Current FSO taking questions

[silverheadphones]

Hello.  I haven't even taken the FSOT so I know this question is a huge hypothetical, but:  

 

1)  I recently failed a polygraph for the FBI when I applied to them.  I know you don't know me, but it really was a "false positive," as they call it.  Do you happen to know if this will count against me should I make it as far as the background check portion of the process for FSO?  

 

Also, 

 

2) I am interested in the consular track for the following reasons:

         - I am attracted to work that involves crisis management / dealing with people in distress  

         - I also enjoy work that involves managing day-to-day-whatever-pops-up / putting out "fires" with an especially keen interest in personnel management.  

         - I would like to work in areas that are not-so-U.S. friendly

 

I know I've only given limited information, but am I barking up the wrong tree or do you think the consular track (or being an FSO for that matter) may be the way to go based on the information I've given?  I have taken the quiz on the DOS website a few times, and I always come out ahead for the consular track.  Not sure if that was around when you applied, but do you have any thoughts as to whether or not that quiz is a pretty reliable indicator of which career track may be the best fit for a person?  

 

[CurrentFSO]

1.)  I honestly don't know.  I can't think of any similar instances with people I know, so I just don't have any data points to make a comparison.

 

2.)  In entry-level consular work, you will adjudicate non-immigrant visas and may also have opportunities to adjudicate immigrant visas and/or passport and consular report of birth abroad applications.  You may have the opportunity to visit U.S. citizens in jail overseas, but you may not, depending on where you serve and what opportunities available.  If you serve at a smaller post, you may have some role in managing locally engaged staff.  So, you may be putting our fires, but you may be sitting in a visa window interviewing 100+ visa applicants a day. 

 

As a mid-level (so after your first two tours) officer, you'll likely spend more of your time managing entry level officers and locally engaged staff, instructing them on procedures and laws, interfacing with various offices in Washington, etc., but may also spend some of your time doing the same things you did as an entry level officer. 

 

As a senior-level officer (not all FSOs will make it this far), you may head a large consular section, be in charge of consular affairs for a whole country, etc.  

[silverheadphones]

Thank you very much for your responses.  I do have a follow-up question if I may:

 

I am sure that you did a lot of research of FSO job descriptions before you applied.  Did you find the information available on the DOS career website that describes each track to be relatively close to reality?  I say "relatively" because it seems like even within the same career track, day-to-day work varies depending on the location / size of the post you are assigned to, as well as a number of other factors.  

 

I am trying to collect as much information as I can, and I have found your forum and this blog - http://www.foreignservicetest.com/#sthash.XSKUafIT.mQmFXGjL.dpbs- to be very helpful.  

 

Thank you again.

[CurrentFSO]

Well, there's only so much they can put on the website.  You might want to check out the books "Career Diplomacy" by Harry Kopp, "Inside a U.S. Embassy" by Shawn Dorman, and/or "America's Other Army" by Nicholas Kralev for more info on the different career tracks and life in the Foreign Service. 

[AMNBAKER85]

CurrentFSO:

 

Thank you in advance for taking the time to answer this, and all the other questions, it is much appreciated! 

 

My question pertains to massive student loan debt. I am planning on attending Graduate School and by the time I complete I will have amassed around 50k in student loan debt.  I understand that student loan debt is quite common nowadays, however, I was wondering if that amount of debt will hinder my chances of becoming an FSO.  Moreover, will one typically have issues obtaining a security clearance with that amount of debt?  Lastly, do you happen to know if the State Department takes part in the Public Service Loan Forgiveness?  Thanks a lot!

[CurrentFSO]

No one can pre-adjudicate a security clearance, but debt in and of itself is not necessarily a dealbreaker.  A lot of FSOs have significant student loan debt and it didn't hinder their security clearance process.  For the most part, as long as you've been responsible with your payments, 50k isn't a problem.  There are a lot of recovering lawyers in the Foreign Service with significantly more than 50k loan debt.  

[kaseyleigh]

Hi! This has been a really interesting post. Thanks so much for answering questions! I am not sure that being a FSO is my end goal, but it is certainly fascinating and this post has got me thinking about it a little more. I think my primary worry is safety, and I know you already touched on danger posts a bit. You mentioned that typically you won't get sent to an unaccompanied post unless you specifically ask for that. Was this just for those with children, or is this for anyone? I know you said your first post was a danger post... did you specifically request that place? 

 

I appreciate your insight!

[CurrentFSO]

When you accept an offer of employment as an FSO, you agree to worldwide availability, meaning that State can send you wherever they need you.  Your first two tours are directed tours, meaning that you get a bid list of available jobs, provide input on which jobs you want and why you want them, but at the end of the day, HR tells you where you're going.  So, you have input but limited control over where you go for your first two posts and could end up with something you don't really want.

 

That said, in my experience, people haven't been sent to unaccompanied posts without volunteering.  There are Priority Staffing Posts that are unaccompanied, and currently include Pakistan, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, and Yemen (though DOS doesn't have people posted in Libya and Yemen right now).  Currently, DOS policy is to not send first tour officers to those posts.  There are limited positions for second tour officers in those posts and there are typically more volunteers than there are positions available.  People are interested in the jobs there because they're interested in those issues, like the financial incentives, like the career-enhancing aspect of them, etc.  

 

There are some other posts that are at least partially unaccompanied, meaning that perhaps adult spouses can come but not school-aged children.  Some examples I can think of are Tunis, Algiers, and Beirut.  Those can appear on a first tour bid list, and you could be directed there, but again, my experience has been that there have been more volunteers for those types of posts than jobs available.  

 

There are also danger posts that are considered accompanied, so family members can accompany FSOs at those posts.  A couple of examples of these that spring to mind are Mexican border posts and Bogota.  You could be assigned to any of those posts and depending on the post, there may or may not be a lot of people interested in it.  

 

There are also posts with high crime rates that are not considered danger posts.  I'm far from an expert on how hardship and danger differentials are calculated, but general crime falls under hardship.  So, Caracas, which has a very high crime rate, has a high hardship differential due to crime and other factors, but does not have any danger pay.  Again, a new FSO could be sent to those posts.  

 

After your first two tours, the process becomes much more of an interview process.  So, you choose to bid on 6-15 jobs normally, and it's then up to you to convince the people in charge of staffing decisions that you're the best candidate for a job.  So, if you don't want an unaccompanied or danger post, you don't bid on those.  There may be tradeoffs you have to make to avoid those jobs, but it may be possible to avoid them for quite some time.  

 

I've known people with children who were directed to danger posts and people without children who have not (yet, at least) served in danger posts.  So, having children or not won't necessarily have a bearing on whether you might be directed to a danger post.  I did not specifically request the danger post I ended up in.  It was a large post with a high need for entry level officers, so someone had to go.  

 

I think that one can manage the timing of danger posts in their career and can make some tradeoffs, but the fact of the matter is that we need people to go to danger posts to do important work and it's not fair to ask the same people to go to those places over and over again.  So, I think that it's highly likely, if not inevitable, that FSOs entering the service today should expect to do a tour or two, at the very least, in a danger post over the course of their career.  

 

Though, given all of that talk about danger and unaccompanied posts, can you guess what I've heard over and over that the leading cause of death for FSOs is?  

 

*drum roll*  

 

Car accidents.  

[loveglove]

I've lived the vast majority of my life abroad. Most of the people I know are not American. Would this be viewed positively or negatively by the state department? 

 

Edit: Also, what about multiple citizenships? Would this factor negatively?

Edited April 8, 2015 by meowthtsetung

[AMNBAKER85]

Could you please explain to me how the payment is set up? 

 

It is my understanding that an entry level FSO will be start out GS-9.  However, could you please explain the pay difference between say, Washington D.C and Afghanistan?  How much of one's salary is danger pay?  I am just curious because I read somewhere that after four years it is likely that an FSO could be clearing 90,000, and I just can't imagine how with the current GS schedule. Thanks a lot!

[kaseyleigh]

I really appreciate your thorough answer! It's all just fascinating. I am thinking of meeting with our regional Diplomat-in-Residence tomorrow. Thanks for your insight!

[CurrentFSO]

I really appreciate your thorough answer! It's all just fascinating. I am thinking of meeting with our regional Diplomat-in-Residence tomorrow. Thanks for your insight!

 

You're welcome!  DIRs are great resources, so definitely reach out to him/her.  

 

I've lived the vast majority of my life abroad. Most of the people I know are not American. Would this be viewed positively or negatively by the state department? 

 

Edit: Also, what about multiple citizenships? Would this factor negatively?

 

It wouldn't be a problem throughout the testing process.  Your security clearance investigation may take longer due to living overseas, in multiple places, etc., but many FSOs have extensive overseas experience and get their clearances without issues.  

 

Additional citizenships won't be an issue in the testing process, but will come up in the security clearance process.  It'll depend on how you acquired the citizenship, your ties to that country, and which country it is.  I know FSOs who are dual citizens and it did not impede their security clearance, but it's certainly something that will require scrutiny.  You can check out https://careers.state.gov/uploads/8f/f7/8ff7b0bab879946e78f30e62c859c0f1/DualCitizenship.pdffor more info. 

 

Could you please explain to me how the payment is set up? 

 

It is my understanding that an entry level FSO will be start out GS-9.  However, could you please explain the pay difference between say, Washington D.C and Afghanistan?  How much of one's salary is danger pay?  I am just curious because I read somewhere that after four years it is likely that an FSO could be clearing 90,000, and I just can't imagine how with the current GS schedule. Thanks a lot!

 

FSOs are paid on the FS pay scale, not the GS scale.  The two scales are similar, but not exactly the same.  You can see the FS pay scales at http://www.state.gov/m/dghr/pay/ You can see the SOPs on FSO salary determination at https://careers.state.gov/work/domestic/benefits/fs-entry-salaries/fso:-sop-134a2

 

So, entry level FSOs start out anywhere from the equivalent of a GS 9 to the equivalent of a GS 11, depending on education, experience, and prior salary.  The salary determination is made off of the salary table with Overseas Comparability Pay, so a new FSO with just a bachelor's degree and no work experience would start out making about $50,000/year and a new FSO with a graduate degree, six years of work experience, and a high previous salary would start out making a little over $91,000/year.  

 

Hardship and danger differentials are an additional percentage of your pay on top of your base pay plus the Overseas Comparability Pay.  So, if you were serving in Kabul which has 35% hardship and 35% danger pay, and you made $70,000/year in your base and OCP, you'd get an additional $24,500/yr in hardship pay and an additional $24,500/year in danger pay.  For the Priority Staffing Posts I mentioned in an earlier post (Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq, Yemen, Libya), there may also be some additional allowances that kick in, but those change a bit from year to year and I'm not sure what those are right now, but you might get some extra differential for working essentially a 6-day week in some of those posts, for example. 

 

You can see differentials for different posts at http://aoprals.state.gov/web920/location.asp?menu_id=95 The Cost of Living Allowance (COLA) is based off of a certain percentage of your pay, not the whole thing, and the percentage varies based on the size of your family, etc.  

Edited April 8, 2015 by CurrentFSO

[AMNBAKER85]

Thanks a lot.  I do have another if I may.

 

I am planning on joining the Foreign Service and I like to think that I would retire from it.  With that being said, what are the pro's and Con's of coming into the foreign service with a Bachelors when compared to a masters degree.  Will having a Master's degree improve my chances of advancement within the service?  Or is a person with a bachelors degree just as likely as someone with a master's degree to advance?

 

I ask because I just completed undergraduate and have been admitted into a Master's International affairs program and I'm just not sure getting a Master's Degree is "worth" it, if it will not benefit my standing in foreign service, Thanks a lot!

[CurrentFSO]

First things first, keep in mind that about 20,000 people take the FSOT each year and State hires anywhere from 250-750 new FSOs a year, meaning that only about 1-4% of the people who take the written test are ultimately hired, and hiring has been on the low end of that for the past few years.  You may very well be one of those people hired, but it's always best to keep the Foreign Service as a Plan B until you actually get an offer for an A-100 class.

 

So, I'd look at it in the context of whether you think the MA would open other doors that would be of interest, rather than just whether or not it will get you ahead in the Foreign Service.

 

The promotions process is based only on one's performance while in the Foreign Service.  A MA would only benefit you professionally in as much as the skills/knowledge you gain during your MA help you to perform better.  For example, maybe you improve your writing skills while doing your MA, and consequently you write better cables which gets you promoted faster, etc.  

 

An MA also affects your salary determination when hired.  

[AMNBAKER85]

Thanks for the feedback.

[loveglove]

Thank you for this. I really appreciate it (as I'm sure all other lurkers and members do).

[CurrentFSO]

You're welcome!

[silverheadphones]

Although new to the FSO hiring process, I am familiar with federal hiring processes and how long they take, as well as how competitive these jobs can be.  Most agencies/departments tend to look for candidates with an "edge" or something that they offer that is valuable to them.  For instance language skills, certain employment experience, certain degrees/certifications, etc.  This seems to be less the case with the FSO process, which is somewhat mysterious to me.  Do you have any insight as to what would be something that can give a candidate an "edge" for this process?  Or is it a simple matter of merit-over-anything-else for each step?  Eg:  Those who study the right things pass the written exam, then those who write well and can express their experiences clearly pass the personal narrative, and then those who can present the "13 dimensions" most effectively during the oral assessment pass that portion, etc?  I know this isn't a real question so much as I am asking you if you think I am going into this testing process with the correct mindset, but... any insight into this matter would be greatly appreciated.  

[CurrentFSO]

The FSO hiring process is indeed quite different than the Civil Service hiring process.  I don't have any experience on the Board of Examiners or in HR, but as far as I know, the process is as straightforward as it seems and it is really your performance on the various parts of the assessment process that counts.  The entire process is based off of how well one demonstrates the 6 precepts/13 dimensions, and as far as I know, there's not a "gotcha" or an "edge" that will get you in or not.  

 

Back in the early 1900s, the Foreign Service really was a sinecure primarily for affluent people, but at some point (and I'm fuzzy about what happened when) they made a decision to swing the other way and make the hiring process as fair as possible.  There has been legislation like the Rogers Act, the FOreign Service Acts of 1946 and 1980, etc. that have created the staffing, hiring, and promotions process that we have today.  So, the hiring process is as egalitarian as they can make it.

[aishunbao]

Thanks so much to all the current FSOs following this thread and answering everyone's questions!

 

I have a question myself... I'm going to be in Washington DC and I'm hoping to find some kind of job or internship to do while studying full-time. I've just spent three years abroad teaching English and most of my other experience is volunteer or education related, but I'd like to do something more geared towards the Foreign Service or government. Obviously, the State Department has their own internship programs, but what other jobs and internships commonly available in Washington DC would be relevant for a career in the Foreign Service?

[CurrentFSO]

Other Foreign Affairs agencies, like USAID, Commerce, Agriculture, etc. have internship programs, too.  Other federal agencies may also have internationally focused offices where you could intern.  There are any number of think tanks, NGOs, etc., where you could intern.  

[fso2k11]

CurrentFSO:

 

Thank you in advance for taking the time to answer this, and all the other questions, it is much appreciated! 

 

My question pertains to massive student loan debt. I am planning on attending Graduate School and by the time I complete I will have amassed around 50k in student loan debt.  I understand that student loan debt is quite common nowadays, however, I was wondering if that amount of debt will hinder my chances of becoming an FSO.  Moreover, will one typically have issues obtaining a security clearance with that amount of debt?  Lastly, do you happen to know if the State Department takes part in the Public Service Loan Forgiveness?  Thanks a lot!

I want to chime in here: $50k is not a ton of debt. It's not even a lot of debt. Again, I can't give any official advice or pre-adjudicate a clearance, but consider the average American debt load and the amount of people who have top secret clearances, and the rule of averages would tell you that you're within the normal range. Underwater mortgages, student loans, car loans, etc. Now, if you don't make your payments or you have a dismal credit rating & past bankruptcies, read up somewhere else for more expert advice, because I think those can be red flags.

 

DOS DOES take part in student loan forgiveness, e.g. the 10 year public sector forgiveness program. They also offer the Student Loan Repayment Program (SLRP). If you serve in a hardship post (20% hardship or greater), then DOS will pay $8k toward your federal loan balance every year (after-tax amount around $5,400). Private loans and weird loans like the Alaska parent loan program or whatever are not included. For perspective on hardship, Bogota is 5% hardship and 15% danger, Buenos Aires is 10% hardship, Mumbai is 20% hardship so officers there qualify but Chennai was just bumped down to 15% so officers there do not qualify for SLRP. Most posts in Mexico, Central America, Africa will qualify for SLRP as well, so it is easy to get posted there. Combine the SLRP with my rent-free life in a low cost country and I will pay off my loans before completing my 2-year tour.

[fso2k11]

Will having a Master's degree improve my chances of advancement within the service?  Or is a person with a bachelors degree just as likely as someone with a master's degree to advance?

 

I ask because I just completed undergraduate and have been admitted into a Master's International affairs program and I'm just not sure getting a Master's Degree is "worth" it, if it will not benefit my standing in foreign service, Thanks a lot!

Getting a masters degree is valuable on so many levels. So is work experience. I took the foreign service test four times. I was invited to the Oral Assessment on my first and fourth try. Here are the differences with my profile from attempt 1 and attempt 4.

 

 

Attempt 1:

- BA in international studies and French

- 2 years of work experience in politics in DC

- Studied overseas in French once

- Age 25

 

Attempt 4:

- BA in international studies and French

- MPA from Maxwell

- 5 yrs of work experience, including 2 years in more relevant and interesting roles

- Virtual Student Foreign Service internship with an embassy in a unique place

- Internship in-country at the Public Affairs Section of that same embassy

- One year in public sector consulting for a federal agency in defense and international affairs with a decent consultancy

- Critical Language Scholarship studying Farsi

- 2/1 in Farsi speaking/reading

- 28 yrs old.

 

Obviously, my profile had changed quite a bit over the intervening years. I honestly was not qualified in my first attempt, but by my fourth attempt I was ready. My A-100 had an average age of 31. Not that there is any reverse ageism in the foreign service, but the applicant pool is highly qualified. My A-100 included a retired full bird colonel, for example.

 

Even if I didn't make it into the foreign service, when I got the FS call I was working overseas on a USAID consulting gig and achieving my "Plan A." Then "Plan B" came along. As long as the steps you take for Plan A and Plan B overlap, you'll be preparing yourself for an adventurous and rewarding career. On the other hand, strongly consider whether you want to be in the foreign service in the first place. I am staring at potentially 4 total years of adjudicating visas before actually digging into my Public Diplomacy-coned work. The new norm is 3-4 years of consular service before beginning in-cone work, so keep that in mind. My other expat peers in private & NGO sectors are managing huge budgets and huge staff. I won't have as much responsibility for half a decade. FS is rewarding public service, but the pros and cons can be debated ad infinitum.

 

 

- 

[silverheadphones]

If I may ask:  what was the difference between your 1st/4th attempts versus your 2nd/3rd?  Was it the test that tripped you up or the personal narrative?  Did you prepare any differently between the times you made it to the oral and the times you didn't? 

[PhilzatBerkely]

Dear all,

 

This thread is incredibly useful and valuable, so thanks for great questions and amazing answers. 

I was curious if naturalized U.S. citizens (like myself) face more obstacles during application process. Have you met a lot of FSO's who are naturalized citizens? For example, how often do you hear FSO with a slight foreign accent? How slight you might ask? Tourists/visitors think I'm a native speaker, but people from hear can, naturally, spot that I wasn't born in United States. It does give me advantage in regards to having foreign language under my belt. Anyway, it would be nice to hear your thoughts on this.