Academic Complex because of Funding

[ZeeMore21]

I'm closing this because I truly thought I would get advice.

Edited February 16, 2011 by EnglishEnthusiast10

[transcendental]

Is this a joke?

[ZeeMore21]

No, transcendental, its not a joke.

[cranberry]

...You've got to be sh*tting me.

[ZeeMore21]

Seriously people, I am just asking for advice. It is really not about the money. I

[straightshooting]

Three bullet points:

• In this job market (and probably any foreseeable ones), you should be happy to get all of the teaching experience that you can. If you cannot juggle research (or coursework) with a teaching load, then you're going to have a hard time meeting promotion and tenure benchmarks at any research-oriented university. This isn't to say that a fellowship isn't nice in many ways, but there are very strong benefits to teaching straight through.
• The criteria used to determine whether to nominate you for a fellowship often have nothing to do with whether they think you have more or less academic potential than someone else. Frequently, administrative units above the department (the graduate school or university itself) require certain test scores and GPAs that the department might think are at all important. Also, the number of fellowships that a program can offer are, well, limited, which means that--like graduate admissions themselves--decisions are often made on the basis of what is essentially a coin toss.
• Really? You'd stay at what you describe as a lesser program because you feel that the better program doesn't think you're as hot shit as the other? Go to the better school and show them that you know what the hell you're doing (which they presumably already believe seeing as how they admitted you) and pick up some extra professional (teaching) experience at the same time.

[ZeeMore21]

I appreciate your help straight shooter. They only reason why I felt bad because another student I talked to suggested that they must not have thought my application was strong if I didn't get a fellowship...although I thought it was silly, it really did bother me and made me feel kind of low. Thanks for taking the time to show how silly I was being. Decided to take the question down since I'm bothering so many people with it...and rightfully slow. I will remember to think before I post next time.

Three bullet points:

• In this job market (and probably any foreseeable ones), you should be happy to get all of the teaching experience that you can. If you cannot juggle research (or coursework) with a teaching load, then you're going to have a hard time meeting promotion and tenure benchmarks at any research-oriented university. This isn't to say that a fellowship isn't nice in many ways, but there are very strong benefits to teaching straight through.
• The criteria used to determine whether to nominate you for a fellowship often have nothing to do with whether they think you have more or less academic potential than someone else. Frequently, administrative units above the department (the graduate school or university itself) require certain test scores and GPAs that the department might think are at all important. Also, the number of fellowships that a program can offer are, well, limited, which means that--like graduate admissions themselves--decisions are often made on the basis of what is essentially a coin toss.
• Really? You'd stay at what you describe as a lesser program because you feel that the better program doesn't think you're as hot shit as the other? Go to the better school and show them that you know what the hell you're doing (which they presumably already believe seeing as how they admitted you) and pick up some extra professional (teaching) experience at the same time.

[ZeeMore21]

inafuturelife,

the T.A I did while a M.A didn't involve teaching an entire class by myself...I only had to grade papers and exams.

you need to relax. the majority of ph.d applicants do not get fellowships. they survive their first year. if you already have an MA and have TAed, it seems strange that you would not feel comfortable teaching your first year since you would have a leg up on other first year TAs who've not taught. I realize that ph.d coursework will take more time, but this is doable.

if the first school did not want you, they would not have sent you an offer in the first round. that stipend is also quite high, and most of us would be quite happy to be in your position.

[fall-11]

Seriously people, I am just asking for advice. It is really not about the money. I

Okay, if you're really asking for advice, I'll try not to sound insensitive, but honestly you're making a huge deal out of nothing. If the committee said they loved your application -- well, that's why they accepted you over hundreds of others, right? As for fellowships, only one or two people get them out of those 400 or 500 that applied. We all would like to be special -- and you're already special enough that you made it into the 10 or 12 spots they had out of something like 400 applicants. To ask for even MORE specialness, to want to be that ONE person out of 400 who gets a fellowship -- well, isn't that asking for too much?

Once again, I'll reiterate that I'm not trying to sound mean or insensitive, if this truly is bothering you as much as you say. But please remember also that many of us here, including myself, have not gotten ANY offer yet, and hence are feeling very un-special indeed, so you may not really get too many sympathetic responses. Seriously, it's not healthy to let such a small thing bother you so much. Try to put it in perspective, and be grateful for the amazing offers you've gotten.

Congratulations on those admits, and good luck with making your decision.

[HappyCat]

I have an MA. I haven't TAed--I'm actually an instructor who created, organized, structured and taught (and am teaching) classes. I've done multiple conferences, have been invited to talks, and have great professional experience. I've been rejected from two schools already and know many, many people who are currently in my position. Stressed, afraid, and incredibly volatile.

That being said, it's probably not the best idea to bring up such a topic, but since you have I will answer your concerns with my honest opinion.

If you are concerned about the load of teaching and doing a PhD, I truly believe that is a legitimate concern. However, you can easily ask about what the teaching load (perhaps it is only one class?) and gauge the situation from there. TAing one class wouldn't be too bad. Being afraid of that balance is totally normal.

IF your concern is that you're not "good enough" or that you're not the best of the best because you didn't get free money, then--really?--you ARE just being petty, like your subtitle suggests. The most brilliant people in the country (and the world) are applying to all of these programs. Hundreds of smart, talented, wonderful people put their hearts and souls into this process and get rejected time after time after time. Some people need to go through the process more than once. To get through this process at ALL is a test of wits and endurance. You have already come out of the race successful in MULTIPLE schools. Now you're going to feel bad for yourself for getting a 24k-health-benefits-included-stipend? Many of us may only get accepted to one school (if that) with NO funding.

I would KILL to have the option to teach while going to school. Why? I LOVE it. I love my students, I love my classes, and I love how my class and research can tie together and how 18 yr old freshman can inspire me. Perhaps you should think about what you really want to do--including ending up becoming a professor fighting for tenure and needing to balance publications, committees, and teaching many classes.

EDIT: I used the word "now" like 3 times and it sounded ridiculous.

Edited February 16, 2011 by Geekoric

[ZeeMore21]

Thanks very much for the advice fall-11, and you didn't sound insensitive at all...I do actually think I didn't deserve any nice responses at all when I really do think about it. It was a stupid post, and I recognize that many people are still waiting for acceptances...so this post did seem very unpleasant. I guess I am really trying to be more confident in my ability to do PhD work, and I figured I try would settle this issue before I blew it way out of proportion. I will count my blessings.

[shepardn7]

This post is a a bit insensitive (plus, looking a gift horse in the mouth), since so many rejected people are so sad and anxious here about their prospects right now, but I will try to answer your question anyway.

You should certainly go wherever you want. But you shouldn't choose your school based on this kind of pettiness. So what if the adcom ranked two or three people higher than you on the acceptance list? Why does that matter so much to you? Instead of getting butthurt, why not go and show them all you've got? After all, they are likely "ranking" based on the application materials alone. At some schools, they might even be using the literally meaningless GRE decide the fellowships. You can't let these things get to you.

Teaching your first year might be more work, but you will come out the better for it. Why? Because teaching experience really effing counts. Chances are you won't emerge from your Ph.D program a rockstar, solicited and courted by top tier programs left and right. You might end up interviewing for low-tier teaching jobs with 600 other applicants. One extra year of teaching experience to show for yourself will help you more than that prestigious first-year fellowship, even with all its drawbacks.

Speaking of teaching jobs, there aren't many. Wouldn't it be nice to have a little more money in the bank? Like, $6K more a year for five years? That's a hell of a lot more money given by the school you claim is better in your specialization. I would take that extra money, and take the extra teaching experience at the university level.

Here's a thought. If cost of living is roughly equal in both cities, and you think the 18K is enough, this is what I would do: go to the school with more funding, and put $5-6K in a savings account every year for those five years. Just live on the $18K you would have earned at the other school. Wouldn't it be awesome to leave your humanities Ph.D program with almost $30K in the bank? I think it would be pretty awesome.

Edit: haha, while I was slowly typing, straightshooting said everything I wanted to say.

Edited February 16, 2011 by sarandipidy

[ZeeMore21]

Geekoric,

I seriously do not mind teaching...and I can see how my original post may have given people that impression. I have never taught a course before, which is largely where the fear comes from. I think it should be understandable how that could be scary to teach in addition to trying to get used to being a PhD. If I did end up messing up during my first year as a Phd, I would lose my funding.

[Safferz]

I really fear that I am already developing some type of complex and doubting this school's desire for me as a doctoral candidate. I am also feeling that perhaps I wasn't their top candidate if other applicants did get fellowships.

If you were offered admission with funding, what more do you want? That's precisely how schools show that they want you in their program, and a sure sign that you ARE one of a select group of individuals who were identified as top candidates from a large pool of applicants. The vast majority of doctoral funding packages in any field involve teaching duties, and only a small minority of exceptional applicants are fortunate enough to win fellowships. Teaching experience will also be important once you're on the job market.

To go to a lower ranked school (with less funding!) simply because a fellowship that makes you feel good about yourself would be absurd.

If you are this disappointed to know you are "average" among the incoming Ph.D cohort, how will you handle the setbacks and disappointments of academia?

[ZeeMore21]

Safferz, I do get what you are saying. But I think the first year teaching issue is important...mainly because if I am not unable to balance teaching and my coursework the first year, I could potentially lose the teaching assistantship and have no funding.

[fall-11]

I seriously do not mind teaching...and I can see how my original post may have given people that impression. I have never taught a course before, which is largely where the fear comes from. I think it should be understandable how that could be scary to teach in addition to trying to get used to being a PhD. If I did end up messing up during my first year as a Phd, I would lose my funding.

That's an understandable fear. But given the high stipend they're paying, I'm guessing this is a well-funded private school, so their teaching load will probably be 1 course per semester, which should be pretty manageable. Also remember that they will probably have a fairly thorough TA orientation/training before the semester starts, where they will likely also provide a lot of the materials you will use in class, plus there will be support available throughout the semester as well. Everybody going into this for the first time will be just as scared as you are, so don't just hide away somewhere -- if you're having trouble with teaching or with time-management, talk to others in your cohort, talk to older grad students, etc. It'll help to get advice from the seniors, as well as share the burden of fear/anxiety with others in your cohort. You'll make it -- everyone does.

Edited February 16, 2011 by fall-11

[fall-11]

To echo Safferz, what it comes down to is not a matter of which school wants you more -- I think it's more about how secure YOU feel about yourself. If you were able to get those great offers, you are obviously VERY smart and talented. But if you can't believe in that yourself, then all the fellowships and awards in the world aren't going to make you feel good enough / special enough / smart enough, etc. You obviously ARE all of those things, but that belief has to come from within yourself, otherwise no amount of external validation (e.g. fellowships) will ever suffice.

[ZeeMore21]

Thanks again fall-11. To everyone, I know my post was f***** up and I am very sorry for posting such a silly sob story. I didn't ask the right questions. Instead of feeling sorry for myself, I will try to focus on how to make this situation work out and count my blessings. Everyone who is still waiting for an acceptance, please forgive me, seriously.

[Safferz]

Safferz, I do get what you are saying. But I think the first year teaching issue is important...mainly because if I am not unable to balance teaching and my coursework the first year, I could potentially lose the teaching assistantship and have no funding.

It's certainly a valid concern, but the majority of students in your program will be in the same boat as you and they manage. I was just speaking to your initial post, which seemed more concerned about not being a "top candidate" and your feelings that the school did not think highly enough of your abilities to *only* offer admission with full funding, which is why so many found the post to be rather insensitive and ridiculous.

[ZeeMore21]

Safferz,

Yes, my initial post was insensitive and ridiculous, hence I took it down. I do agree that I shouldn't have posted it in the first place. My main question should have been how to balance being an incoming PhD and teaching the first year--I should not have been comparing myself to other incoming students who will not have to teach because of a fellowship. Again, I apologize and will definitely think before posting...and pick up some self-esteem while I'm at it.

[cranberry]

Hey, I'm sorry I reacted harshly to your post. I assume you understand my feelings now, and also understand that this type of complex you are going to have to get over in life. Being insecure and overanxious about many things myself, I can sympathize with your worrying. However, please realize the great opportunity you have and do not pass it up for the reasons you listed previously.

[ZeeMore21]

Cranberry,

No need for an apology on your end, I should be the one apologizing. I really am being ungrateful. I agree, I do have to get over this feeling of self-doubt, especially if I want to do well in academia. Thanks for your honesty. I needed the tough love.

[ssundva]

You should be ecstatic because:

1. Most people get outright rejected from programs.

2. Some get waitlisted, but never actually get in.

3. Some get unfunded offers.

4. Very few, lucky applicants get funded offers, and the funding is usually supplied through a TAship.

5. One or two people in a department (often, at most) get a fellowship. As was said above, these fellowships are usually not determined by the department. And while they are often judged according to quantitative data which a department may not deem important, they are also sometimes related to cultural background, economic situation/history, specific research interest, etc. You don't have control over a lot of these things. If you fall into area #4, then you are, indeed, one of the very few, and one of the very lucky.

Rejoice! And congratulations!

[ZeeMore21]

Thanks for the advice ssundva. I am very lucky and will start acting like it. To everyone still waiting for acceptances, please accept my apologies and know that I am rooting for you.

[poppyensemble]

Thanks for the advice ssundva. I am very lucky and will start acting like it. To everyone still waiting for acceptances, please accept my apologies and know that I am rooting for you.

wow, a whole lot of 'tough love', as you say. : )

at the same time, you weren't at all defensive and quickly came to fully appreciate the other users' points of view, which i think says lots about your maturity and character.

honestly, we've all said (plenty of) things —just perhaps not on these boards— that were unfortunately timed and not particularly well thought out, that ended up (very reasonably, but definitely not intentionally) hurting others. and we pretty much all have many moments of self-doubt (i know i do at least!), and times where we simply freak out about everything and our self-worth and where we stand with others (even though we know we shouldn't).

so definitely be a lot more sensitive about where others are right now — as all your very sensible colleagues pointed out — but also don't be too hard on yourself. i think people were very frank and reasonable in telling you what upset them, but you also reacted pretty graciously.

last of all, congrats to you!

and good luck and strength to everybody at this extremely nerve-frazzling time of year!!