Need to vent about a grade...

[Zimaleah501]

This is sort of a rate-my-profile kind of gig, but not quite so much, since I am well aware of the difficulties I will face getting accepted to grad school. Undergrad GPA: 2.6 in Animal Behavior. Worked at an animal hospital for 2 years, switched my interests to Speech Pathology, and for a year (and currently) I work/ed at a daycare center while going to school for the undergrad level speech prereqisites. GPA from the 6 classes I have taken so far: 3.6.

Three random psychology classes taken at the local community college: B, B, and...C. They were online classes and I took an exam at a wrong time and ended up missing an exam. I contacted the professor as soon as I found the error, weeks ago, and he assured me he would take my overall grade without the missed test into consideration when he put in final grades. I ended up with a 91 in the class without the test, and a 73 with the test and he told me there was nothing he could do (I would have dropped the class and not risked it, but it was after the add/drop period). I know it is still my fault, but I can't help but be sort of upset with the professor as I got a 96 on my final paper and 91 on my final exam...there is very little room for much improvement. And now I am panicking because I was relying on my "I'm a changed student!" improvement for grad school, and this C looks terrible.

In addition, I have very unimpressive GRE scores (580 Verbal, 540 Quant, 5 writing). It's worth noting that I have a Plan B should I not be accepted that is fairly acceptable to me - retake GREs after months of studying (but possibly before they utilize the new format - we will see), I will have 5 more Speech courses under my belt, I will retake the class I got a C in and get the old grade off the record, and hopefully shadow a Speech Pathologist to have an even more impressive letter of recommendation for the next round. All of this while getting another part time job since I wouldn't be in school full time anymore. But I can't erase the past.

I have some solid letters of recommendation, and I was in communication with most of my prospective schools and they encouraged me to apply regardless of my circumstances. Has anyone else been in this situation? Any advice?

[emmm]

No advice, but it's really awful that the instructor is being so inflexible -- especially after he'd told you he would take your circumstances into consideration. It's not as if the missed test was typical of the effort you put forth for the class and the rest of your grades in the class were mediocre. It certainly sounds like an anomaly that he could have easily minimized in his grading. Your plan sounds good, but I'm sorry you're in such a frustration position right now.

[eklavya]

First, you never know what the adcomms are looking for. They might see a spark in you (and your application) beyond the grades and GPA. What accounts the most (from what I've heard) in application review is your research, SoP and LoR. If these three things are rock solid, don't worry.

Second, forget about the B, C, etc. Albeit in different field than yours, I have seen people with horrible grades and stinky GRE from my dept go onto stellar universities. Because they had good research and strong LoRs. So, the advice here is that go ahead and apply with confidence. Of course, apply to some backup-type schools as well, but also apply to big name schools. You never know if you have a chance till you apply.

[starmaker]

Does the community college have some sort of committee on academic affairs that you could petition? It's rather rough that he would drop your grade so much over a misunderstanding, especially when he implied before that he wouldn't. And there being nothing he can do seems like nonsense to me. If he really wanted to help you, he could support you with the bureaucracy in the effort to get your grade changed. He gave the grade in the first place! If he doesn't think you deserve to have your grade changed, that's his prerogative, but he could at least be honest instead of pretending that he's powerless.

If the school actually does allow grades for retakes to replace old grades, rather than simply showing both grades, then for all practical purposes you can erase the past. I realize that you'd rather get in this time, though, rather than next time.

[Zimaleah501]

Does the community college have some sort of committee on academic affairs that you could petition? It's rather rough that he would drop your grade so much over a misunderstanding, especially when he implied before that he wouldn't. And there being nothing he can do seems like nonsense to me. If he really wanted to help you, he could support you with the bureaucracy in the effort to get your grade changed. He gave the grade in the first place! If he doesn't think you deserve to have your grade changed, that's his prerogative, but he could at least be honest instead of pretending that he's powerless.

If the school actually does allow grades for retakes to replace old grades, rather than simply showing both grades, then for all practical purposes you can erase the past. I realize that you'd rather get in this time, though, rather than next time.

Yes, I am beginning the petition process. I decided that his behavior is not excusable, and he should at least have to answer for it if not change my grade. I spent a lot of time studying for that final and working on that last paper...time I could have spent raising my physics grade. And yes, I can erase the past (and I will, if I do not get accepted this spring) in this regard, I was thinking more for my bachelor's degree gpa...that 2.6-2.7 is never going to change. But I am staying as hopeful as I can.

Thanks to everyone for the responses, I really appreciate it!

[StrangeLight]

as someone taking a break from grading my undergrads' exams right now, may i offer my perspective?

i'm fairly certain that the professor owes you nothing. unless his syllabus explicitly stated that one of every student's exam scores would be dropped from his/her final grade, then there is nothing binding that forces him to switch your grade. even though he said in an email that he would ignore that test, he doesn't have to. and other than appealing to him as a fellow human being, there's nothing you can actually do. it was indeed your fault for missing the test and your grade is a consequence of that. appeal if you want to, but you will lose. instead, approach the professor directly and explain your future career plans and try to reason with him. that's the only avenue that might work here, and even then, the prof is well within his right to just say no to you.

as for your chances at grad school (which i realize you did not ask about), many programs will overlook online classes anyway, so your C may or may not ultimately matter. but if all the classes you're taking to get background in your new field are online, if this admissions cycle doesn't pan out for you i would suggest enrolling in traditional college classes for your field.

good luck with your admissions and with getting your grade changed.

[Zimaleah501]

as someone taking a break from grading my undergrads' exams right now, may i offer my perspective?

i'm fairly certain that the professor owes you nothing. unless his syllabus explicitly stated that one of every student's exam scores would be dropped from his/her final grade, then there is nothing binding that forces him to switch your grade. even though he said in an email that he would ignore that test, he doesn't have to. and other than appealing to him as a fellow human being, there's nothing you can actually do. it was indeed your fault for missing the test and your grade is a consequence of that. appeal if you want to, but you will lose. instead, approach the professor directly and explain your future career plans and try to reason with him. that's the only avenue that might work here, and even then, the prof is well within his right to just say no to you.

as for your chances at grad school (which i realize you did not ask about), many programs will overlook online classes anyway, so your C may or may not ultimately matter. but if all the classes you're taking to get background in your new field are online, if this admissions cycle doesn't pan out for you i would suggest enrolling in traditional college classes for your field.

good luck with your admissions and with getting your grade changed.

Thank you for your input. He does not owe me the grade - I do feel it is sort of his job though to provide advice for his class. I pay for this advice, even if it is not immediately related to the material. I realize I very well might lose, but he clearly did not even take the two seconds to look at my grade when I initially emailed him, panicked and not sure what to do and say "yes, this situation is bad, take the withdraw option because even if you get 100s on everything you will have too low of a C for me to bump you". He told me it would be worth it for me to stay in his class, because he could consider the quality of my work when calculating final grades. And maybe it is me being spiteful, but I think that to then follow up by doing anything else is pretty horrible. And if nothing else, I will feel better knowing I got to argue my point and hopefully he will act in a more proper manner next time. Because I told him at the time where my situation had me, and reiterated just yesterday when I received the "woops no B for you" email. If he was going to do the decent thing, he would have then. I also happen to know there are many schools where they ARE, to an extent, required to give the benefit of the doubt in electronic situations like this one which was indisputably an error in a single mouse click. And in the end, I have absolutely nothing to lose by trying, only something to gain.

My programs will not overlook online classes, as I am in a program geared for people who are currently working full time and going to school. There is no school close enough to me (except the community college this debacle is associated with) to take speech courses in person. I am currently working full time and I took one in person class, three online classes. As I said in my original post, I have a viable plan B if this application season does not work out the first time around - including retaking this class. With another (and hopefully better) professor. I am frustrated that people like this exist, because I honestly wasted a lot of time ensuring the A level work when I could have been studying for my other 3 classes, and I am frustrated that he closed his email with "Good luck in graduate school" as though I didn't state in the email I sent to him that this grade was going to be a moderately important factor in that whole process.

[wanderlust07]

Zimaleah,

I'm sorry you've found yourself in an unexpected bind.

Without knowing the full context of the course (number of students, your full interaction with the prof., etc) and as a graduate instructor, I want to reiterate at least part of StrangeLight's advice--keep in mind that your profs. are human beings. It sounds like the instructor here is unlikely to change your grade, which is unfortunate, but that doesn't make him a "debacle." I realize this is an anonymous forum and what you've written here probably bears NO relation to the tenor of your emails to your professor, but since I can clearly sense your frustration I merely remind you that the LAST thing any instructor wants to hear is any assertion along the lines of, "I pay for x." Even if you are formally petitioning through another section of the college, I encourage you to remain calm and respectful toward all parties as you move forward. Also keep in mind that depending on where you end up/how large your field is, people at these institutions are your potential future professors and colleagues--you do indeed have "something to lose" if you leave behind too many ruffled feathers.

Regardless, I think adcomms (in my field, at least--I can't really speak to yours, but I suspect this is similar) are always looking more for indications of potential in grad school and beyond than a perfected applicant (since there's no such thing). In this I am in complete agreement with bhikhaari. If you feel this grade is going to hurt your chances, you could spend a line or so in your SoP stating how it's not a reflection on your upward trend as a student. I don't think this need necessarily spoil your plan to pitch yourself as having turned around your education--you've clearly been working hard. Your work experience and LoRs can only help you, and I would focus on making the portions of the applications under your control as positive and strong as possible.

Best of luck!

[Zimaleah501]

Zimaleah,

I'm sorry you've found yourself in an unexpected bind.

Without knowing the full context of the course (number of students, your full interaction with the prof., etc) and as a graduate instructor, I want to reiterate at least part of StrangeLight's advice--keep in mind that your profs. are human beings. It sounds like the instructor here is unlikely to change your grade, which is unfortunate, but that doesn't make him a "debacle." I realize this is an anonymous forum and what you've written here probably bears NO relation to the tenor of your emails to your professor, but since I can clearly sense your frustration I merely remind you that the LAST thing any instructor wants to hear is any assertion along the lines of, "I pay for x." Even if you are formally petitioning through another section of the college, I encourage you to remain calm and respectful toward all parties as you move forward. Also keep in mind that depending on where you end up/how large your field is, people at these institutions are your potential future professors and colleagues--you do indeed have "something to lose" if you leave behind too many ruffled feathers.

Regardless, I think adcomms (in my field, at least--I can't really speak to yours, but I suspect this is similar) are always looking more for indications of potential in grad school and beyond than a perfected applicant (since there's no such thing). In this I am in complete agreement with bhikhaari. If you feel this grade is going to hurt your chances, you could spend a line or so in your SoP stating how it's not a reflection on your upward trend as a student. I don't think this need necessarily spoil your plan to pitch yourself as having turned around your education--you've clearly been working hard. Your work experience and LoRs can only help you, and I would focus on making the portions of the applications under your control as positive and strong as possible.

Best of luck!

Thanks for the advice. And to clear up confusion, I meant to refer to the situation as a debacle, not the man himself. Do I think he is a very good person? No, because impressions are everything, and to me he was not a good person. I know he isn't evil, or has it out for me. I am mostly venting here, but this is a community college where I am taking random gen ed prerequisites that I never had to take for my undergraduate major. In this case, I really will never see him again. All of my recommendations and speech courses are through a larger university, not this community college.

In the grand scheme of things, I suppose I am more surprised at the overall lack of respect towards me. I would normally NEVER think "I pay for __, give me what I want". But in this case, he made a mistake, and is now refusing to be accountable for it in any way. That is my argument for the committee to contest the grade. As you said, I am not so silly as to insist he give me what I pay for. But at least so far, the committee is leaning in my direction. The person I submitted this to already emailed me back saying that while they are not done investigating, and will finish doing so after break, it sounded like the professor made an error and they were going to communicate with him directly and see if they can "fix it" without having to use the whole petition process.

For anyone who might be taking/retaking prerequisites at community colleges, it is worth remembering that colleges (particularly community colleges) are businesses. While the professor may (and probably rightly should) be insulted at being told their salaries are being paid by the students, in the case of community college, it literally is. He does no research, he has three online classes consisting of 75 students total, all in the one subject. Grading was finished over a month ago when we all turned in our last short essay since the exams are multiple choice and automatically graded by a computer. He has a pretty sweet arrangement set up for himself. And in the end, administrators at community colleges want to minimize the complaints. I asked one of my other professors, one from the larger university I attend, about this situation and they reminded me of this fact. Lucky for me, it seems to be working out that he is correct.

I very much thank all of you for the advice, it was under that advisement that I waited until yesterday to send any complaint form, and had someone else read it for me before I sent it, to be sure I was firm but not disrespectful or unreasonable. Because while I am 99% certain I will never professionally run into this man, I would feel terrible being overtly rude to anyone, let alone a teacher I very much respected until this incident. And even now, I mostly just hope the administrators make him resolve his error in some sense, and he is more careful in the future. And even if he refuses, the school might allow me to take a belated W in the course, and I can retake it during the summer with a different professor. Either way, I am much less panicked.

[rising_star]

Three random psychology classes taken at the local community college: B, B, and...C. They were online classes and I took an exam at a wrong time and ended up missing an exam. I contacted the professor as soon as I found the error, weeks ago, and he assured me he would take my overall grade without the missed test into consideration when he put in final grades. I ended up with a 91 in the class without the test, and a 73 with the test and he told me there was nothing he could do (I would have dropped the class and not risked it, but it was after the add/drop period). I know it is still my fault, but I can't help but be sort of upset with the professor as I got a 96 on my final paper and 91 on my final exam...there is very little room for much improvement. And now I am panicking because I was relying on my "I'm a changed student!" improvement for grad school, and this C looks terrible.

I realize this is harsh so let me preface this post by saying Happy Holidays (sincerely).

I'm going to offer different advice than what you've gotten here and, to be honest, I wish I'd offered it sooner since you should lose your appeal of this grade. Why? Because there's no reason for your grade to be calculated on a different basis than that of any other student enrolled in the course. I am absolutely and completely serious about this. If a student came to me and said "Hey, I misread the syllabus and missed an exam. What do I do?," I would reply by telling them that all they can do is excel in everything else and I would take the missed exam into consideration. Why? Because that's what you always say. It's polite, it's nice, and it's honest. You can consider it when doing the final grades. But here's the thing, you can't just throw out the exam grade for one student and not do it for every single student in the course. Did you really think a 73 would magically round to a 79 which would then round to an 80?

For the record, my advice comes on the heels of numerous students asking me to "be nice" as I calculate their final grades. And, I did try to take improvement and demonstration of course knowledge into consideration when giving students their final grades. But the grade you get is the grade you earn. I can't magically decide that somehow your 73 is worth a B when someone else's is worth a 73. If we (as instructors) did that, then there would be no reason to assign work and every incentive for students to "forget" to take an exam, write a paper, etc. (Note: I am not saying that you did not legitimately forget.) There is absolutely no way that I would give a student that earned a 73 a B in the course. I'd consider rounding up a 78 from a C to a B, depending on the student's performance on other assignments, level of participation, and overall improvement in the course. If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say that this is what your professor meant.

Now, if you're angry that he (I think it's a male prof, right?) didn't more accurately calculate your potential to receive a B, I would flip that around and say that the onus is on you as the student to calculate your grade and know how well you need to do to receive the grade you want in a course. I, and most instructors I know, never calculate final grades for students. There's a syllabus that tells you how much each thing is worth, right? And you know what grades you've gotten, right? So then you can calculate the grades you would need to get an 80% in the course pretty easily using Excel. So why exactly is it your professor's fault that you didn't do what you should have done?

Basically, Zimaleah, you're asking for special treatment because "My GPA is better than this and I would've dropped the course (except I couldn't because it's after the drop/add period)." This is completely unacceptable in graduate school. And, to be honest, I'm surprised the professors of the university you used to attend actually encouraged you to appeal this grade due to the community college wanting to keep its customers happy. I truly hope that you remember this when your future students approach you with the same attitude and sense of entitlement.

In a nutshell, grow up. Take responsibility both for what you did (miss an exam) and did not do (figure out for yourself whether the grade you wanted was achievable). If I were you, I would withdraw that complaint ASAP.

P.S. Just because you won't have that particular professor again, does not mean that others in that department and/or who are friends with that professor will not hear about this.

[shepardn7]

It sounds like a bad situation for both of you.

Given your anger at him, I think I might be misunderstanding the content of his email here. As I understand it, you are angry with the professor because he assured me he would take my overall grade without the missed test into consideration (whatever "into consideration" means, I have no idea. . .seems rather vague, and doesn't sound like he meant "ignore the missed exam") and then gave you a zero for the exam. But all you have is an email in your box saying he would take your overall grade "into consideration," which is not a promise to give you points for the exam or raise your grade to a B by any means. The email as you describe it doesn't imply you could still get a B or would definitely get a B. A C is a passing grade and acceptable to many students. If you calculate your actual grade, you might even see that he bumped a C- to a C for you. From where should those ten extra points come?

Because it's an online course, this is a slightly more complicated situation than its in-class equivalent. But I can tell you that if a student didn't show up to an exam for a non-online course because they simply misread the exam time, most professors would not accommodate him at all, and most would agree that it's reasonable they don't. Missing a whole exam is not a slight misstep. I wouldn't allow a retake, discard the grade, or give a student 50 free points on an exam they didn't take--that would be unethical. I'm not sure why it should be different at a comm. college or online course. When you act as if these places should have different standards, you diminish your C (and Bs). When you say while the professor may (and probably rightly should) be insulted at being told their salaries are being paid by the students, in the case of community college, it literally is and call what this person has a sweet arrangement, you do not gain my sympathies. Perhaps if you ever need to adjunct at a community college and/or teach online courses for (or to supplement) a living, you will understand why.

You also do not gain my sympathies when you say this person should be ordered to change your grade because in this case, he made a mistake, and is now refusing to be accountable for it in any way. You say he "owes me nothing," then say he owes you a higher grade, as if he promised one to you. You keep repeating it was your fault and your mistake, but then continually argue he made a mistake (which I think is still questionable) for which he should be held accountable. But who really made the mistake here? Can you explain why he should not hold you accountable for your mistake and give you the grade you earned? Why you should get the same grade as a student who took the exam? There are more people involved here than just you and the professor, after all. Honestly, I think it would be incredibly nice of him to change your grade (not his "duty" to you, as it sounds he meant he might give your grade a "bump," not a skyrocket into B range), but unfair to other students. I don't personally know a single professor or lowly instructor who wouldn't agree.

I understand your panic, but I must agree with rising_star and StrangeLight. As wonderful as it would be to receive your B, you really didn't earn one, and it would be unfair for you to receive one. I think you should stop resenting and half-blaming the professor (saying he's a "bad person") because he didn't give you one, and try to accept what happened, as well as consider the position you put him in by asking for a B when you received a 73. I also agree with everyone else when they say that this C will not destroy your chances for acceptance. You might want to ask one of your letter writers to address it for you, but if you do so in the SOP, you should keep it brief (as in one sentence or so). And, as you say, you will be able to retake the course next year should you not get accepted. If the school does not approve your petition, all is not lost, so take a deep breath--everything will be okay.

 

Edited December 22, 2010 by sarandipidy

[anthropologygeek]

Professors can't predict your final grade and do consider you actions if say you have a 79.4. I would be livid if a prof gave someone with a 73 a b and I had a 87 and got a b. Not to be mean but you chose not to drop this course and the prof never said he would drop the test. Academics is a small community. Be careful. Actions always have consequences.

[emmm]

I think this is a very difficult situation. I see the validity of the argument people are making that "taking into consideration" does not mean "ignoring." However, I also think it is pretty clear to instructors, especially at CCs with their smaller class sizes, who in the class really knows the material and who doesn't. I have not been teaching for very long, but final grades are rarely a surprise to me. If a student had made his mastery of the material obvious over the course of the term, I don't see why an exam couldn't be dropped. A colleague actually does this for students on a case-by-case basis. If a student really has just one anomalous grade, he will count it much less heavily. As for it not being fair to the other students -- how is it not fair if the instructor would do the same for them?

[StrangeLight]

I think this is a very difficult situation. I see the validity of the argument people are making that "taking into consideration" does not mean "ignoring." However, I also think it is pretty clear to instructors, especially at CCs with their smaller class sizes, who in the class really knows the material and who doesn't. I have not been teaching for very long, but final grades are rarely a surprise to me. If a student had made his mastery of the material obvious over the course of the term, I don't see why an exam couldn't be dropped. A colleague actually does this for students on a case-by-case basis. If a student really has just one anomalous grade, he will count it much less heavily. As for it not being fair to the other students -- how is it not fair if the instructor would do the same for them?

because it is not fair to every other student in the class whose grade could be improved by dropping their worst score, even if their grades throughout the semester were consistent.

[emmm]

because it is not fair to every other student in the class whose grade could be improved by dropping their worst score, even if their grades throughout the semester were consistent.

I haven't seen any cases yet where dropping just one grade would make a truly significant change in the overall grade, but I haven't been teaching for very long, and the class I teach is set up so that there are quite a number of assignments, quizzes, and exams. My problem with the situation described by the OP is that it doesn't seem as though his instructor was honest with him. The OP did not have the information he needed to determine whether to stay in the class or to drop it or to determine how much time and effort to put into completing the course assignments and studying. Time management is always critical, and the instructor misled him with the response he provided, although this might have been unintentional. From what the OP posted, it sounds as if he was led to believe that producing exemplary work for the rest of the course would "save" him from the C (or whatever) that the straight numbers would give him. He would have dropped the class otherwise. I'm assuming he made this clear to his professor. I may have misread the situation, but that was my understanding of it based on the OP's description.

[rising_star]

I haven't seen any cases yet where dropping just one grade would make a truly significant change in the overall grade, but I haven't been teaching for very long, and the class I teach is set up so that there are quite a number of assignments, quizzes, and exams. My problem with the situation described by the OP is that it doesn't seem as though his instructor was honest with him. The OP did not have the information he needed to determine whether to stay in the class or to drop it or to determine how much time and effort to put into completing the course assignments and studying. Time management is always critical, and the instructor misled him with the response he provided, although this might have been unintentional. From what the OP posted, it sounds as if he was led to believe that producing exemplary work for the rest of the course would "save" him from the C (or whatever) that the straight numbers would give him. He would have dropped the class otherwise. I'm assuming he made this clear to his professor. I may have misread the situation, but that was my understanding of it based on the OP's description.

What do you mean when you say that the OP didn't have the information needed? S/he should be fully capable of calculating his or her grade in a course. It's really not that difficult if you look at the syllabus, the grades you have received, and put everything into an Excel spreadsheet. Unless what you're saying is that the OP didn't have the correct information because s/he didn't know exactly what the instructor meant when ze said improvement would be taken into consideration. Because, neither you nor the OP have any proof that the professor did not take this into consideration. So, how can you support your argument that "the instructor misled him with the response he provided"?

For fun, I just recalculated the grade of one of my students from this semester. The student received a C in the course. If I dropped his lowest paper grade, arguing to myself somehow that he just blew the paper but it doesn't indicate his performance in the course, he would get a B. He is one of several students whose grade would be higher if I ignored either one of the papers. But, that's not how the course works. You get graded on the work you turn in. If you need an extension for whatever reason, you ask in advance. It's called taking responsibility for one's actions.

I can't think of a single student where producing exemplary work for the remainder of the semester would cause me to discard one of their grades, without doing so for the rest of the class. And, by the way, if that's what an instructor is going to do, then students will not only take advantage of such a policy but there will be questions (from students, department heads, and administrators) about the usefulness of even assigning that work. I mean, if students can forget to submit a test but still pass the class, why should they take any tests at all?

[Zimaleah501]

What do you mean when you say that the OP didn't have the information needed? S/he should be fully capable of calculating his or her grade in a course. It's really not that difficult if you look at the syllabus, the grades you have received, and put everything into an Excel spreadsheet. Unless what you're saying is that the OP didn't have the correct information because s/he didn't know exactly what the instructor meant when ze said improvement would be taken into consideration. Because, neither you nor the OP have any proof that the professor did not take this into consideration. So, how can you support your argument that "the instructor misled him with the response he provided"?

For fun, I just recalculated the grade of one of my students from this semester. The student received a C in the course. If I dropped his lowest paper grade, arguing to myself somehow that he just blew the paper but it doesn't indicate his performance in the course, he would get a B. He is one of several students whose grade would be higher if I ignored either one of the papers. But, that's not how the course works. You get graded on the work you turn in. If you need an extension for whatever reason, you ask in advance. It's called taking responsibility for one's actions.

I can't think of a single student where producing exemplary work for the remainder of the semester would cause me to discard one of their grades, without doing so for the rest of the class. And, by the way, if that's what an instructor is going to do, then students will not only take advantage of such a policy but there will be questions (from students, department heads, and administrators) about the usefulness of even assigning that work. I mean, if students can forget to submit a test but still pass the class, why should they take any tests at all?

Everything you say makes sense, though I do feel like I should remind (or tell, if I did not do so in an earlier post) that I did not forget to submit an exam. In a situation nearly entirely unique to online classes, I took Exam 3 and submitted it on time for Exam 2 by accident. There is a fair amount of material overlap so I figured it was just a tough exam. I did not realize my mistake until I went to take (and subsequently submit) the next exam (which would have been not just on time, but 5 days early) and realized that I had missed Exam 2. The most similar situation I can apply this to for an in-person class would be if a student completed the wrong paper topic by doing a future one, and turned it in on time. The only difference there is that a person grades those, and a computer grades my exams, so it was not caught sooner than 3 weeks later for the next exam.

[emmm]

Yes, rising_star, that's what I mean -- I thought the OP went to the prof, explained what had happened, and asked if there were any way to still earn a certain grade, otherwise she would drop the class. I'm sure the OP had done the grade calculations and that that was why she was seriously considering dropping. If the desired grade were a mathematical impossibility, and no "special accomodations" were going to be made, the professor should have confirmed this, so that the OP could make her decision. And I don't think the practice of discounting/minimizing one grade is that uncommon. When I went to college, we never got syllabi with all the percentages spelled out (which meant we couldn't do grade calculations . . . ). I've even had professors say that they consider trends.

[rising_star]

Everything you say makes sense, though I do feel like I should remind (or tell, if I did not do so in an earlier post) that I did not forget to submit an exam. In a situation nearly entirely unique to online classes, I took Exam 3 and submitted it on time for Exam 2 by accident. There is a fair amount of material overlap so I figured it was just a tough exam. I did not realize my mistake until I went to take (and subsequently submit) the next exam (which would have been not just on time, but 5 days early) and realized that I had missed Exam 2. The most similar situation I can apply this to for an in-person class would be if a student completed the wrong paper topic by doing a future one, and turned it in on time. The only difference there is that a person grades those, and a computer grades my exams, so it was not caught sooner than 3 weeks later for the next exam.

Serious question: how do you demonstrate your knowledge of material that you never took an exam on? I'm totally curious about this because it's an argument I've heard from students multiple times (I know I didn't actually take that test but if you ask me all the questions I could pass it right now; The wording of the questions was confusing but I know the material and could tell you whatever you want) and one that I have never found credible.

Okay, let me explain how that works in my world, with mock dates. Paper 1 is due October 19. Student mistakenly turns in paper 2, which is due November 12. Given that paper 1 is now several weeks late, and that the syllabus requires a deduction of 5 points per day, the highest grade possible is 23 days late, the highest grade that can be earned is negative. The student later comes and says "Oops" but (as you've stated) blames the instructor and/or website for confusing him/her about which paper was due on which date. And, somehow, the grade for the missed paper (which, technically, is the paper 1 assignment) should be dropped from the grade, according to you. Do I have it right, according to what you're saying?

Do you realize how ridiculous you sound when you blame the website, the professor, and everyone but yourself for not only taking the wrong exam, failing to realize that you did this in a timely fashion (and, since I've taught online I'll go ahead and add that timely means within no more than a week during a semester-long course), and then for blaming the professor for not dropping the grade for Exam 2?

And, Zimaleah, to address emmm's question: Did you directly ask if you could receive a B in the course in spite of missing the exam?

[Zimaleah501]

Serious question: how do you demonstrate your knowledge of material that you never took an exam on? I'm totally curious about this because it's an argument I've heard from students multiple times (I know I didn't actually take that test but if you ask me all the questions I could pass it right now; The wording of the questions was confusing but I know the material and could tell you whatever you want) and one that I have never found credible.

Okay, let me explain how that works in my world, with mock dates. Paper 1 is due October 19. Student mistakenly turns in paper 2, which is due November 12. Given that paper 1 is now several weeks late, and that the syllabus requires a deduction of 5 points per day, the highest grade possible is 23 days late, the highest grade that can be earned is negative. The student later comes and says "Oops" but (as you've stated) blames the instructor and/or website for confusing him/her about which paper was due on which date. And, somehow, the grade for the missed paper (which, technically, is the paper 1 assignment) should be dropped from the grade, according to you. Do I have it right, according to what you're saying?

Do you realize how ridiculous you sound when you blame the website, the professor, and everyone but yourself for not only taking the wrong exam, failing to realize that you did this in a timely fashion (and, since I've taught online I'll go ahead and add that timely means within no more than a week during a semester-long course), and then for blaming the professor for not dropping the grade for Exam 2?

And, Zimaleah, to address emmm's question: Did you directly ask if you could receive a B in the course in spite of missing the exam?

I suppose I have been spoiled, as I have seen professors let students retake in class exams AND online things on many occasions when they had a reason the professor sympathized with. I have never missed a due date before this but I've known students who have taken make-up exams (for at least partial credit) for everything from oversleeping to illness (sans doctors note). This is particularly true when the end result is a grade that seriously misrepresents the quality of the other work the student has done. This is the first time I have had experience with this myself, but I have on more than a few occasions (at least 6 times in my undergraduate period) known specific professors that would say "well, turn in the next paper topic during the next paper time, I will grade this one on time" for little to no penalty for people in my classes. Some of this was at my original undergrad institution, once at the school I take speech prereqs at, and once in a different community college class. I really thought this was a fairly common practice, although at the discretion of the professor to use it and judge the validity of the reason the student gives.

I'd like to remind anyone reading this that this is an anonymous online forum, and as a previous poster put, how I speak here does not necessarily mean I am speaking that way to my professor. In fact, I did not blame him for anything in my interactions with him. I did not ask him for a B in exchange for nothing. I did not ask him to just ignore my lack of exam grade. My overall interaction (which answers your question, risingstar) included me discovering my mistake, and emailing him. In this email I apologized for not coming to him sooner, but I had just discovered my mistake upon trying to complete the other exam. I described my situation, said that a C is very undesirable in my situation, and said that with this missed exam I had zero chance of getting anything above a middle-low C average in the class. And given this information, is there anything I could do (re:retaking, extra credit) to raise this to a B average, because I should very seriously consider dropping the class. His response email told me not to worry, that he does not allow retakes or extra credit, but that it would not make sense to drop the class because he can consider the rest of my body of work when he calculates final grades if my work is good enough. When I discovered my grade was a C, I sent him an email, and he gave me a one line email about 73% not being good enough to be lenient with and that if I wanted to, I should contest the grade and submit the form and we would work it out next semester when he gets back from the holidays.

My work was A+/middle A afterwards. I did not drop the class because he advised me not to. I believed him when he implied that me not having to worry and advising me not to drop the class meant that if my grades stayed stellar, he would give me a B. While I am sure I sounded particularly complain-y in my posts, it's because I was (and am a little) very worried and very angry. Not that he didn't think my grade was a B, but that he ADVISED ME BADLY when I gave him all of the information he needed. I calculated my grade, I knew the highest average I could attain was a 74.5% if I got 100 on everything. I put this in my email. Since I did not get a 100% on my final exam, just a lowly A-, I had a 73% at the end. I understood the entire time that he did not owe me the B - I thought as a professor he did owe me good advice on ANYTHING regarding his class. I still do. Which is why I am petitioning for a W, not the B. And it is not just me who thinks this is justified, though I understand why some of you feel I am an entitled-feeling gradegrubber who needs to grow up. You don't know me, so I don't blame you or hold it against you.