Do I have a chance in philosophy if I don't have near perfect grades?

[PhilAnthro]

Hi!

I want to apply to PhD programs in philosophy (in the US). My undergrad degree is in philosophy from an Ivy League university. However my GPA is not good (3.5). There is an upward trend in my grades and I have a good reason for my bad grades in the beginning but to make things worse, one of the classes I took during these dark times was logic and I got a C in it. The truth is I should have failed this class because I didn't attend the classes as I was struggling with mental health issues and my professor was nice enough and understanding of my situation so they just gave me a C instead of failing me. I took a leave of absence for a year and worked on my mental health and came back doing much better and getting good grades and even writing a thesis and graduating with honors but I'm afraid that C in logic and the overall low GPA would haunt me. I have a good GRE with high verbal and quant scores so maybe that would redeem me. I am also confident I could write a good writing sample and SOP and I have good recommendation letters. 

I have thought about applying to political science/international relations/religious studies programs since I have a background in those areas too and these programs seem to be somewhat less competitive and more forgiving of lower GPAs than philosophy programs but I really just want to study philosophy and nothing else satisfies me. But it seems that I would need a near perfect GPA to get in (and without a C in logic!) I don't mind attending a lower ranked program at all and I just want to study philosophy. But even lower ranked schools seem to have ridiculously high standards and I don't know if it's worth applying. 

I would appreciate it if you could tell me if it is possible to be accepted to philosophy programs with my credentials (granted that I do really well in other parts of my application.)

Thank you so much for reading

[steadygaze108]

You seem to be in a good place.

Top public schools might be more forgiving than top private schools.

Regarding the latter, you can always apply for the PhD and mention you'd be open to be admitted to an MA instead.

Take a look at the New School MA to PHD Philosophy track - it seems to be a seamless transition without having to apply for the PhD.

https://www.newschool.edu/nssr/ma-philosophy/

[PhilAnthro]

18 minutes ago, steadygaze108 said:

You seem to be in a good place.

Top public schools might be more forgiving than top private schools.

Regarding the latter, you can always apply for the PhD and mention you'd be open to be admitted to an MA instead.

Take a look at the New School MA to PHD Philosophy track - it seems to be a seamless transition without having to apply for the PhD.

https://www.newschool.edu/nssr/ma-philosophy/

Thank you! I have considered applying for an MA but unfortunately they are not funded and I cannot afford school without funding. As far as I know, the only place with funded MA in philosophy is Central European University. I will apply there but since I'm going to apply to more than one place, I still need to apply to some funded PhD programs and I was wondering which ones are within my reach (if any)

[steadygaze108]

The net cost for the MA in PHilosophy at Tufts is only around $2k.

https://as.tufts.edu/philosophy/current-students/graduate-programs/ma-philosophy

https://as.tufts.edu/philosophy/prospective-students/graduate-programs/graduate-admissions-faqs

[steadygaze108]

Also, see Princeton's Predoctoral Fellowship Initiative: "The pre-doctoral fellowship is a one year, fully funded fellowship that includes an offer of regular admission to the sponsoring doctoral program the following year. The fellowship is intended for students who would benefit from an additional year of training before formally entering the sponsoring department’s Ph.D. program."

https://graddiversity.princeton.edu/pre-doctoral-fellowship-initiative

[PhilAnthro]

13 hours ago, steadygaze108 said:

Also, see Princeton's Predoctoral Fellowship Initiative: "The pre-doctoral fellowship is a one year, fully funded fellowship that includes an offer of regular admission to the sponsoring doctoral program the following year. The fellowship is intended for students who would benefit from an additional year of training before formally entering the sponsoring department’s Ph.D. program."

https://graddiversity.princeton.edu/pre-doctoral-fellowship-initiative

Wow this looks great! I would have never found this on my own. Thank you so much!

[Gitbashed]

From the perspective of someone with less-than-stellar grades, who just made it through admissions this season, and who isn't from an ivy league school: You need to cast your net a bit broader than some, but you're in a pretty good place. It might be worth it to complete an MA first and hone in on your writing and pick a topical subject. This process of generating a writing sample goes best if you are working with a faculty advisor, and spending a good deal of time on it. Your writing sample, along with stellar MA grades can swing the outcome of applications drastically. 

[GradStudent987]

Someone with a 3.2 got into Yale this year, according to the results page. So anything's possible. Just give the writing sample everything you've got.

[Mischief]

On 3/30/2023 at 5:57 AM, PhilAnthro said:

Hi!

I want to apply to PhD programs in philosophy (in the US). My undergrad degree is in philosophy from an Ivy League university. However my GPA is not good (3.5). There is an upward trend in my grades and I have a good reason for my bad grades in the beginning but to make things worse, one of the classes I took during these dark times was logic and I got a C in it. The truth is I should have failed this class because I didn't attend the classes as I was struggling with mental health issues and my professor was nice enough and understanding of my situation so they just gave me a C instead of failing me. I took a leave of absence for a year and worked on my mental health and came back doing much better and getting good grades and even writing a thesis and graduating with honors but I'm afraid that C in logic and the overall low GPA would haunt me. I have a good GRE with high verbal and quant scores so maybe that would redeem me. I am also confident I could write a good writing sample and SOP and I have good recommendation letters. 

I have thought about applying to political science/international relations/religious studies programs since I have a background in those areas too and these programs seem to be somewhat less competitive and more forgiving of lower GPAs than philosophy programs but I really just want to study philosophy and nothing else satisfies me. But it seems that I would need a near perfect GPA to get in (and without a C in logic!) I don't mind attending a lower ranked program at all and I just want to study philosophy. But even lower ranked schools seem to have ridiculously high standards and I don't know if it's worth applying. 

I would appreciate it if you could tell me if it is possible to be accepted to philosophy programs with my credentials (granted that I do really well in other parts of my application.)

Thank you so much for reading

It happens, but usually people in your situation do an MA first.

[Marcus_Aurelius]

On 3/30/2023 at 11:15 AM, PhilAnthro said:

Thank you! I have considered applying for an MA but unfortunately they are not funded and I cannot afford school without funding. As far as I know, the only place with funded MA in philosophy is Central European University. I will apply there but since I'm going to apply to more than one place, I still need to apply to some funded PhD programs and I was wondering which ones are within my reach (if any)

There are several of funded MAs! Search threads here for more info.

Like most applicants, you'll be judged most on your writing sample and letters. Address the early poor grades in your statement of purpose, and perhaps have a letter writer mention it.

[PhilAnthro]

53 minutes ago, Marcus_Aurelius said:

There are several of funded MAs! Search threads here for more info.

Like most applicants, you'll be judged most on your writing sample and letters. Address the early poor grades in your statement of purpose, and perhaps have a letter writer mention it.

Thank you! That is helpful advice

If the writing sample is indeed the most important part of the application then I think I have a pretty good chance (I'm really confident of my philosophical writing abilities and especially this specific writing sample I've prepared)

But I've heard that they may not even read your sample if they see that your transcript is trash. I guess it varies across departments tho. For example I read a blog post written by a professor from Rutgers that they look at transcripts and letters first before moving to the writing sample. But I have also seen professors and department homepages mention that the writing sample is the most important part of the application. 

I will definitely look for funded MAs and apply to as many as I can but I honestly think I don't need it. I didn't do bad in logic because I didn't know the subject material, I just didn't go to class and didn't do assignments and whatnot. Also for the second half of my undergraduate studies (after I turned my life around) I never received anything below A- in my philosophy classes. As I mentioned I wrote a pretty good thesis which carried my mediocre grades into graduating with honors. Oh and I took two graduate seminars and did pretty well in those. Hopefully the admissions committees will agree that I'm ready for PhD studies, but yeah I should probably apply to MA programs too just in case

Edited April 4, 2023 by PhilAnthro

[Marcus_Aurelius]

On 4/3/2023 at 11:55 PM, PhilAnthro said:

Thank you! That is helpful advice

If the writing sample is indeed the most important part of the application then I think I have a pretty good chance (I'm really confident of my philosophical writing abilities and especially this specific writing sample I've prepared)

But I've heard that they may not even read your sample if they see that your transcript is trash. I guess it varies across departments tho. For example I read a blog post written by a professor from Rutgers that they look at transcripts and letters first before moving to the writing sample. But I have also seen professors and department homepages mention that the writing sample is the most important part of the application. 

I will definitely look for funded MAs and apply to as many as I can but I honestly think I don't need it. I didn't do bad in logic because I didn't know the subject material, I just didn't go to class and didn't do assignments and whatnot. Also for the second half of my undergraduate studies (after I turned my life around) I never received anything below A- in my philosophy classes. As I mentioned I wrote a pretty good thesis which carried my mediocre grades into graduating with honors. Oh and I took two graduate seminars and did pretty well in those. Hopefully the admissions committees will agree that I'm ready for PhD studies, but yeah I should probably apply to MA programs too just in case

I assume you're talking about this paragraph from Alex Guerrero:

"The Director of Graduate Admissions makes an initial cut from the full pool (380) 
down to around 100 applications. That’s the first big cut. I’ve now been in that role for several 
years, and although my process isn’t perfectly precise, I typically make this cut by looking at (1)
grades/transcript, then (2) personal statement, then (3) letters of recommendation—in that order. 
I rarely do more than glance at (4) writing samples at this stage."

If your transcript has a lot of good Philosophy courses and an upward trajectory in your grades, and your statement and letters explain the issue earlier in undergrad, you shouldn't be disqualified at all. But some programs read everyone's sample, I think. In any case, good to apply for a mix of PhD and MA.

[PhilAnthro]

1 hour ago, Marcus_Aurelius said:

I assume you're talking about this paragraph from Alex Guerrero:

"The Director of Graduate Admissions makes an initial cut from the full pool (380) 
down to around 100 applications. That’s the first big cut. I’ve now been in that role for several 
years, and although my process isn’t perfectly precise, I typically make this cut by looking at (1)
grades/transcript, then (2) personal statement, then (3) letters of recommendation—in that order. 
I rarely do more than glance at (4) writing samples at this stage."

If your transcript has a lot of good Philosophy courses and an upward trajectory in your grades, and your statement and letters explain the issue earlier in undergrad, you shouldn't be disqualified at all. But some programs read everyone's sample, I think. In any case, good to apply for a mix of PhD and MA.

Yes that's the one

alright great, thank you so much! I will try my luck