doing things the "MAPH way" will lead you astray.

If you are looking to improve your application for the purposes of doctoral aspirations, MAPH is very much worth considering. Just don't look to them for support; get it elsewhere. And if you are looking purely at the M.A., you should reconsider. Attending MAPH for an MA without any intention of pursuing the Ph.D. indicates that you are willing to spend $60,000 on a non-technical/skill-based education that barely hones an undergraduate B.A. Putting this type of money on the table for such a small upside is not a wise investment in such a difficult economy. Yet this is what many of my cohort did -- attend with no aspirations towards the Ph.D. And now they are shackled with debt and underwhelming job choices. I hope those of you not looking to explore academia post-MA avoid this program, because it is not right to be saddled with such debt without a developed skill-set to show for it.

Edited July 8, 2011 by Chi-grad

[ZeeMore21]

I turned down the Chicago MAPH program last year because I didn't receive any financial aid...this program definitely came off as a cash cow and nothing else. I received tuition remission from another program and never looked back. Best decision I made.

[Swagato]

I completed the MAPH this past June. What Chi-grad said is, in effect, spot on. The University of Chicago is clearly a place of dizzying opportunities and resources. The MAPH, per se, offers you a gateway into that world. It holds your hand for a few weeks, but after that you truly are on your own. My sense of the program was that it is meant to do something very specific. On one hand, it rapidly weeds out chaff from grain. People who simply cannot handle it, or get disoriented within it, or otherwise lose their footing...it's a good thing. Rather than allow them to continue a futile PhD and an unrewarding life afterward, they can simply realise, right now within the MAPH, that an academic life is not for them. At the end, they'll still have a Master's from a world-renowned institution, and they can do what they wish with it. Or they can even withdraw, if they choose to! On the other hand, for those who both have the aptitude for and the determination/vision for a PhD and an academic career, the MAPH is the best thing that can happen. They can, and do, quickly grasp the enormity of resources allowed by the MAPH. Essentially, you're free to do what you will. So, it is entirely up to you to craft a course program, stick to it, alter it, network with faculty and scholars, establish a reputation, nourish relationships, and in general, lay down the groundwork for a successful academic future.

Is tuition high? Of course it is. Is it worth it? Only if you can make it worth it. Some do, and some don't. My only concern during my whole year was that the Core course is, perhaps, a bit of a shock. Especially to people who did not already have the kind of rigorous and intellectually demanding aptitude that UChicago expects as a matter of routine. Other than that, though, I have zero regrets.

[ZeeMore21]

Do you get your money back if you do decide to drop out of the program?

[Swagato]

I doubt it. I don't really see how someone can enroll for an entire quarter and take courses and then expect to get their money for the quarter back if they decide to leave at the end of that quarter. Tuition is billed on a per-quarter basis, so I would assume that you would have to pay for the quarter that you were enrolled. I wouldn't expect a refund in such a case. On the other hand there may be a "withdraw by" date which does allow for such refunds, but I never checked.

[lyonessrampant]

I did MAPH as well. Someone did withdraw and if you withdraw by the first few weeks of the quarter you get a refund of some amount, but I don't know what it was. I had a good MAPH experience, but a lot of people in my cohort didn't. If you get a funded MA offer, definitely ALWAYS take that. I got partially funded at UC and still took on quite a bit of debt compared to my undergrad.