Where to go for MA in Classical Archaeology?

[greenmonk]

Ok...so I want to get my PhD in Classical Archaeology. I'm thinking with my background and current situation, going for the terminal MA first would be the best way for me to get into a PhD program. Here's why...I graduated with my BA in Classics in 2000. Yes, that long ago! I went to the University of Arizona as an undergraduate. After I graduated, I moved to DC and worked for a couple years and ended up getting my Masters in Public Policy in 2005. Since then, I've come to the conclusion that I am only happy studying classical archaeology and teaching people about ancient cultures. It's been a long and hard road, but I just can't work in a field that doesn't make me smile every day. That's where going to grad school (again!) comes in.

I wouldn't be able to apply for three more years because of a three year commitment I made at work. That doesn't matter much anyways because I plan on taking the next three years to re-study Greek and Latin, plus take one year of German. It will take me three years to take that many classes. I'm lucky that here in DC I can always take accelerated Latin and Greek at Catholic University over the summers and take more intermediate classes during the regular semesters. I'll still be working full-time, so I'll only be able to take 1-2 classes a semester. At least that's my plan.

Since I've been out of the game so long, I'm curious as to what schools you guys feel are top notch with their Classical Archaeology programs. I'm obviously going to apply to Arizona, but I don't know what other programs might help me get into a PhD program.

After reading the forums here, I've looked at a post-bac at Georgetown, but feel that it wouldn't really do me any good since I only need to brush up on my languages. I've also looked at the Greek & Latin Certificate at Catholic University, but don't know if I want to spend that much money. The reason I don't think I need a post-bac is because during my undergrad I took 66 units of Classics courses (focusing on art and archaeology), which includes the Greek and Latin I took. Only 32 units were required for the major. I went a little Classics crazy! :-)

Any advice would be appreciated. I already have the link for classicaljournal.org, so no need to tell me to go there. I'm checking it out right now. I'm just looking for some suggestions on top notch schools. I already have a generic email written to send to the potential programs which I will individualize as I send them. I just need to know who to look at and who I should probably contact.

[Rendar]

Have you looked at Canadian schools? We have an excellent program at Alberta! UBC is another great place.

Unfortunately I don't know what the funding situation would be for international students in light of the tuition differential.

[ArthurEvans]

Greenmonk, I was like you about 6 years ago and I'm going to to tell you what I wish someone had told me: the likelihood that you will be able to have a career in Classical Archaeology is slim to none. There are just not enough jobs out there and the constant VAP/Adjunct life (with 3/3 or 4/4 teaching loads, low pay, and low to no benefits) is not one that will make you smile.

Are you prepared to spend 7 years of your life (2 for an MA and 5 for a PhD, and that's being generous, 8 or 9 is more likely) earning that PhD only to emerge on the other end without that job that makes you smile?

I know it's hard to hear these things but know what you're getting into and know what awaits you on the other end.

[rkg2012]

Greenmonk, Arizona was the only American school I felt was worth it for me to apply to last year. I ended up turning it down to study in the UK, which has certainly been worth it. Depending on your interests (and financial situation), there are several excellent schools, not just Oxbridge. In the states, I know people who applied to FSU and Vanderbilt as well (both have funding), but I think that those programs are more geared towards ancient history. Tufts is rubbish. Some post-bacc programs allow you to take additional course - I took graduate level archaeology classes with my languages at Penn. ~$2,500 per class, but that's less than many places. On the other hand, if you have the strong archaeology background and you do take classes at Catholic, why applying to PhDs and MAs at the same time is not necessarily unthinkable. While you're taking classes at Catholic, see what those profs have to say on the matter. It might also be worth it to email your old profs.

The road to a PhD and career is certainly a long and arduous one, but you sound motivated enough to make it work. I couldn't imagine doing it if I had been out of undergrad for 10+ years, but if it's what you're passionate about, then go for it. Get into good programs and impress the right people and everything will eventually work out. Don't let Arthur Evans discourage you. If he was applying for programs in 2011, he's not actually on the other end. He's right that you shouldn't be naive about it, but it's not all doom and gloom. Most of my old TAs had to do a postdoc/adjunct position or two, but to the best of my knowledge, they have all found tenure track positions. It is worth it to find out placement records when you investigate PhD programs.

Good luck!

[ArthurEvans]

When there are maybe 10 TT jobs available a year (a few of which will certainly go to established people in the field) and well over 100 people applying for them, things will certainly not "eventually work out."

Greenmonk will probably ignore what I am saying anyway; I would have if someone had said the same to me when I once imagined I could have a career in Classsical Archaeology. But at least someone will have said it.

[Beelzebub]

Greenmonk, I'm not sure if there's anything substantive I can say about classical archaeology, which isn't really my field, but I agree that you should be concerned about the academic job market for classicists and humanities students in general. I'm not saying that you should not pursue your passion (and if archaeology is the only thing you can envision yourself doing, then go for it!), but that you should be realistic about graduate school and the difficult path for academics after graduate school. True, most people from top programs eventually get tenure somewhere, but only after 6 years getting a PhD, probably 2 years as a visiting professor, a postdoc, or an adjunct, and then 6 or 7 years as an assistant professor. Your case is particularly difficult because it has been over ten years since you got your BA. Assume, then, that everything goes smoothly as you plan it: you will spend 3 years doing post-bac work in addition to your job, then at least 6 years in graduate school, then 2 years of non-permanent employment, before getting a tenure-track position. It all just comes down to this: are you willing to spend the next 10+ years in relative poverty (it might be better if you already have some savings) and uncertainty of future in exchange for the possibility of studying classical archaeology? You will have to move a lot in the next 10 years; that's okay and even exciting if you are fresh out of undergrad, but if you are building a family with someone, it's much harder. Will your family be willing to move wherever your job/graduate school is located? Those are just some of the considerations.

Again, I really am not trying to discourage you to do archaeology, but there will be a lot of challenges, academic or otherwise, if you decide to. Anyway, I hope everything works out in the end!

[Frostfire]

Everybody is so busy talking about TT positions, and making good points, that they're forgetting something rather important. There are, in fact, jobs for classical archaeologists beyond the standard TT of academia. People get into museum work, academic publishing, and other related things. And you don't have to be in academia proper to keep working on digs and such. It all depends on what your goal is for that PhD. Now, in fairness, for some of this, you can probably top out with a master's degree, but that's something that you can figure out along the way.

Just something to keep in mind.

[rkg2012]

When there are maybe 10 TT jobs available a year (a few of which will certainly go to established people in the field) and well over 100 people applying for them, things will certainly not "eventually work out."

Greenmonk will probably ignore what I am saying anyway; I would have if someone had said the same to me when I once imagined I could have a career in Classsical Archaeology. But at least someone will have said it.

If you are persistent, motivated, good at what you do, and know the right people, then yes, they will. I never said it would be easy. My professors have always done their best to make sure that no one applied with that delusion. Maybe I have been lucky and known the right people, but as difficult as it is, it is not a dismal prospect if it truly is your passion. Venturing down the PhD path is a risk that each person needs to decide whether s/he is willing to take. You simply don't go into Classics or archaeology if you want a high-paying job.

Beelzebub makes some good points - there is a lot you have to consider. Since you already have the job commitment, you have plenty of time to really think about it and decide what is best for you.

[greenmonk]

Thanks for the concern everyone. I do realize what I am getting myself into. I've thought a lot about it. I don't have to have a TT position to be happy in the end. If I end up going that route and it works out....great! If not, it's still better than being stuck in a career I don't smile about every day. I'd rather spend the rest of my life making very little, but being happy rather than making a 6-figure salary and not being happy. At this point in my life, I just can't imagine working another 30 years being unhappy and unfulfilled. That's what I've learned over that last 10 years. Classical Archaeology has been and always will be my passion in life.

I am ready and prepared to live in poverty for the next 10 years. I learned in college that I'm actually pretty good at living in poverty. It's really only been the last 4 years that I've lived like I actually make money. And yes, I do have some savings and a good amount in retirement already. And when I sell my house to start school in 3 years, hopefully I'll have even more money. It won't be tons, but it will be enough to get me through grad school. I also don't mind moving around. I don't have a family at this point in my life, so there is no one I am tied to.

In the absolute worst case scenario where I would earn my PhD, not be able to find any kind of job and have to fall back on my 1st Masters....at least I have some amazing work experience on my resume that will get me a great paying job in the mean time. I would then just have to keep trying until I got something relating to Classics. I'm very determined to do this. Of course, anything can happen in 3 years, but my goal is to go back to school.

[Pius Aeneas]

I just want to say that I'm pretty sure that anyone who seriously considers going into the academic world at all has some kind of idea how bad the job situation is---give people some credit. I was given the same talk discouraging pursuit of a PhD by a professor in my department whom I asked for advice. I was essentially told that I wasn't serious and that no Classical Archaeology program would accept me, and that job market was so abysmal that I shouldn't even try anyway. Did I listen to this person's advice? Of course I didn't. I applied anyway and I've been accepted by one program so far. Someone else mentioned this already, and it personally applies to me: if you can't imagine yourself doing anything else, then go for it. I can't imagine doing anything else. I suppose it's different for me as I'm only 22 and going straight from undergrad, but again, if you cannot imagine doing anything else, then go for it.

[Classico]

As one who's up there with you, I say every graduate program could use a shot of some true Gen X fighting spirit. Follow your bliss, old sport.

[sacklunch]

Greenmonk, I was like you about 6 years ago and I'm going to to tell you what I wish someone had told me: the likelihood that you will be able to have a career in Classical Archaeology is slim to none. There are just not enough jobs out there and the constant VAP/Adjunct life (with 3/3 or 4/4 teaching loads, low pay, and low to no benefits) is not one that will make you smile.

Are you prepared to spend 7 years of your life (2 for an MA and 5 for a PhD, and that's being generous, 8 or 9 is more likely) earning that PhD only to emerge on the other end without that job that makes you smile?

I know it's hard to hear these things but know what you're getting into and know what awaits you on the other end.

I hate to admit it, but you're right. I guess if after another ten years I don't get a job, ill just work at Walmart. Prolly pays about the same.

[Rendar]

My two cents would be who the heck goes into academia looking for a job

There are always jobs out there. Use grad school to do something you love but also expand your knowledge base and skillset. Everyone I know in Classical Archaeology has graduated and got a job. It's not necessarily a tenture track position at Harvard, but they're all happy and doing what they love.

Think outside the tenture track, university position box and you'll find that there *are* options out there for archaeologists. But at the same time, particularly when you're doing Classical work, make sure to get a solid anthropological foundation and not get too buried in Classics alone.

[Pius Aeneas]

Rendar,

I really agree with your last point. I decided to do a double major as an undergrad, coupling Classical Civilization with Anthropology, as well as minors in French and Francophone Studies and Latin. My motto is "be interdisciplinary". Obviously you need your special area of expertise, but it doesn't hurt to be versed in a variety of areas. For Classics and Anthropology, if you focus heavily on the interplay between the two, you can probably find a position in either type of department.

Edited February 22, 2012 by Pius Aeneas

[greenmonk]

Funny you mention anthropology because I was just looking at anthropology departments today. Wondering if there are any places I can get a dual MA that won't take me 4 years to complete. That way I would be able to diversify myself at the Masters level and focus in on Classical Archaeology specifically at the PhD level. Hmmmm....something to think about.

Thanks for everyone's replies. They've all been helpful to me. If anyone has anything else to say, please speak up. And if you have any other suggestions for schools other than what's already been mentioned, please let me know.

[Philomeides]

I know this is an old thread, but just saw it and wanted to throw in my two cents. I'm a Romanist myself, but have really enjoyed learning more about the archaeology of the Southeastern United States. As an archaeological field tech, I spend every day outside digging up artifacts and, even if they are a bit younger than I was originally interested in, the prehistoric finds you pick up in the Appalachians are fascinating. Finding a soapstone quarry with petroglyph-covered boulders -- incredible!

Even if reaching academe is your goal, perhaps consider programs which can offer you some contemporary US/Canada/wherever-you-want-to-live courses. That way you could always work as a tech/become a project leader/work on digs in some way while you're searching for that coveted TT position later on.

[bkohn4]

I'm also planning on joining the hopeless ranks of classical archaeologists, but I'm taking the post-baccalaureate route because my Greek and Latin was simply not up to par. I have my undergrad paid for (University of Dayton), but now I'll be piling post bac expenses on top of what I'll be paying for my MA/PhD. Should I abandon ship now? I don't see myself doing anything else and can't stand the thought of simply settling for a US archaeology career (all I want is to be an archaeologist, really). Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to have a nervous breakdown in the corner...