Kind of odd issue looking into possibly transferring graduate schools.

[Josh70]

I am curious if anyone knows anything about how transferring or moving to a different graduate school works. I have a pretty odd person problem that is possibly going to make me really want to transfer schools. A tiny bit about me I am 3rd student in molecular biology, I have pretty much finished all my coursework, I have a great GPA and get a long very well with my advisor. I am about half way to getting my first paper. There really is nothing wrong with my academically just like I said an odd personal problem I don't want to share.

 

So my question is it even possible and how hard would it be if I wanted to change schools? I think would be best to try and find something similar to work I have been doing so wouldn't set me back so far. So anyone have any tips or advice or anything on this subject. Please don't tell me just to suffer through it that is likely not to be an option...  

[GeoDUDE!]

Its super hard; You might have to start over, as the grant funding you might get will require you to work on a different project. Its a lot easier if you go to a top 20ish program ect. You might want to talk to your advisor about this; ultimately your ability to transfer will be on his/her word and the departments. If they dont write you Stellar reccomendations (because you have to reapply to new department) then you are out of luck. 

Edited August 2, 2014 by GeoDUDE!

[Josh70]

Thats for the input. I am fine starting over because really isn't completely starting over since I have learned a ton and could apply my new knowledge to most things within my field. I figured I would start over and leave my current work behind, which should make my boss happy. 

I do worry how my boss would take it but he is a really cool guy so I think at first would try to talk me out of it but once realize that isn't going to happen would probably right me a good LOR. I am probably the best student in his lab right now so think he would give me a decent letter. I am also pretty good friends with a few other advisors in the department so think getting LOR wouldn't be impossible. 

[TakeruK]

Like GeoDUDE! said, the normal solution to someone wanting to "change grad school" is that you will quit** your current program (leave with a Masters where possible) and apply this year to start a brand new PhD program in Fall 2015.

 

(**in this case, either leave immediately because the personal problem is a big one, or stick it out for one more year to tie up loose ends).

 

However, you are going to encounter a ton of people surprised at this decision. I am not sure if you are finishing your 3rd year or about to begin your 3rd year, but either way, you are walking away from a PhD program after 3-4 years of work and you want to start over at a new school and spend another 5-6 years in grad school? 

 

A lot of schools are not going to like this and I would expect that programs that accepted you in the past will be more hesitant to do so again since you are quitting 3-4 years into the first school. It would be a big risk for them to invest ~$200,000+ in you only to have you quit before you get your PhD. 

 

I think you should definitely talk to your boss and other professors you trust and see what they think. You may still get good LORs from them, but there are going to be a lot of red flags into accepting someone who quit after 3-4 full years. Instead, I really think you should talk to these professors and first try to find a way to resolve the issue so that you don't have to quit but also don't have to deal with your personal problem either.

 

In my field, you don't always have to be on campus, so some students actually go off to some other part of the country (or leave the country even) and finish up their dissertation there, especially if the main data collecting is complete and they just need to write. Or, maybe you can take a leave of absence. Or, you can request to be transferred to a completely different office/building etc. I don't know what the issue is (and you don't have to share!) but just throwing out a few ideas that might solve a few general non-advisor related problems that would make one want to leave the school. 

[Josh70]

Thanks for the advice, for some reason I never even considered just getting a masters degree. Do you guys think that would be much better because I am pretty sure I could easily get my masters I have to be really close for credits and I have a ton of research already done.

I wish leaving campus was an option but in my field all my work is done in the lab so not really a possibility for me. Talking to professors won't help because there is no problem with any of them or my advisor. 

[GeoDUDE!]

I disagree; letting the people know who want you to be successful that you have a problem can do wonders! Let your department and advisor fight for you .

[bsharpe269]

It is hard to give advice without knowing what your problem is. There may be options other than leaving the program that should be considered. I want to point out that finding a school that you really love with an advisor that you work well with is very hard to do and if you do want to transfer then you should realize that you may not end up in a situation that you like as much. In any work situation, it is ilkely that you will run into personal problems and you can't necesarily leave every time you run into one. Again, without knowing your situation its impossible to tell whether yours falls under the 'normal personal problem that you need to learn how to deal with' or '1 time only extreme situation'. Things like dealing with an ex in the department, being mugged and feeling unsafe in the building now, being the social outcast of your cohort all fall under the 'learn how to deal with it' category in my opinion.

 

I agree that you should talk to your advisor about this since that you guys seems get along well. Even if the issue is completely unrelated to the department or professors, they may be able to suggest things that can help. They can possibly move your office to a location you prefer or suggest alternate lab hours for you that allow you to avoid someone who makes you uncomfortable. It may also help them understand why you are leaving which can make the process more uncomfortable and result in better LORs since they understand your situation.

[TakeruK]

When I suggested talking to the profs, I didn't mean that it would be a problem directly or even indirectly involving them. Instead, like the others said above, profs have power and ability to do things that can help you even if it's not their problem. After all, they want you to be happy and comfortable too!

[Josh70]

It is a problem that bsharpe269 called deal with it issue. It really should be but for me it is too big of a problem and don't see being able to deal with it. My advisor or other professors have no power at all to fix the problem.

I really appreciate the advice so far I really think I will either move to a masters program and graduate or might try to work insane and get enough work done for a paper and see how that could help the situation out by either moving to another school or something like that. 

[St Andrews Lynx]

It might be an idea to try using your university's counselling services - they can give you confidential advice and help you work through the problem. If it is an issue with harrassment, bullying or other "cold/hostile work environment" scenarios, then there are university ombudsmen with whom you can officially report the incident(s) and create a paper trail. 

 

There are two aspects to personal problems that you can control: (i) how you respond during the "generation" stage of a personal problem (ii) how you respond in the aftermath. Sometimes there's nothing you can do to prevent a problem from occurring (e.g., working in the same lab as a bully), but you can control the aftermath of any problem - how much you let the problem affect you, whether you try to resolve an argument or just let it go. Problems tend to repeat themselves throughout your life (there's more than one bullying jerk in the world), so I would encourage you to look at ways of dealing with the personal problem you have, instead of trying to run away from it. 

 

Even if you successfully transfer universities, you will still probably have to repeat some coursework, qualifying exams, etc. (At my school you need to complete x amount of coursework credits before you can transfer any from your previous school, which usually means you need to take a full 2 semesters of coursework, regardless of what you've already got). The publications you're working on now almost certainly wouldn't count towards your final thesis at your second school - unless you joined the group of a collaborator.

 

It's going to come down to balancing the gains vs. loss if you decide to attempt a transfer. You'll lose a great advisor (those things are rare, believe me), a productive thesis project, and a lot of the PhD coursework/bureaucratic goals that you've already completed. The risk is that you'll end up with an advisor who is a worse fit, on a project that stalls or doesn't work, and there will still be the risk of complicating personal problems. 

[bsharpe269]

I want to point out that I called the problems "deal with it problems", not because I was trying to be nasty and saying suck it up, but because they are things that I have dealt with in my own life (some on multiple occasions) and these types of problems will continue to occur your entire life. There will almost always be people who don't get along with around and it is really likely that you could have another awkward situation with an ex. Hell, at the moment I am dealing with a guy in my own lab who is stalkerish and is seriously sending me multiple harressing emails a week. I will not let him force me out of a lab I love though. I want to be in control of my future and happiness and will not let someone else control it.

 

These problems will keep coming though! No matter where you are you will run into these things and I think that it really important to learn how to deal with them instead of throwing away a great situation. In my opinion, you would be throwing away something really really great due to an issue that you should learn to deal with. Why not go to the counsling center and get some advice for dealing with these types of issues? Getting someone else invovled might help you figure out coping mechanisms that can benefit you for the rest of your life. Good luck with this situation. I bet that most people in this forum have dealt with something similar at some point. Everyone recognizes how bad these situations suck and how hard they can be emotionally but if you push through then I think that you will come out stronger on the other side AND will have a phd in a couple years!

[Josh70]

I want to point out that I called the problems "deal with it problems", not because I was trying to be nasty and saying suck it up, but because they are things that I have dealt with in my own life (some on multiple occasions) and these types of problems will continue to occur your entire life. There will almost always be people who don't get along with around and it is really likely that you could have another awkward situation with an ex. Hell, at the moment I am dealing with a guy in my own lab who is stalkerish and is seriously sending me multiple harressing emails a week. I will not let him force me out of a lab I love though. I want to be in control of my future and happiness and will not let someone else control it.

 

These problems will keep coming though! No matter where you are you will run into these things and I think that it really important to learn how to deal with them instead of throwing away a great situation. In my opinion, you would be throwing away something really really great due to an issue that you should learn to deal with. Why not go to the counsling center and get some advice for dealing with these types of issues? Getting someone else invovled might help you figure out coping mechanisms that can benefit you for the rest of your life. Good luck with this situation. I bet that most people in this forum have dealt with something similar at some point. Everyone recognizes how bad these situations suck and how hard they can be emotionally but if you push through then I think that you will come out stronger on the other side AND will have a phd in a couple years!

Sorry if I made it sound like you were being nasty. You weren't at all and I was just saying you are correct that it is kind of a normal situation that a normal person should be able to deal with. I think it is pretty clear that another person is involved but oddly it's not their own fault at all. I was really gung ho about just doing a masters but everyone has reminded me how rare it is to get a advisor you like and I love mine... Maybe I will just try my hardest to stick it out.

Thanks to everyone for advice. 

[juilletmercredi]

I second the recommendation to visit counseling services.  If it's personal and not professional within the department, then seeing a counselor who can help you talk through solutions and emotional ways of dealing might be the ticket.

[TMP]

What julliet said.  Counseling will help you work and think things through that professors might not think of (despite being in cognitive science! ).

 

Also, if part of obtaining your master's is taking the qualifying exams, you would just do not look good at all if you try to transfer to another program with that master's in hand (including passing the exams).

 

After several years of grad school and lots of discussions with other grad students in my program, in other departments at my university, and at other universities, it is amazingly difficult to find a great adviser match.  Nobody can talk about his/her adviser the way I can.  I used to be a bit embarrassed by it but now realized that most people just aren't as fortunate as I am.  Try to hold on what you have.