IR degree or Language Degree

[irhopefull2010]

I am almost decided between a fully-funded language degree and an MA in IR from Yale with partial funding possibilities, but am wondering what people think....

Can a degree in a language, especially a less commonly taught language (Arabic, Persian, Chinese etc.) help you land the same kind of jobs that an IR degree would? My language program is not phonetics- or philology specific, but rather involves courses in the target language related to history and poli sci.

I am hoping to work for the State department or UN when I'm done and am just wondering if I all paths lead to the same destination or if an IR degree gaurantees you certain advantages.

[fadeindreams]

The IR degree would seem to be more flexible. I think, however, that you could make a language degree work in much the same way that you could an IR degree. Of course, it still depends on how the school you are going to is regarded (not just in program, but overall) and whether or not you can obtain professional experience while pursuing the degree (via internship over the summer, etc). I think you could make it work if you are motivated enough and certainly full funding is nothing to scoff at. If Yale would put you in such debt that you would feel like an indentured servant for the better part of a decade it probably isn't worth it!

[understatement700]

Is the language program the flagship program by any chance?

[irhopefull2010]

The IR degree would seem to be more flexible. I think, however, that you could make a language degree work in much the same way that you could an IR degree. Of course, it still depends on how the school you are going to is regarded (not just in program, but overall) and whether or not you can obtain professional experience while pursuing the degree (via internship over the summer, etc). I think you could make it work if you are motivated enough and certainly full funding is nothing to scoff at. If Yale would put you in such debt that you would feel like an indentured servant for the better part of a decade it probably isn't worth it!

Thanks Fadeindreams, that is the line of thinking that I have been following. Sometimes it's just hard to figure out which skill set is more profitable once developed.

[irhopefull2010]

Is the language program the flagship program by any chance?

Yes it is. why do you ask?

[understatement700]

Just curious because I've been looking into the flagship program for the language I want to study but I wasn't sure just how similar the curriculum would be to getting an IR degree, but I must say I am no expert on the program and don't really know how the different language programs differ in this regard. I've thought that spending the two years learning the language would be great and some of the coursework relevant but I always figured that I would probably need some other degree too. But I could be off base on this. Maybe someone else could chime in.

[irhopefull2010]

any one care to chime in?

[flyers29]

Eh, the two ways to really break into the State Dept (becoming a foreign service officer or the PMF program for civil service positions) are based more on how you do on their exams than the specifics of your resume. On the whole though, I think there are pros and cons to both. An IR degree will make you more versatile, but there are probably a lot more people with IR degrees than those who can speak a critical language fluently, so you'd be set apart from the pack by going the language route. On the other hand, there's always the great debate about just how "fluent" one is without spending a couple of years living in that country, so might depend on the scope of your language skills as well. Ultimately, I wouldn't say one is absolutely necessary over the other. Have you looked into area studies programs that require a combination of both?

Edited April 13, 2010 by flyers29

[cosmike10]

i think both degrees would get you a career in international relations, but with different job descriptions. An IR degree would let you be more included in policymaking and management, while a language degree seems like it would tailor more towards working with people or advocacy. Thats just what I think, I don't know for sure.

[carpecc]

IRhopeful2010, What’s your language background?

I would definitely go with the IR degree if you can afford it, especially since you want to work for the State Department or UN. There’s a couple of reasons.

An MA in language is a humanities degree, it is training you to be proficient in a language for a translations, research, teaching and academia. It doesn’t provide you with any practical professional training. Just the language alone isn’t enough anymore based on my nine years in China. The UN and State Department have plenty of local people, all over the world, providing language support in their native language. You’ll be competing with the locals for jobs and, if you a pursue a difficult language, would in some ways have trouble gaining the proficiency to be competitive for jobs at local salaries.

With the IR degree you’ll get professional training, advanced economic training, a greater understanding of international issues and be better suited to advise and manage projects. Of course being proficient in the language you want to work in will open a lot of doors, but there’s plenty of other foreigners who’ve learned that language (unless it’s Arabic or Farsi, I hear those are in demand. There’s more and more Chinese speaking foreigners. Arabic is really tough though) and might have more in country time than you.

I’m assuming you already have some language background and would be able to continue your studies while at Yale? Of course you can also take summer intensive courses or study in country for a semester or two after you graduate. There’s plenty of these available, and some are very inexpensive. For example you can study in some parts of China with programs that aren’t affiliated with US universities for USD600 a semester. The better programs of course are more expensive but still.

[irhopefull2010]

IRhopeful2010, What’s your language background?

I would definitely go with the IR degree if you can afford it, especially since you want to work for the State Department or UN. There’s a couple of reasons.

An MA in language is a humanities degree, it is training you to be proficient in a language for a translations, research, teaching and academia. It doesn’t provide you with any practical professional training. Just the language alone isn’t enough anymore based on my nine years in China. The UN and State Department have plenty of local people, all over the world, providing language support in their native language. You’ll be competing with the locals for jobs and, if you a pursue a difficult language, would in some ways have trouble gaining the proficiency to be competitive for jobs at local salaries.

With the IR degree you’ll get professional training, advanced economic training, a greater understanding of international issues and be better suited to advise and manage projects. Of course being proficient in the language you want to work in will open a lot of doors, but there’s plenty of other foreigners who’ve learned that language (unless it’s Arabic or Farsi, I hear those are in demand. There’s more and more Chinese speaking foreigners. Arabic is really tough though) and might have more in country time than you.

I’m assuming you already have some language background and would be able to continue your studies while at Yale? Of course you can also take summer intensive courses or study in country for a semester or two after you graduate. There’s plenty of these available, and some are very inexpensive. For example you can study in some parts of China with programs that aren’t affiliated with US universities for USD600 a semester. The better programs of course are more expensive but still.

Just a day left, and you're bringing up some good points to help with this decision!

Without giving too much away, I will say that I am taking a Middle East language.

The Masters program is actually geared towards being able to use the target language in the workplace and other professional settings, and to reach native to near-native fluency. You have to be at the ACTFL advanced low level to get in, so I'm not that worried about gaining REAL fluency... it at least seems very probable. I can watch tv and hold discussion in my target language already----( but it's clear that I'm not a native speaker :-/). The second year of the program is spent in a country that speaks the language studying at a local university and interning somewhere, so I thought maybe that this kind of makes up for lack of IR-rigorous training.

oh, the fellowship for this program also comes with a NSEP service requirement, i.e. I have to work for the U.S. gov for a few years after graduation. But, employment is not guaranteed and I don't know what kind of priority I would receive in the hiring process. I can't find stats on how many people are actually able to find gainful employment after.

Flyers, I have thought about just continuing with language at Yale, but I was an area studies major in undergrad. When talking to area studies friends, it seems that you miss out by having just one or two classes in your schedule that pertains to the language. Honestly that's how I felt in undergrad too. Plus, it seemed to make more sense to pursue an IR degree with a regional focus because sometimes employers don't know what to make of an area studies degree.

Yale seemed awesome (which is why I applied), but I would be looking at around of 60-70 grand in debt, plus what I have left over from undergrad. The main question is, and guess it's what a lot people on this board have been asking, is it worth the debt? will it get me the job+salary that is significantly higher than the language degree would?

[irhopefull2010]

p.s. I'm surprised at the stiffening of competition among Chinese-Speaking foreigners. Chinese I believe is one of the most difficult languages to master, even more so than Arabic or Persian (or so thought) because of the writing system. Good to know.

[carpecc]

p.s. I'm surprised at the stiffening of competition among Chinese-Speaking foreigners. Chinese I believe is one of the most difficult languages to master, even more so than Arabic or Persian (or so thought) because of the writing system. Good to know.

Yea it is quite interesting. Chinese isn't too tough to get to an proficiency good enough for office work, but harder of course than the romance languages. I hear that Persian and Arabic have really tough grammar. Chinese grammar is pretty simple, so many people learn to speak without being able to read or write.

A more important factor is that there are more talented Chinese people that can speak good English nowadays. Companies have been doing more localizing and are more interested in cultivating local talent at a cheaper price tag then paying a big salary to some transient foreigner. Still though, being able to speak and read Chinese can open up a lot of opportunities unavailable to non Chinese speakers.

It sounds like your language MA fellowship is pretty substantial and the program is pretty noteworthy. A couple of years of intense language training for free is a worthy investment, you definitely won't regret it. Plus you're right, at Yale IR you won't exactly have time to dedicate to language learning.

I'd say do the language MA, you can always do the IR down the road. Plus with that language expertise and a couple of years of experience abroad, you'll get more out of your IR and will probably get better funding. Good luck!