Adviser Leaving, Ask to Go?

[doeraymee]

I'm in an unusual situation and any thoughts/advice would be much appreciated. I started a PhD program in CS in the fall and I have two advisers (not typical for the school but was condition of funding). The one adviser that I have much more in common with has been offered a job at another school. If he decides to go, I would like to go with him as I'm worried that since I would still have one adviser left at the school my relationship with the (possibly) departing adviser might not be as strong. When would be the appropriate time to ask him about his plans? Should I mention that I would like to go with him or let him bring it up? Should I even ask him about any of this at all or wait for him to bring it up? (I heard about the offer from the adviser who will be staying.)

[orangeMan]

But it means that you have to apply to a new PhD program at the new university, doesn't it? You can't go from Michigan to Harvard just because your advisor is moving . . . can you?

[doeraymee]

You do have to apply, but I hear that the process is streamlined in situations like this. Doesn't guarantee acceptance, but your probability is improved

[Eigen]

The process depends on where you are in your PhD.

What year are you?

Usually, for students past cumulative exams and into the candidacy phase, they would go to the new university with their professor, but still receive their degree from the previous institution. It's really, really unusual for a professor to take students along with them and have them receive their degrees from the new school. For the latter to happen, you'd need to apply, and then likely re-take courses, cumulative exams, etc. if there are any differences between the schools, and there almost always are.

For a view of it from the PIs side: http://chronicle.com/forums/index.php/topic,83905.msg2019825.html#msg2019825

[fuzzylogician]

Since you just started it sounds like you'll have to reapply and start over at the new school. Your advisor may be able to virtually guarantee your acceptance but you'll probably still have to repeat the first year. If that is what you want to do - assuming that your advisor will move next year and that admissions decisions for next year are made right around now, you need to talk to your advisor as soon as possible. It may be premature for many reasons, but I think the potential for complications is high if you don't bring this up now.

[StrangeLight]

in my experience with profs moving, you have to reapply but the process is streamlined. you have to take (or re-take) comps at the new school if you want your degree from them, but that doesn't mean you have to "start over." you might have an additional year of coursework to cover the books they demand, or maybe just an additional semester, but you by no means count as a first-year student by making that transition.

and in some instances, profs who are being courted by other schools will make it a condition of their acceptance that their grad students can come with them. in those instances, any application the student is asked to create is a mere formality.

if you know for certain that your advisor is leaving (rather than just in talks or negotiations) then you should ask him how you should be preparing for his departure. tell him that you would like to continue your working relationship and ask him how it would be best to proceed. if he says he wants you to come with, then figure out what that entails. if he says he's willing to advise you from afar, you can ask about potentially joining him, but take that as a sign that you should stay where you are. if he says he thinks he's leaving you in good hands with your other advisor, i'd leave it at that.

also, be sure not to jump the gun. most professors apply for other jobs in order to renegotiate their contracts at their current universities with no intention of actually leaving. they just say "harvard wants me, so you'll need to pay more to keep me." that is, unfortunately, how it works.

[rising_star]

But it means that you have to apply to a new PhD program at the new university, doesn't it? You can't go from Michigan to Harvard just because your advisor is moving . . . can you?

Yep, you can and people do.

Usually, for students past cumulative exams and into the candidacy phase, they would go to the new university with their professor, but still receive their degree from the previous institution. It's really, really unusual for a professor to take students along with them and have them receive their degrees from the new school. For the latter to happen, you'd need to apply, and then likely re-take courses, cumulative exams, etc. if there are any differences between the schools, and there almost always are.

I think this might be something that varies widely from one discipline to the next. In the social sciences, it is very common for students to move with their advisors to a new institution and, depending on when in the student's program this happens, for those students to get their degree from the new university. During the first year of my PhD program I shared an office with another of my advisor's students that had moved with him when he came to the university 2.5 years prior. While she did apply, it was basically as useless/informal as when existing MA students apply to the PhD program at the university they're already at. She did not have to redo any coursework, nor did the other student that came with him to the new school. I can't say for sure how all of this was resolved since it's not addressed in our graduate handbook but it can and would be negotiated by the PI and DGS, so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

If you've already done your exams, then you could move to the new school as a Ph.D. candidate and complete your research there while still earning a degree from the previous institution. But that is not the situation the OP is in so it doesn't make sense to spend much time discussing it here.

Since you just started it sounds like you'll have to reapply and start over at the new school. Your advisor may be able to virtually guarantee your acceptance but you'll probably still have to repeat the first year. If that is what you want to do - assuming that your advisor will move next year and that admissions decisions for next year are made right around now, you need to talk to your advisor as soon as possible. It may be premature for many reasons, but I think the potential for complications is high if you don't bring this up now.

Given that the job search and admissions application timelines are different, it is highly unlikely the department would hold it against the OP for not formally applying now. Much more likely is that the OP would want the advisor to include admission and funding for him/her in his/her job package negotiations. (Yes, students can be negotiated about just like start-up and moving funds.) So, I like Strangelight's advice about talking to the advisor to see what the overall situation is, how likely going to the new university is (or if it's just a ploy for a pay raise to stay where s/he already is), and how that would affect the OP's own graduate career. Framing it as a discussion about planning your own future is the best approach, imo. Once you understand what your advisor's plans are, you can then mention your openness/willingness to move to the new university and explain how doing so will benefit you and your career.

in my experience with profs moving, you have to reapply but the process is streamlined. you have to take (or re-take) comps at the new school if you want your degree from them, but that doesn't mean you have to "start over." you might have an additional year of coursework to cover the books they demand, or maybe just an additional semester, but you by no means count as a first-year student by making that transition.

and in some instances, profs who are being courted by other schools will make it a condition of their acceptance that their grad students can come with them. in those instances, any application the student is asked to create is a mere formality.

This has been my experience as well. In fact, in some cases, the only application required is the official graduate school one that must be completed for anyone to enroll at the university. No recommendation letters or anything like that were ever reviewed by the department.

My advisor brought along several students when he came to my university ~6 years ago. The ones that were beyond coursework and exams stayed at his old university and he flew back for dissertation/thesis defenses. Those doing coursework came with him to the new university, which accepted their coursework and didn't require them to do an extra year of work or anything. If the school wants your advisor and your advisor wants to bring you, everyone will work to make things go as smoothly as possible.

also, be sure not to jump the gun. most professors apply for other jobs in order to renegotiate their contracts at their current universities with no intention of actually leaving. they just say "harvard wants me, so you'll need to pay more to keep me." that is, unfortunately, how it works.

I definitely agree with this. Given the budget situation at many universities right now, the only way for professors to get a raise is by looking for and being offered another job. They actually have to show the job offer letter with the higher pay to even be considered for a raise. My advisor is always looking at other jobs and has, in the past, applied for some. But we all know that we'd either go with him or stay behind but still be his student.

[InquilineKea]

I think this might be something that varies widely from one discipline to the next. In the social sciences, it is very common for students to move with their advisors to a new institution and, depending on when in the student's program this happens, for those students to get their degree from the new university. During the first year of my PhD program I shared an office with another of my advisor's students that had moved with him when he came to the university 2.5 years prior. While she did apply, it was basically as useless/informal as when existing MA students apply to the PhD program at the university they're already at. She did not have to redo any coursework, nor did the other student that came with him to the new school. I can't say for sure how all of this was resolved since it's not addressed in our graduate handbook but it can and would be negotiated by the PI and DGS, so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Wow... Interesting. I wonder if this happens anywhere else?

Edited January 29, 2012 by InquilineKea