Choices for church history/historical theology

[CO_west]

Sorry if all these questions have been covered. I discovered the site this weekend and have been exploring like crazy.

I graduated from a university affiliated with Churches of Christ in 2009 with a bachelor's in English and history. Overall GPA was 3.33. Worked on staff at a church for part of that time and have spent the last two years as an English/history teacher at a public high school. Now that I'm in my late twenties, I'm thinking it's now or never to pursue my passion of studying church history and theology.

I've been looking at Princeton Theological Seminary, since I am especially interested in the Reformed/Presbyterian tradition, but I'm looking at tons of other places. I don't know how much it hurts me to not be Presbyterian as far as PTS is concerned. I've dreamed about applying to the other big name schools, but I honestly have no idea if it would be a total waste of time.

The big question I have is whether to pursue the MTS/MATS or the MDiv. Obviously getting in is important to me, and it seems like MDiv has a slight edge for ease of admission at most schools. More important, though, is which degree would be more suitable for my goal of pursuing a PhD. Maybe an MDiv would be best, since it would give me time to get some language skills and I definitely want to teach in a Christian environment. On the other hand, an MTS/MATS would be quicker and less expensive (depending on funding), and it would give me the chance to really focus in on my interests and work on a thesis.

If the MTS is a better choice, that raises some other questions. As far as eventual admission to a quality doctoral program goes, would it be better to get an MTS at a school that is a little lower on the totem pole than an MDiv at a top-tier institution?

[xypathos]

An MDiv at a top-tier school will 1) look great and 2) almost always be cheaper than a MTS at a lower school, and often cheaper than an MTS at the very same school. Reason being, the top schools have large endowments and often denominations and benefactors gift money to the school which is used to underwrite tuition for students. Fortunately, or unfortunately depending on your situation, MDiv students almost always receive more money than MTS students. Also, the acceptance rate for MDiv students is generally far superior than the MTS rate - probably not leaps and bounds but it's very significant.

 

I can speak from personal experience that that is the case at Vandy and friends at Yale and Harvard have confirmed the same as well.

 

Here's how I suggest playing the game: Apply as an MDiv and see what you get offer wise. If it's ultimately still cheaper to do an MTS, check to see what funding if any is impacted by switching programs. For Vandy at least, it's far harder to go from MTS to MDiv, than it is MDiv to MTS - due to funding and credits. Unless there's some real pressing financial situation, you're not saving much if anything doing an MTS. From my limited experience of MDiv friends that went on to do a PhD, they had shorter programs than MTS friends due to having an extra year of coursework.

[CO_west]

Thanks for a ton of helpful info. I'd kind of guessed all the things you're saying. And thanks for the suggestion!

[CO_west]

I got a very helpful message about a smaller program with a really good church history/historical theology scholar to study under. I'm definitely open to other ideas. I'll definitely be applying for programs that aren't necessarily top-tier, but there are so many that it's difficult to narrow down my choices.

[Rabbit Run]

I've been looking at Princeton Theological Seminary, since I am especially interested in the Reformed/Presbyterian tradition, but I'm looking at tons of other places. I don't know how much it hurts me to not be Presbyterian as far as PTS is concerned. I've dreamed about applying to the other big name schools, but I honestly have no idea if it would be a total waste of time.

Don't worry about not being Presby. Only about 30-40% of the student body is Presbyterian. Further, don't let the "big names" scare you of. Admissions for Master programs are pretty high (particularly for Mdiv degrees, which run in the 50% range for the big name schools like PTS, Yale, Duke etc).

I'd look at Notre Dame, Yale and Harvard as well; all have historians working on the Reformed tradition.

 

 

[marXian]

Here's how I suggest playing the game: Apply as an MDiv and see what you get offer wise. If it's ultimately still cheaper to do an MTS, check to see what funding if any is impacted by switching programs. For Vandy at least, it's far harder to go from MTS to MDiv, than it is MDiv to MTS - due to funding and credits. Unless there's some real pressing financial situation, you're not saving much if anything doing an MTS. From my limited experience of MDiv friends that went on to do a PhD, they had shorter programs than MTS friends due to having an extra year of coursework.

I agree with this, except for the last part. I don't know where your MDiv friends attended, xypathos, but for anyone going to a secular RS department, the MDiv isn't going to give you anything probably in terms of credits, and certainly not a year. That extra year of course work beyond the MTS is 100% ministry (i.e. practical) courses--not academic. Plus I'm not sure why the extra year of coursework for the MDiv would knock off a year of PhD work--if programs do give credit for earned M* degrees, it's usually not a 1 to 1 deal.

Yes, you will have more time to do languages if you do an MDiv, but that only really matters if you're interested in biblical studies. 2-3 years of MTS work should be more than enough to get Latin under your belt and at least begin German if you're interested in church history/historical theology. And if you're not planning on focusing on any era before 1750 (give or take 50 years), you're not really going to need Latin at all.

If you are really set on a PhD, an MTS is going to give you courses that are all (mostly) relevant to that. You're going to have to do a lot of ministry classes, internships, etc. if you do an MDiv.

[xypathos]

Thanks for the correction marXian! I did not mean to imply a direct 1:1 correlation. Rather that MDiv students tended to have more credits "transfer" and shorten the coursework stage of their PhD.