German, Fall 2011

[GK Chesterton]

Woot! Chicago is sending emails.

[DrFaustus666]

So who's applying to German programs for the Fall? (Where at? What are your interests?)

In contrast to last year, no Germanists seem to be popping up...

Anyone else applying to Yale? NYU? Northwestern? Chicago?

Off topic

Is the job market really SO awful as some have said? I'm an MA German Lit and will probably do Musicology for the PhD, (I have an earlier MA in music) ... but if I can't get into a top musicology school, I might still go for Germanistik. Is there a market at all? Or should I sell my Duden and try for a New York City cab driver's certificate?

[GK Chesterton]

Or should I sell my Duden and try for a New York City cab driver's certificate?

Do you have any idea how much those things cost?

[DrFaustus666]

Do you have any idea how much those things cost?

I don't have the huge dictionary, though I've found a number of the smaller books on various topics in used book stores, for very reasonable prices

[GK Chesterton]

I don't have the huge dictionary, though I've found a number of the smaller books on various topics in used book stores, for very reasonable prices

0

Ha, I meant taxi badges. It's an Econ 101 example of a non-market policy gone bad: you basically have artificially restricted supply, which results in people paying an outrageous "key cost" of $40,000 - 100,00 to get the badge itself.

Get the Duden electronic dictionary; way better.

[kalleziffel]

Woot! Chicago is sending emails.

Woot woot!!!

[GK Chesterton]

Got notification from Michigan.

I saw two Yale results go up - really excited to hear from them, but I haven't seen anything yet. Anyone have word on that / want to claim those?

[jabberwacki218]

Also, anyone heard from U Minnesota-Twin Cities? My status has said "Graduate Final Review" for over a week, and according to the website that meant I should have a decision on applyyourself within two business days...I called and they said they've been backed up and things are behind, but wondering if anyone else has heard anything for German?

Same for U Toronto (says "Under Review"), Rutgers, and UNC-Chapel Hill

[liebejessi]

In response to "no Germanists seem to be popping up" ... I was a double German and Spanish major in college and would've LOVED to continue studying German, but I was advised against it by every advisor, professor, or otherwise that I talked to because of the job market. (Yes, this includes my wonderful German profs.)

It was a hard decision, but I ultimately did not apply to German programs. Maybe a lot of others are in this boat, too?

[GK Chesterton]

In response to "no Germanists seem to be popping up" ... I was a double German and Spanish major in college and would've LOVED to continue studying German, but I was advised against it by every advisor, professor, or otherwise that I talked to because of the job market. (Yes, this includes my wonderful German profs.)

It was a hard decision, but I ultimately did not apply to German programs. Maybe a lot of others are in this boat, too?

No offense, but I'm not certain that this is a terribly strong argument when one considers it as an argument for teaching positions in one foreign language as opposed to those in another. In terms of theorists and authors circulating in continental philosophy, film studies, comp. lit, etc., I haven't really seen a substantial pick-up in Spanish theorists or authors, whereas Marx, Nietzsche, Hegel, Freud, Kant, Weber, Schmitt, Heidegger, Gadamer, Benjamin, Adorno, Habermas, etc. (not to mention the countless German literary authors) still rule the day.

Spanish as an actual academic discipline and not just a foreign language pedagogy program got almost no love from anywhere until quite recently, and I suspect that the mercurial winds of ignorance and enforced monolingualism in the cultural politics of American higher education will deflate those sails just as swiftly. Further, I think that it would be a resoundingly poor idea to try and pursue any degree in the humanities with an eye towards a "more favorable" job market, so if what you're really concerned about is getting a job at the end, why not just get an MBA?

In short, to play a little game with the response to his own (premature) obituary from perhaps the best known enemy of the German language: "Die Berichte über das Ableben der deutschen Sprache sind stark übertrieben."

Now watch me not get a job

[kalleziffel]

No offense, but I'm not certain that this is a terribly strong argument when one considers it as an argument for teaching positions in one foreign language as opposed to those in another. In terms of theorists and authors circulating in continental philosophy, film studies, comp. lit, etc., I haven't really seen a substantial pick-up in Spanish theorists or authors, whereas Marx, Nietzsche, Hegel, Freud, Kant, Weber, Schmitt, Heidegger, Gadamer, Benjamin, Adorno, Habermas, etc. (not to mention the countless German literary authors) still rule the day.

Spanish as an actual academic discipline and not just a foreign language pedagogy program got almost no love from anywhere until quite recently, and I suspect that the mercurial winds of ignorance and enforced monolingualism in the cultural politics of American higher education will deflate those sails just as swiftly. Further, I think that it would be a resoundingly poor idea to try and pursue any degree in the humanities with an eye towards a "more favorable" job market, so if what you're really concerned about is getting a job at the end, why not just get an MBA?

In short, to play a little game with the response to his own (premature) obituary from perhaps the best known enemy of the German language: "Die Berichte über das Ableben der deutschen Sprache sind stark übertrieben."

Now watch me not get a job

Have to second what our friend "GK Chesterton" says -- if the whole telos of the graduate school experience is "job," get an MBA -- I'm in the corporate world right now, and I can guarantee that there are a lot of very happy people with jobs and MBAs there (cars, 1.5 kids, suburb kind of thing!)-- or some kind of computer programming skill; plus, where's our good ol' Bildungsideal if we're concerned with the silly job market. Raus, Neoliberalismus, raus! (If it had some kind of a form, say, erm...a "Samsian" one ... one would like to stomp it out of its parasitical, risible existence)

[liebejessi]

No offense, but I'm not certain that this is a terribly strong argument when one considers it as an argument for teaching positions in one foreign language as opposed to those in another. In terms of theorists and authors circulating in continental philosophy, film studies, comp. lit, etc., I haven't really seen a substantial pick-up in Spanish theorists or authors, whereas Marx, Nietzsche, Hegel, Freud, Kant, Weber, Schmitt, Heidegger, Gadamer, Benjamin, Adorno, Habermas, etc. (not to mention the countless German literary authors) still rule the day.

Spanish as an actual academic discipline and not just a foreign language pedagogy program got almost no love from anywhere until quite recently, and I suspect that the mercurial winds of ignorance and enforced monolingualism in the cultural politics of American higher education will deflate those sails just as swiftly. Further, I think that it would be a resoundingly poor idea to try and pursue any degree in the humanities with an eye towards a "more favorable" job market, so if what you're really concerned about is getting a job at the end, why not just get an MBA?

In short, to play a little game with the response to his own (premature) obituary from perhaps the best known enemy of the German language: "Die Berichte über das Ableben der deutschen Sprache sind stark übertrieben."

Now watch me not get a job

None taken. To a good extent, I agree with you. (And just to be clear, I am not wanting to go to grad school JUST for a job). It's just that with the luck of certain faculty members and the info floating around, it seemed to maybe be something better to come back to, is all. A professor-friend of mine is doing an MA in Spanish to strengthen his appeal to schools and just to broaden his horizons, for instance.

Of course, we all aim to be hired -- but it was also what was more feasible for myself in the end. (There are schools where I have family that have Spanish, but not German)

It was just a theory I was throwing out there about the lack of Germanists, nothing more, nothing less.

[GK Chesterton]

None taken. To a good extent, I agree with you. (And just to be clear, I am not wanting to go to grad school JUST for a job). It's just that with the luck of certain faculty members and the info floating around, it seemed to maybe be something better to come back to, is all. A professor-friend of mine is doing an MA in Spanish to strengthen his appeal to schools and just to broaden his horizons, for instance.

Of course, we all aim to be hired -- but it was also what was more feasible for myself in the end. (There are schools where I have family that have Spanish, but not German)

It was just a theory I was throwing out there about the lack of Germanists, nothing more, nothing less.

Well, fair enough, but given that there's only one thread on this whole website for people who have applied to study German, to come in and say that there are no careers and everyone in the world said it was a terrible idea and that's why you aren't doing it is like finding a forum for pregnant women and writing about how everyone you know says pregnant people are unhappy, resent their kids, get post-partum depression, etc. and that's why you have decided not to have children.

I guess it's just unclear to me what sort of a reaction you were hoping for with your original post - that someone would write "Yeah, you're right, there are no jobs, guess I'm an idiot for spending $1000 applying to schools and taking GREs"?

Edited February 13, 2011 by GK Chesterton

[liebejessi]

Well, fair enough, but given that there's only one thread on this whole website for people who have applied to study German, to come in and say that there are no careers and everyone in the world said it was a terrible idea and that's why you aren't doing it is like finding a forum for pregnant women and writing about how everyone you know says pregnant people are unhappy, resent their kids, get post-partum depression, etc. and that's why you have decided not to have children.

I guess it's just unclear to me what sort of a reaction you were hoping for with your original post - that someone would write "Yeah, you're right, there are no jobs, guess I'm an idiot for spending $1000 applying to schools and taking GREs"?

Look, I'm really not looking for a fight. That wasn't my intention at all and if I gave you that impression then I apologize, but I've already made it clear that I didn't mean it the way you took it, so you continuing to get pissed off about it isn't going to do anyone any good. And there's really no reason to get all hochnäsig about it. (And comparing my "coming in here" to the thing about pregnant women? THAT'S a bit "stark übertrieben", nicht wahr? ) You're reading between lines that don't exist to read between in the first place. I was just offering my reasons for not continuing with German right now. I am still very much a Germanist at heart. The last thing I would call you for following your heart and doing what you want to do is an "idiot" . . . we're all in an "interesting" boat (to put it lightly) with this job market, but I don't think anyone can make a mistake as long as they're doing what they see fit for them.

So, I truly wish you the best of luck and success and make of it what you will.

Edited February 13, 2011 by liebejessi

[BrandNewName]

Hi all, I'm a Germanist at heart and make my home in Deutschland, but am an English/American Studies applicant this round. I just wanted to let anyone who's waiting know what I know about a colleague applying for German PhDs. About a week ago he received his acceptance to the Duke/UNC program and this past Wednesday he received word that he had been accepted to UW-Seattle. He's also apparently going to Michigan later in March to interview (but I don't know if that interview is a prerequisite for admission or if he has gotten in and is referring to a planned campus visit).

I'm a ball of stress right now and having some information has at least given me an idea of what's going on out there. I'm sorry I don't know more details, but I thought I would post what I do know in case anyone is waiting on any of those programs/wondering where the notification processes are.

Edited February 13, 2011 by outofredink

[GK Chesterton]

Hi all, I'm a Germanist at heart and make my home in Deutschland, but am an English/American Studies applicant this round. I just wanted to let anyone who's waiting know what I know about a colleague applying for German PhDs. About a week ago he received his acceptance to the Duke/UNC program and this past Wednesday he received word that he had been accepted to UW-Seattle. He's also apparently going to Michigan later in March to interview (but I don't know if that interview is a prerequisite for admission or if he has gotten in and is referring to a planned campus visit).

I'm a ball of stress right now and having some information has at least given me an idea of what's going on out there. I'm sorry I don't know more details, but I thought I would post what I do know in case anyone is waiting on any of those programs/wondering where the notification processes are.

Out of curiosity, is your name a reference to a Zizoke?

Edit: I suppose I should clarify my bizarre terminology, in that a Zizoke is a Zizek joke. However, it now seems apparent that this is probably a reference to much more common red marking pens. Whoops.

Edited February 13, 2011 by GK Chesterton

[BrandNewName]

Out of curiosity, is your name a reference to a Zizoke?

Edit: I suppose I should clarify my bizarre terminology, in that a Zizoke is a Zizek joke. However, it now seems apparent that this is probably a reference to much more common red marking pens. Whoops.

No! You're right, it's totally a Zizoke! Love that you know that!

[so old so cold]

Hi guys, thank you so much for this very lively discussion. Very interesting!

I was recently accepted to one school for German and another for Comparative Literature. The German Dept. is certainly my top choice--the faculty, the school, everything's just great--but the Comp. Lit. Dept. is offering much great flexibility in terms of my eventual markability in the job search. I really want to join the German Dept. in the Fall, but I'm worried it may not be the smartest choice.

Are any of you in the same situation? Would you say that generally Comp. Lit. PhDs have a competitive advantage over young Germanists!?

[GK Chesterton]

Hi guys, thank you so much for this very lively discussion. Very interesting!

I was recently accepted to one school for German and another for Comparative Literature. The German Dept. is certainly my top choice--the faculty, the school, everything's just great--but the Comp. Lit. Dept. is offering much great flexibility in terms of my eventual markability in the job search. I really want to join the German Dept. in the Fall, but I'm worried it may not be the smartest choice.

Are any of you in the same situation? Would you say that generally Comp. Lit. PhDs have a competitive advantage over young Germanists!?

Well, you would have to tell us the two schools first. As a general rule, there is no general rule. However, rumblings that have made their way to me tend to be that Comp Lit is in a tough spot - sexy field for people in the humanities, but no love from the people who distribute cash. General emphasis has been comp lit graduates / programs are only successful jobwise if they're trained to join a specific language department when they graduate; otherwise, it's quite difficult.

Which schools did you apply to? No fun if we can't match people to the results board.

[DrFaustus666]

Have to second what our friend "GK Chesterton" says -- if the whole telos of the graduate school experience is "job," get an MBA -- I'm in the corporate world right now, and I can guarantee that there are a lot of very happy people with jobs and MBAs there (cars, 1.5 kids, suburb kind of thing!)-- or some kind of computer programming skill;

As a musician turned Germanist (who's on the fence about either musicology or German for the PhD), who also has a B.S. (equiv) and a 20+ year job in computer science , I'd definitely advise you against computer-junk unless you LOVE computers and math and related stuff---The field is currently being inundated by both "productivity enhancement" initiatives (which take all the FUN out of computer programming), and by immigrants who are willing to take jobs at far lower salaries and abominable working conditions, by US standards at any rate.

Of course, this too may pass, but IMHO the MBA is a MUCH better, more robust, and more flexible option than CS if you just want a job and a (largeish) house in the suburbs, an SUV, and other trappings of upper-middle-class American life.

Edited February 14, 2011 by DrFaustus666

[kalleziffel]

As a musician turned Germanist (who's on the fence about either musicology or German for the PhD), who also has a B.S. (equiv) and a 20+ year job in computer science , I'd definitely advise you against computer-junk unless you LOVE computers and math and related stuff---The field is currently being inundated by both "productivity enhancement" initiatives (which take all the FUN out of computer programming), and by immigrants who are willing to take jobs at far lower salaries and abominable working conditions, by US standards at any rate.

Of course, this too may pass, but IMHO the MBA is a MUCH better, more robust, and more flexible option than CS if you just want a job and a (largeish) house in the suburbs, an SUV, and other trappings of upper-middle-class American life.

the trappings of upper-middle-class American life still don't beat graduate school! (says the woman whose hair will probably turn white before she turns thirty). Interesting thing about computer programming, that -- I'm a translator, though, (French, German and a Southeastern European language) and just eavesdrop on them in the lunch room. If you're like me and don't care about sports, don't go to church, or talk about diaper-changing or TV programs… you’re just useless for the infernal ‘mainstream’ here. One needs bug spray: Webern or Stockhausen to drive them out. Anyway, all of this to say, I'm not too concerned about the job market. Musicology, eh? I've just translated a few texts for MUSIK-KONZEPTE (kind of the musical pendant to text & kritik) on Stefan Wolpe. Those durned tricky musicology terms were giving me some trouble!

[DrFaustus666]

the trappings of upper-middle-class American life still don't beat graduate school! (says the woman whose hair will probably turn white before she turns thirty). Interesting thing about computer programming, that -- I'm a translator, though, (French, German and a Southeastern European language) and just eavesdrop on them in the lunch room. If you're like me and don't care about sports, don't go to church, or talk about diaper-changing or TV programs… you’re just useless for the infernal ‘mainstream’ here. One needs bug spray: Webern or Stockhausen to drive them out. Anyway, all of this to say, I'm not too concerned about the job market. Musicology, eh? I've just translated a few texts for MUSIK-KONZEPTE (kind of the musical pendant to text & kritik) on Stefan Wolpe. Those durned tricky musicology terms were giving me some trouble!

I don't give a rat's butt about most sports (though I do very occasionally see live tennis matches), I don't go to church unless it's a wedding, baptism, or bar/bat-mitzvah, been-there-done-that with diaperchanging, and, re Webern and Stockhausen, don't forget Carter, Boulez, and Penderecki.

Which southeastern European language? (Albanian, Bulgarian, Croatian, Czech, Hungarian, Macedonian, Romanian, Serbian, Slovakian, Slovenian, etc. are not dirty words, even if the majority of Americans couldn't find Slovenia on the map if you offered a 50-dollar prize.)

[kalleziffel]

I don't give a rat's butt about most sports (though I do very occasionally see live tennis matches), I don't go to church unless it's a wedding, baptism, or bar/bat-mitzvah, been-there-done-that with diaperchanging, and, re Webern and Stockhausen, don't forget Carter, Boulez, and Penderecki.

Which southeastern European language? (Albanian, Bulgarian, Croatian, Czech, Hungarian, Macedonian, Romanian, Serbian, Slovakian, Slovenian, etc. are not dirty words, even if the majority of Americans couldn't find Slovenia on the map if you offered a 50-dollar prize.)

Serbo-Croatian (not going to get too specific) and YES to Boulez and Penderecki. (Glad to say I haven't been there with the diaper changing ...)

[GK Chesterton]

Anyone claiming the new Berkeley / Yale acceptances?

[cimalagon]

Anyone claiming the new Berkeley / Yale acceptances?

Hi! I can claim the new Berkeley, Yale and Harvard acceptances.