2024 Creative Writing MFA Applicants Forum

[decayingballads21]

Hey all, sorry to post again about Wyoming but does anyone know if they are done sending out waitlists and acceptances? 
 

I’ve seen two acceptances on draft and several waitlists went out this morning. I have yet to hear anything so I’m a bit nervous. Is it safe to assume rejection at this point? Any chance of acceptance or waitlist still going out tomorrow or Monday stilll? 

 

Edited March 2, 2024 by decayingballads21

[Rixor]

46 minutes ago, decayingballads21 said:

Hey all, sorry to post again about Wyoming but does anyone know if they are done sending out waitlists and acceptances? 
 

I’ve seen two acceptances on draft and several waitlists went out this morning. I have yet to hear anything so I’m a bit nervous. Is it safe to assume rejection at this point? Any chance of acceptance or waitlist still going out tomorrow or Monday stilll? 

 

I wouldn't count it as a rejection just yet! I don't know about Wyoming in particular, but one of my waitlists came days after the first ones were posted in the draft spreadsheet. I hope you hear good news soon. 

[ssuunn]

I noticed that people at Oregon State sent out admits/waitlists/rejections... I am however still in limbo...? 🤔

[Hjanep]

Looks like UVA fiction is trickling out….

[Scribe]

18 minutes ago, Hjanep said:

Looks like UVA fiction is trickling out….

Of course. Why is it always a trickle? 

[Hjanep]

10 minutes ago, Scribe said:

Of course. Why is it always a trickle? 

Also, not like this knowledge helps me in any way, but would love an accurate gauge of how many of these are reflected by Draft. 

[Scribe]

3 minutes ago, Hjanep said:

Also, not like this knowledge helps me in any way, but would love an accurate gauge of how many of these are reflected by Draft. 

I've been thinking about this a bunch. there are over 1300 members of draft. not all are applicants but i would say the overwhelming majority are. the fact is there are only so many programs (Anyone know how many) at least 350 and i've heard as many as 500. consider that very few people apply to only one, that there are already well over a thousand responses on the spreadsheet, and that half the well known schools haven't responded and you start to think there's at least a bit you can glean from draft. also, there's a lag. people are STILL only now learning about draft and being admitted there. 

it's the waitlist odds people would pay money for. 

[Hjanep]

12 minutes ago, Scribe said:

I've been thinking about this a bunch. there are over 1300 members of draft. not all are applicants but i would say the overwhelming majority are. the fact is there are only so many programs (Anyone know how many) at least 350 and i've heard as many as 500. consider that very few people apply to only one, that there are already well over a thousand responses on the spreadsheet, and that half the well known schools haven't responded and you start to think there's at least a bit you can glean from draft. also, there's a lag. people are STILL only now learning about draft and being admitted there. 

it's the waitlist odds people would pay money for. 

We have a way more robust spreadsheet this year. My swaggy analysis said 50-70% of admits are reflected on the draft spreadsheet.

If you look at last year, there were only a small handful of Iowa admits on there (for example)

Edited March 2, 2024 by Hjanep

[Rixor]

19 minutes ago, Hjanep said:

Also, not like this knowledge helps me in any way, but would love an accurate gauge of how many of these are reflected by Draft. 

 

10 minutes ago, Scribe said:

I've been thinking about this a bunch. there are over 1300 members of draft. not all are applicants but i would say the overwhelming majority are. the fact is there are only so many programs (Anyone know how many) at least 350 and i've heard as many as 500. consider that very few people apply to only one, that there are already well over a thousand responses on the spreadsheet, and that half the well known schools haven't responded and you start to think there's at least a bit you can glean from draft. also, there's a lag. people are STILL only now learning about draft and being admitted there. 

it's the waitlist odds people would pay money for. 

Looking at the spreadsheet, Syracuse poetry says the waitlist is 6 people long. 4 people logged poetry waitlists. So, that'd be 66% of waitlists reported. But Syracuse is pretty 'prestigious' so that might be an outlier. 

UCR fiction has 20 people on the waitlist. Only 2 people reported it in the spreadsheet. So... 10% of people logged it?

I guess it's a toss up.  

[decayingballads21]

Those who have applied before and chosen to apply again- what made you decide to try again? I mean, this process is mentally and emotionally draining, and while I have several waitlists I am trying to start considering if I would give this another go around or not. Part of me thinks well duh it’s my dream of course I would try again, try more schools, update my writing sample. But another part of me says it wasn’t meant to be and no matter what I (and many others) just may not get in. This is all very defeating. But gosh I want it so bad.

 

The thing is, I’m confident in my material and what I’ve been writing toward, and I felt really good about my apps this cycle and very ready for the next step of pursuing my MFA. I know more time to polish and revise and generate new material never hurts but I don’t see that drastically changing my odds.

TLDR I’m just trying to balance my fears of the worst this year (rejections across the board- no waitlist movement) with the prospect of doing this all over again. Would it even be worth it? Part of me thinks, well maybe I get into an even better program next year. But another part of me thinks what if I get in off a waitlist this year and decide to go. Who can say what would be the better? 
 

im sure others have been thinking along these lines or have already applied multiple cycles so im just curious- what made you apply again? What are your regrets in the app process or things you would do differently? And do you think waiting another year might be helpful?

Just curious some thoughts on this or if anyone can share their own experiences with multiple application cycles- did anything change, did your luck get better, what do you attribute this to? 

 

sorry for the long post. Im going through it.

appreciate you guys. 

[Scribe]

People, can we talk about Michener and NWP? what are the actual differences? same faculty, same university, different offers. other than that, what do we know?

Are NWP cohorts prohibited at Dobie?

Are there different guest lecturers?

What of the course requirements? (I feel like i should know this one but if i ever did, i've forgotten)

What about reputation in the business; do agents, publishers, and universities looking for instructors figure they're the same?

post any answers or questions because i, for one, have been wondering about this for a year or two. 

 

[Hjanep]

3 minutes ago, Scribe said:

People, can we talk about Michener and NWP? what are the actual differences? same faculty, same university, different offers. other than that, what do we know?

Are NWP cohorts prohibited at Dobie?

Are there different guest lecturers?

What of the course requirements? (I feel like i should know this one but if i ever did, i've forgotten)

What about reputation in the business; do agents, publishers, and universities looking for instructors figure they're the same?

post any answers or questions because i, for one, have been wondering about this for a year or two. 

 

My understanding is Michener is an older program and has no teaching requirement whereas NWP has a teaching requirement. I think Michener is slightly higher on the “prestige” hierarchy (e.g. some agents who DGAF if a query is from someone with an MFA might GAF if the author is from Iowa/Michigan/Michener). 

[Scribe]

10 minutes ago, Hjanep said:

We have a way more robust spreadsheet this year. My swaggy analysis said 50-70% of admits are reflected on the draft spreadsheet.

If you look at last year, there were only a small handful of Iowa admits on there (for example)

but there are only, what, 25 admits to iowa at all? and that's the holy grail. this year there are multiple admit posts fropm schools with far smaller cohorts. i also figure most of the people who are just applying to their local programs or applying because that's what you do after college, aren't on draft; but most who are in this for all the marbles and have been researching programs for a few years, are. 

10 minutes ago, Rixor said:

 

Looking at the spreadsheet, Syracuse poetry says the waitlist is 6 people long. 4 people logged poetry waitlists. So, that'd be 66% of waitlists reported. But Syracuse is pretty 'prestigious' so that might be an outlier. 

UCR fiction has 20 people on the waitlist. Only 2 people reported it in the spreadsheet. So... 10% of people logged it?

I guess it's a toss up.  

yeah but most of the schools on draft are prestigious. i do tend to think it's a toss up but less so the higher the rep of the school. then there are those evil people who post in the forum but not the spreadsheet. 

where do you (and others) find out these numbers? i can't find my ass with both hands and a map. 

[Scribe]

17 minutes ago, Hjanep said:

My understanding is Michener is an older program and has no teaching requirement whereas NWP has a teaching requirement. I think Michener is slightly higher on the “prestige” hierarchy (e.g. some agents who DGAF if a query is from someone with an MFA might GAF if the author is from Iowa/Michigan/Michener). 

this very much one of my motivations to starting this discussion. wouldn't exactly that type of hypothetical agent know about NWP and its attachment to Michener? so would there be a difference to them? why or why not?

and besides the package, what's the difference to us?

 

[Hjanep]

3 minutes ago, Scribe said:

this very much one of my motivations to starting this discussion. wouldn't exactly that type of hypothetical agent know about NWP and its attachment to Michener? so would there be a difference to them? why or why not?

and besides the package, what's the difference to us?

 

This is me talking out of my ass in the peanut gallery, never having attended an MFA program and sitting here with Rs across the board so - big grain of salt here. I *think* if someone got into Michener and NWP they are more likely to gravitate toward Michener so the “caliber” of someone getting into Michener would be higher? I know this shit is all highly subjective and someone should pick whichever program they think will serve their writing best. Also the Michener grads spent all that time writing and none of that time teaching? Maybe someone who has actually attended/visited/etc. either of these programs could weigh in with some actual insights. 

[mr. specific]

27 minutes ago, Scribe said:

People, can we talk about Michener and NWP? what are the actual differences? same faculty, same university, different offers. other than that, what do we know?

Are NWP cohorts prohibited at Dobie?

Are there different guest lecturers?

What of the course requirements? (I feel like i should know this one but if i ever did, i've forgotten)

What about reputation in the business; do agents, publishers, and universities looking for instructors figure they're the same?

post any answers or questions because i, for one, have been wondering about this for a year or two. 

 

Michener gets significantly more $$ and doesn't have to teach, because they "want to focus on your writing." On the other hand, NWP gets teaching experience, which may be better if you're trying to get a job directly after.  People consider Michener much more prestigious, but I don't think you get any better of an education, basically are in almost all the same workshops as far as I can tell. There are one or two classes that only Michener can do.  But I got rejected from both, so what do I know.

[Scribe]

4 minutes ago, Hjanep said:

This is me talking out of my ass in the peanut gallery, never having attended an MFA program and sitting here with Rs across the board so - big grain of salt here. I *think* if someone got into Michener and NWP they are more likely to gravitate toward Michener so the “caliber” of someone getting into Michener would be higher? I know this shit is all highly subjective and someone should pick whichever program they think will serve their writing best. Also the Michener grads spent all that time writing and none of that time teaching? Maybe someone who has actually attended/visited/etc. either of these programs could weigh in with some actual insights. 

that would be nice. 

as far as talking out of one's ass, this is where some of my best thoughts come from. 

[Scribe]

9 minutes ago, mr. specific said:

Michener gets significantly more $$ and doesn't have to teach, because they "want to focus on your writing." On the other hand, NWP gets teaching experience, which may be better if you're trying to get a job directly after.  People consider Michener much more prestigious, but I don't think you get any better of an education, basically are in almost all the same workshops as far as I can tell. There are one or two classes that only Michener can do.  But I got rejected from both, so what do I know.

getting accepted gives you exactly zero insight into these questions so no worries. Honestly, i'm on the NWP waitlist and vs Irvine the ONLY thing I can think of right now is reputation. If I were fortunate enough to get an offer, I'd have numbers to think about. That said, I'm about the work and I don't really see NWP giving me more support than Irvine, but that too might change with a phone call. 

Here's another thing I wonder about: Why would they not the Michener waitlist from NWP. I know it's logistically difficult but imagine establishing the Michener cohort and then the NWP. 

i dunno, i'm just listening to my daughter play the worst music ever and spitballing. 

we're going on a bear hunt

we're going on a bear hunt

[mr. specific]

42 minutes ago, decayingballads21 said:

Those who have applied before and chosen to apply again- what made you decide to try again? I mean, this process is mentally and emotionally draining, and while I have several waitlists I am trying to start considering if I would give this another go around or not. Part of me thinks well duh it’s my dream of course I would try again, try more schools, update my writing sample. But another part of me says it wasn’t meant to be and no matter what I (and many others) just may not get in. This is all very defeating. But gosh I want it so bad.

You clearly want to do it again. You'll feel disappointed for a couple months and then you'll get excited and get your hopes up to try again. As long as you're committed to keeping on writing it'll work out I believe. As someone who got more or less rejected across the board twice and is now sitting on 3 acceptances from the top programs (and a couple more WLs) it does get better with time and perseverance. I had other cheerleaders in my life though, who kept me going. Seek that out, workshop with other people you trust (and maybe limit your exposure to forums like this!) Don't necessarily try to publish unless you really want, though, bc that can be a lot of rejection.

[Hjanep]

7 minutes ago, Scribe said:

getting accepted gives you exactly zero insight into these questions so no worries. Honestly, i'm on the NWP waitlist and vs Irvine the ONLY thing I can think of right now is reputation. If I were fortunate enough to get an offer, I'd have numbers to think about. That said, I'm about the work and I don't really see NWP giving me more support than Irvine, but that too might change with a phone call. 

Here's another thing I wonder about: Why would they not the Michener waitlist from NWP. I know it's logistically difficult but imagine establishing the Michener cohort and then the NWP. 

i dunno, i'm just listening to my daughter play the worst music ever and spitballing. 

we're going on a bear hunt

we're going on a bear hunt

I didn’t apply to NWP or Irvine but I think Irvine is more prestigey fwiw. I would visit both (if you get into NWP) and make the call off gut. 

[Scribe]

7 minutes ago, Hjanep said:

I didn’t apply to NWP or Irvine but I think Irvine is more prestigey fwiw. I would visit both (if you get into NWP) and make the call off gut. 

"My guts... have shit for brains."

[ssuunn]

Iowa has definitely started making calls for poetry! One report on the Draft spreadsheet.

Edited March 2, 2024 by ssuunn

[Tuxedocat]

@jadedoptimist someone posted in Draft about getting a poetry acceptance from Iowa 😳

my stomach is in knots right now 😰 I was hoping I could at least have this weekend free from the anxiety. But Iowa has been my dream for years and all I have right now is one waitlist from Texas so the panic is exponentially increasing 😰😰😰

[jadedoptimist]

@Tuxedocat oh my gosh it's happening!!!! Ahhhhh!!!! I am right there with you in fear, friend.

[taliaj]

Is anyone else waiting on Boise at all? I've asked this already, but it's not as popular as some of the other schools so I don't know if there's anyone else in here who would post about fiction or even know about Gradcafe at all (besides one other person I've talked to on here). Last year I think people heard back in February, so I feel like I'm going crayz. The waiting is KILLING me, and I know at least I'm not alone in that, regardless of school!