Writing & Rhetoric--MSU & Illinois

[Dali21oh]

Hi all,

 

I have two self-indulgent points of inquiry:

 

1) What is your perception of the Writing & Rhetoric PhD program at Michigan State University? Is it a top program in your mind? I'm not so much asking how you feel certain faculty members fit your interests etc, but more so if you view it as one of the elite (let's say top 5) programs in the W&R field?

 

2) Any applicants to the English/Writing Studies program at Illinois UC? Heard anything yet? I applied and have not heard a peep yet. I know it's early, but some programs are already getting back to people. 

 

Ok, that's it for now I guess. Thanks!

Edited January 31, 2014 by Dali21oh

[Fiz]

I can only attest to the English section at Urbana Champaign. But I got accepted and was notified the 24th. Recruitment event is March 11th-13th!

[Dali21oh]

Congratulations!! Should be fun going to check out the program in person!

 

Can I ask if you applied to Michigan State? Just curious if you found it worth applying to! Thanks

[iExcelAtMicrosoftPuns]

Hi all,

 

I have two self-indulgent points of inquiry:

 

1) What is your perception of the Writing & Rhetoric PhD program at Michigan State University? Is it a top program in your mind? I'm not so much asking how you feel certain faculty members fit your interests etc, but more so if you view it as one of the elite (let's say top 5) programs in the W&R field?

 

2) Any applicants to the English/Writing Studies program at Illinois UC? Heard anything yet? I applied and have not heard a peep yet. I know it's early, but some programs are already getting back to people. 

 

Ok, that's it for now I guess. Thanks!

Writing and Rhetoric? PhD?

MSU requires an MA to apply for their PhD.

Perhaps you'll get a better answer if you ask regarding your research interest - less general than writing but still less specific than your thesis title.

Some schools are better equiped for Rhetoric and Writing research in computers and some are better set up for composition or even rhetoric and culture.

Sooooo - if you could narrow your question a bit that would be helpful.

[ComeBackZinc]

Both are very strong programs. They are quite different in their focus. Technically, Illinois's program is a PhD in English with a concentration in Writing Studies. Michigan State's program is the Writing, Rhetoric, and American Cultures program, which has no institutional affiliation with the English department. That can be good or bad depending on your point of view. Both programs are excellent, though.

[muchado]

I second all the things ComeBackZinc said. I think most people would consider either program to be prestigious. When I was applying, my advisor definitely ranked MSU in the top five rhet/comp programs in the nation. However, if what their courses and faculty members don't fit what you want to research, it could be frustrating for you as a scholar. 

[Imaginary]

I realize you asked about prestige- that said, I have a friend who is in the PhD in Writing and Rhetoric program at MSU and she is very happy with it. 

[Dali21oh]

Thanks y'all! I feel silly asking about prestige or whatever, but I already feel like it's a great fit in terms of research interests, so that's why I'm asking. It seems like MSU's program rocks pretty hard to me, but I'm just trying to get a finger on the pulse of other people's perceptions of the program. I know the idea of "prestige" only goes so far, but it is a factor nonetheless. I hate when I see people on grad cafe getting torn a new one for asking these kinds of questions, so I appreciate any and all non-douchey feedback! haha

Edited January 31, 2014 by Dali21oh

[ComeBackZinc]

Investigate hiring rates. That's likely what you actually care about, and an honest program will provide them. They can be of limited value because different programs calculate them differently, but they are still worth looking for.

[Dali21oh]

I guess one thing I've wondered is, when you ask for hiring rates, do some programs give you an actual report of some kind? Like do they attach a document of some sort to the email that lays out the details, or do they usually write an email back describing their recent placements in a general sense? It'd be nice to see a report with lots of details, but I'm hesitant to be too pushy. I just feel like there are lots of ways to distort your program's placement rates by just giving a percentage and a brief description or whatever. 

[ComeBackZinc]

Some programs will actually be able to provide lists of actual placements-- individual students who got specific jobs in the past X number of years. Usually it's more informal. And, yes, subject to manipulation. 

[heja0805]

Hello Dali21oh--

Thank you for raising this question about MSU. I was accepted into the Rhetoric & Writing PhD program in early January, and while I'm certain I'll be going there this fall, it's always good to hear everyone else's perception of the program.

I like to think that MSU is a top-5 program. Their faculty boasts strengths in both computers and writing and cultural rhetorics, and to me, that's the greatest draw. If you're doing work in either of these areas, then yes, it could even be the best program out there.

If placement concerns you, check out the link to graduates and their dissertation titles below (and just google their names). Placement percentages are often misleading, so I've always found things like this most useful. If you're interested in some of the universities that graduates are now working at, I know there are individuals currently at Kentucky, Purdue, Eastern Carolina, George Mason, Central Florida, and others.

http://wrac.msu.edu/graduate-programs/alumni-dissertations/

[driftlake]

Hey! Interesting question. I can't comment on Illinois, but I can maybe comment a bit on MSU, as I got accepted there and will likely attend in the fall.

 

From what I've gleaned and from speaking in depth with students and faculty there, there are a couple big takeaways:

 

• Folks from schools large and small seem to very much respect MSU.
• MSU has a humanistic vibe, even when it focuses closely on technology (which is definitely does, but not exclusively. What area are you interested in?)
• Its faculty members are often the sort of people who will talk to you on a first-name basis and very much as equals and partners in inquiry.
• The biggest problem with the program is a massive overload of possibilities for study, professional development, and enrichment. You really have to be prepared to choose something and ignore some of the other really tempting, cool stuff happening on the periphery.
• Teaching assignments seem pretty flexible--you do have a lot of say in what kind of classes you teach, should you want it.
• They will happily talk about job placements with you.
• Edited to add: it's a four year program although some people go five. Moreso than some schools, MSU emphasizes getting people through efficiently and with plenty of direction and support--which seems to be true from what I've observed as well as from what faculty have told me.

 

So, who knows? I guess my experience thus far has been a positive one, though.

Edited February 16, 2014 by driftlake

[ComeBackZinc]

That link to the list of dissertations at MSU is super helpful for people thinking about the program. One thing that jumps out right away from that list is the dominance of minority rhetorics/cultural studies/critical pedagogy dissertations. Definitely shows Malea Powell's influence in the department. Here's the list for UIllinois: http://www.cws.illinois.edu/graduate/dissertations/

[bhr]

That link to the list of dissertations at MSU is super helpful for people thinking about the program. One thing that jumps out right away from that list is the dominance of minority rhetorics/cultural studies/critical pedagogy dissertations. Definitely shows Malea Powell's influence in the department. Here's the list for UIllinois: http://www.cws.illinois.edu/graduate/dissertations/

I've noticed that with MSU, and it actually was a bit of a concern, since I want to focus more on the tech side. At least Danielle DeVoss tends to focus on that side of the field, and is apparently a fantastic advisor.

 

They've also had a few grads that have come out and jumped right into WPA roles, so that says something about the quality of work on that subject that is being produced.

[driftlake]

I've noticed that with MSU, and it actually was a bit of a concern, since I want to focus more on the tech side. At least Danielle DeVoss tends to focus on that side of the field, and is apparently a fantastic advisor.

 

They've also had a few grads that have come out and jumped right into WPA roles, so that says something about the quality of work on that subject that is being produced.

I don't know. From what I've seen, there is a lot of tech stuff going on there. They're certainly one of the programs that is doing a lot with digital humanities, and Dean Rehberger, Liza Potts, and Bill Hart-Davidson are all tech-oriented people. See http://www2.matrix.msu.edu/ and http://msustatewide.msu.edu/Programs/Details/1456 for a couple examples. I applied there, in fact, because of a wide range of tech-focused opportunities for research and teaching, though I suppose it naturally depends on what tech you're interested in. Still, I would definitely investigate.

Edited February 16, 2014 by driftlake

[ComeBackZinc]

Oh, they're known for their digital work, no question. I just think it's relevant that their dissertations tend to cluster very heavily in one particular area, which I note without making any kind of value judgment about one area or another.