PhD chances and decision deadlines? (Pol Science)

[fenderpete]

Hi all...

I've applied to Princeton, Harvard, UPenn, Stanford, Columbia and Chicago for a PhD in Political Science for Fall 2009 entry.

I've also applied for a couple of scholarships which will probably give me a decision by the beginning of February.

I'll need to know what schools have accepted me by then to know whether to accept the scholarship or not if I get offered it (particularly the Thouron Award which is specific to UPenn).

On the GRE I ended up with Q610, V690 - I didn't do quite as well on the Quantitative as I had on one of my practices but I'm happy enough with my performance given the fact I only had 3 weeks to prepare and had a 4000 word essay due in as well. I'd done better on Quants in practice (I got a 680 on the first powerprep on Monday) but that's my highest Verbal. As it turns out the Princeton review practice test was pretty spot on, which predicted me Q610, V650...

Out of interest, do you think those will be good enough to get my application considered by the big unis for a PhD in Political Science? I've applied to Harvard, Princeton, Stanford, UPenn, Columbia and Chicago.

My extracurriculars are very strong as is the rest of my app and references, I'm just worried the GRE Quants isn't quite good enough...

Do you know when I'll be likely to get a decision from the universities I've applied to? How would you rate my chances?

Thanks!

[frankdux]

you need to be a bit more specific here with your grades, LORs, and extracurricular activities.

and i also wouldn't recommend only applying to 6 of the top 10 or top 15 schools with the attitude: "with my stats i'm bound to get into at least ONE of those!"

you need a few lesser, but still good schools thrown in there. how about Northwestern?

[fenderpete]

Sorry, apologies for my initial lack of specificity!

LOR wise I've got two from extremely well respected professors - the main one of which I did research work for over the summer, and he's appeared on numerous news channels as a commentator on conflict resolution etc. The other professor is well known in the field of terrorism and counterterrorism. My third reference came from my (now ex) head of department and was basically able to shore up all the extracurriculars I did within my department. The only potential problem is that they won't be as well known in the USA.

Grades wise I won a prize for the top marks in my year last year, and have kept that average up this year. I'm currently on a 73 - which at an English university is the equivalent of summa cum laude, and should hopefully keep me near the top of my year. I should, all being well, graduate with a first class honours degree.

Extracurriculars wise... Last year I was president of the university Politics Society, took the society from a position of considerable debt and won four awards at the university wide society awards (including individual contribution award and most improved society). I was also Assistant Editor of the student run newspaper and this year I'm the Student Union council representative for my department. I've also played football for the society team and helped arrange a trip to DC and NYC for the Easter break. I spent the summer teaching in a high school and then worked in a refugee camp in Palestine for two weeks over the summer and I've since started learning Arabic.

In terms of applying to other universities, I'd rather wait a year and reapply than go to a lesser university. If I don't get a position at one of my top six choices I'm planning to apply for an internship with NATO or failing that go back out to the Middle East for six months to get my Arabic up to a higher standard.

Anything else you'd need to know to give me a reasonable idea of my chances?

Thanks!

[rising_star]

Personally, I wouldn't make a decision about a scholarship without knowing all of my admissions options. When is the deadline to reply to the scholarships?

[fenderpete]

I'm assuming they'll want to know pretty soon after they offer me it, which would be early February. I suppose if I get offered it I can ask the other schools I've applied to for some sort of indication of whether I'm likely to get it?

What do you reckon about the rest of my profile for admission? (apologies for posting in the other thread, wasn't sure whether I should have posted there instead!)

[studentfromLA]

All schools work on the same April 15th acceptance-of-offers deadline, at least for students from the US. You should know by early February where you stand with the schools, and will have a couple of months to investigate your options. I personally wouldn't call a school and tell them I was admitted elsewhere before they'd gotten back to me.

I don't understand your hesitation to apply to a school other than the select few you've chosen. You've already done all the work for the application process anyhow. Unless you've decided that you only want to go to grad school if you can get into a particular school or study with a particular professor, it doesn't make that much sense to me. Even for the best-pedigreed students, there are so many factors out of your control that go into an offer of acceptance, such as whether professors in your field of interest have funding in a given year to take on a new student. Unless you have an inside line on the schools you are applying to -- i.e. have had communications with professors at each one and know that your field of interest is at a premium, I personally wouldn't limit my options if I were you.

[Minnesotan]

I'm moving this to PoliSci, since it is field-specific.

[flyingwalrus]

You really need to apply to some lower ranked schools and at least one true fallback school. What fields are you interested in? I may be able to offer suggestions. Also, my guess is that the people on admissions committees aren't going to care much about your extracurricular activities, so I'd recommend against spending too much time talking about them in your personal statement. Unless of course they are directly relevant to your research agenda.

[fenderpete]

I'm interested primarily in conflict resolution, the Middle East, diplomacy/negotiation (and the making of foreign policy) and terrorism/counterinsurgency.

The main thing holding me back from applying is how expensive it is. I've already spent about $800 on applications including the GRE. I want to go to a college where practice rather than theory is emphasised, as I want to go and work in foreign policy, rather than work as an academic. I would have loved the Georgetown MSFS program but I can't get funding for a Masters as an overseas student and the Johns Hopkins SAIS course is much the same and they don't offer a PhD to students unless you've already completed a Masters.

If I can't get into the colleges I've applied to then I think I'd be better to pursue work experience and get my Arabic up to a high level as that may well stand me in better stead than a degree from a lesser institution. I could then reapply later.

What do you guys think? There's a lack of professors in my university who can advise me on what the best route into a career in the practice of diplomacy is...

Thanks a lot

[flyingwalrus]

I'm interested primarily in conflict resolution, the Middle East, diplomacy/negotiation (and the making of foreign policy) and terrorism/counterinsurgency.

The main thing holding me back from applying is how expensive it is. I've already spent about $800 on applications including the GRE. I want to go to a college where practice rather than theory is emphasised, as I want to go and work in foreign policy, rather than work as an academic. I would have loved the Georgetown MSFS program but I can't get funding for a Masters as an overseas student and the Johns Hopkins SAIS course is much the same and they don't offer a PhD to students unless you've already completed a Masters.

If I can't get into the colleges I've applied to then I think I'd be better to pursue work experience and get my Arabic up to a high level as that may well stand me in better stead than a degree from a lesser institution. I could then reapply later.

What do you guys think? There's a lack of professors in my university who can advise me on what the best route into a career in the practice of diplomacy is...

Thanks a lot

If you're interested in a diplomatic career, then a PhD in political science is not for you.

[fenderpete]

Any particular reason you say that and care to elaborate a little more? Most of the high ranking figures from the NSC and State Department over the last few decades have held a doctorate.

[convex]

fenderpete, you sound well qualified, but I do not think you are applying to the correct places for what you want to do. None of the programs you mentioned are going to emphasize practice over theory, because all of them (and pretty much any political science PhD program) are designed for people who want to be researchers. If you really think you need a doctoral degree would recommend looking at the following schools for what you want:

1. International Relations/Pacific Studies at the University of California, San Diego (note that this is different from the political science department)

2. Hopkins SAIS. I see that you've already looked at this and saw that they prefer students who already have a graduate degree, but you should consider applying to the MA program and then moving on to the doctoral program.

3. The University of Denver's Josef Korbel School of International Studies. A lot of diplomats and high-ranking officials went there, so this might be more what you are looking for.

You should talk to your professors about this though. I think they will tell you that you should consider getting a Master's degree instead, and I think this is the best advice. Look into some public affairs type of professional degree programs that focus on IR. I hear Security Studies at MIT is pretty good, and also all three places I mentioned above offer a Master's degree. I think Columbia's SIPA is considered very good for this as well. Also, if you do not believe me and apply to these places anyway, I do not think that you will be admitted with a Statement of Purpose that says you would like to be a diplomat of government official.

[Leica]

If you're interested in a diplomatic career in the UK, why not complete your postgraduate studies there? That would seem to be the logical course of action. A PhD from an American institution wouldn't set you on that track.

[fenderpete]

Hi all, thanks for the replies.

I want to pursue a career in the USA - which is what's motivating me to study there at the highest level I can. UK PhDs are even more academia focused and lead pretty much to professorship and nothing else. We also don't have the same atmosphere of policy influencing think-tanks like Brookings etc.

The WWS program does have Public Policy and 'real world' applications, from reading around I think Penn and Stanford would not be dissimilar and all offer very good work placements.

Basically most people I've spoken to have said that without a doctorate you'd potentially be capped in terms of career progression in later years. I love the look of all the programs you've mentioned convex but I can't help getting the impression that bigger 'name' institutions open more doors. Doing a Masters isn't really an option as I simply don't have the money to finance that.

I basically want to get an intimate knowledge of my area of specialisation (security and the Middle East) during a PhD that I can then take to the work environment...

Do you think my application is strong enough to get offers from the places I've applied to?

[milkbaba]

I'm applying PhD polisci to Yale, NYU, UC-San Diego, Johns Hopkins and Columbia. Any idea of my chances or should I first get a masters to build up my credentials? I have been accepted to Cambridge Mphil in Contemporary South Asian Studies (this is my region of focus).

Background:

Yale BA, distinction in polisci GPA: 3.72

Currently, Yale Fox International Fellow at Jawaharlal Nehru University in Delhi, India (one of the top five schools in India), researching globalization in India

State Dept Critical language Scholar for Arabic

was president of major student organization at Yale

one rec from dean of a college at Yale but other two are from junior faculty (one prof. told me he wrote a "very strong" rec)

GRE: 550 quant/760 verbal. Waiting for AW score. (I have stressed in my SOP that I use more qualitative than quantitative methods in my research)

presented papers at three conferences in US and in India

two papers published in student journals, one peer reviewed

one paper published in Indian academic journal

languages: Hindi, Urdu, Arabic, Spanish, English

[dodger]

I'm applying PhD polisci to Yale, NYU, UC-San Diego, Johns Hopkins and Columbia. Any idea of my chances or should I first get a masters to build up my credentials? I have been accepted to Cambridge Mphil in Contemporary South Asian Studies (this is my region of focus).

Background:

Yale BA, distinction in polisci GPA: 3.72

Currently, Yale Fox International Fellow at Jawaharlal Nehru University in Delhi, India (one of the top five schools in India), researching globalization in India

State Dept Critical language Scholar for Arabic

was president of major student organization at Yale

one rec from dean of a college at Yale but other two are from junior faculty (one prof. told me he wrote a "very strong" rec)

GRE: 550 quant/760 verbal. Waiting for AW score. (I have stressed in my SOP that I use more qualitative than quantitative methods in my research)

presented papers at three conferences in US and in India

two papers published in student journals, one peer reviewed

one paper published in Indian academic journal

languages: Hindi, Urdu, Arabic, Spanish, English

you have great credentials, especially with languages. i'd say that you'll most likely get into Hopkins and NYU, and have a good chance at Columbia, Yale, and San Diego. Yale might not take you though since you went there for undergrad, and they don't like to "inbreed".

[Penelope Higgins]

Of all the programs 'milkbaba' listed, NYU is the one that is most focused on quantitative work in their PhD program, so it might not be a great match for you... But those qualifications should get you a good look lots of other places.

[milkbaba]

Thanks guys! I have heard mixed things about going from undergrad to PhD at the same school. Sounds like it could very well be a big negative for me, at least regarding Yale. I have also heard of NYU being heavy quant, though they do stress that if an applicant does not have a quant background, then NYU may still admit them on the precondition that they take micro/macro before enrolling at NYU.

Has anyone heard about JHU's reputation for polisci PhD? It is slightly outside of the top 25, and of course the old adage is that if you aren't in a top 25 PhD program...youre out.

[flyingwalrus]

Has anyone heard about JHU's reputation for polisci PhD? It is slightly outside of the top 25, and of course the old adage is that if you aren't in a top 25 PhD program...your out.

Not good. It should be last on your depth chart.

[ordinonuovo]

Are you guys talking about the PhD program they have at SAIS, or the one at their main campus in

Baltimore? I hear their main campus PhD program is decent in theory, but don't know about the other

subfields. Not many people know about the IR PhD program in DC, and well, that explains alot I guess.

since more people would know about it if it was a great program.

[ztrooop]

GRE Quant is becoming increasingly important in admission decision in PoliSci PhD program. I would say you need at least 700 to get in NYU ( or Rochester or Stanford) since the mean score for those admitted is like 750 there..

[dysmetria]

convex is right, stating a preference for a nonacademic career path will probably kill your application.