Thesis vs. Non-Thesis option MA in political science

[JustinB0502]

Hello everyone. This is my first time posting in the forum. I just started a MA in political science for spring. My school has a Thesis and a Non-thesis 3 professional with 2 extra classes option. I was all set to choose the thesis option until I finally was able to sit down with my advisor. She really pushed for the non-thesis option. I told her my goal was to pursue a PhD after completing my Masters, but she still insisted on the other option. Then I believe she let out the real reason they push the option. She said that before they started this option they had a low completion rate. To me this means this is why they push it so hard, because she said that three 25 page papers are a lot easier to complete compared to the large project that is a thesis. I really think a thesis would be really beneficial to show PhD programs, along with a good gpa, gre scores, and LORs. My question is which option should I go with? I feel my advisor, being the co-chair of the school, is biased on the matter. I am leaning towards the thesis option.  Thank you all in advance!!!

[Determinedandnervous]

Do the thesis. If her concern is low completion rates, and you know you'll complete the thesis if tasked with it, then just prove she has nothing to be concerned about. A thesis always helps.

[VMcJ]

4 minutes ago, Determinedandnervous said:

Do the thesis. If her concern is low completion rates, and you know you'll complete the thesis if tasked with it, then just prove she has nothing to be concerned about. A thesis always helps.

I concur.

[JustinB0502]

Thanks! That was my initial feeling. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't looking at it the wrong way. 

[wb3060]

To echo the others, absolutely do the thesis option if you want to pursue a PhD. I've been told by faculty that it is a red flag if you choose to do a non-thesis, as that may bring into question your ability to do research, in long research projects in particular. Plus you may even get a publication out of it! 

[Bubandis]

For what it is worth, I was in a nearly identical situation three years ago...so much so that I wonder if I did my MA at the same place as you are now (seriously, every detail is the same, even the part about one of the co-chairs being female and pushing the 3 "professional papers" option).

Anyway, for a multitude of reasons, you should really do the thesis option. I did, and I am happy to have done so. Best of luck!

 

[elw]

OK... I will take the opposite stance.

I am in my second year of a terminal master's at an institution that grants the option but where the faculty overwhelmingly recommends the non-thesis option (meaning: comprehensive exams this spring). Their rationale is the following: The thesis requires extraneous hurdles that have nothing to do with the actual quality of your work (or potential publication opportunities for that matter) but which have (in my advisors' experience) added a year onto the program before completion. Plus, the beneficial experience of comprehensive exams.

Instead of getting mired down in (largely bureaucratic) hurdles related to the thesis, I've instead produced four 25-35 page academic papers, concentrated on coursework, and am in the middle of an independent project that is an experimental survey of undergraduates (involving coding the experiment, IRB approval, paper, conference presentation, etc.). I will be completing the master's on time, and have, suffice to say, been successful this application cycle to my own satisfaction.

I'm willing to discuss the topic further with the OP via private message. But as a final note, rhetorically, I would hope that students place more faith in their advisors than on online forums. I know that I have good relationships with my advisors and I trust their advice. I don't see what value a thesis adds vis-a-vis a research project.

[elw]

N of 1, naturally.

[Bubandis]

I contacted the OP via private message. Turns out that I did in fact complete the same MA program that he is now undertaking. When he referred to the advisor, he was referring to the co-chair of the graduate program, who is the advisor of all incoming students during their first semester regardless of eventual substantive focus. The opinion within the department on whether or not to do the thesis is divided amongst the faculty members, and it seemed to me during my time there that those against the thesis option usually were against it for reasons that had to do more with themselves than the interests of the student (e.g., boosting completion rates looks good for the co-DGSs, laziness in not wanting to serve on committees in the case of some other faculty members).

What OP also did not mention is that it is the norm in the program that those who choose to write three different papers tend to do so in three different subfields (e.g., 1 in IR, 1 in CP, 1 in AP). From a professional stand point, there is no reason to do this unless one is unsure of which subfield one would like to pursue at the doctoral level. Also, he will have to take comprehensive/field exams either way. And, having recently written a thesis there myself, I can confirm that any administrative hoops to jump through are quite minimal.

Three other considerations follow:

1. As was mentioned above by someone else, writing a thesis is a norm across the discipline. Academia, whether good or bad, is full of "time honored traditions" that might not always make sense. But, going against these sorts of norms can make one stand out, perhaps not always in the best way. To see how this might be impactful, imagine a scenario where OP applies to 10 PhD programs, eight of which are comprised of admissions committees who may not care whether or not he completed a thesis during his MA program. But, I think it is totally plausible that one or two admission committees might view a MA program that doesn't require a thesis with some suspicion (whether justified or not). So, even if this is rare (and in truth, it probably is rarer than 10-20% of ad comms), the reverse discrimination--that is, an ad comm looking disfavorably upon someone who has written a MA thesis--is, I'd wager, completely unheard of. Moreover, when I visited places, I was asked about my thesis research. I still regularly am asked what I wrote my thesis on. In political science, writing a thesis is typically the requirement for attaining an MA. I am glad that my decision to write a master's thesis has ensured that I will never have to explain why I didn't actually write one, whether pressured by an advisor or not.

2. The thesis will help you to get to know a literature very well, as the lit review portion of a thesis is typically considerably more in depth than a journal length submission. All else equal, a more intimate knowledge of a literature could pay off in the admissions cycle, by both potentially improving your SOP and in informing your choice of programs to apply to. But, perhaps more importantly, managing a larger project is valuable experience for the dissertation that you eventually will have to write. The skills and workflow one develops in writing a MA thesis are different than those used when writing a journal length paper, and, furthermore, will more closely approximate an even larger project, such as a dissertation or book manuscript.

3. A subset of PhD programs will allow those who enter with a Polisci (or another academically focused social science master's degree) MA to waive the requirement of earning an(the PhD program's) MA in that program. UVA, my current institution, is among the programs that do not require incoming MA recipients to start from scratch and effectively earn an MA all over again. I have found this to be a major convenience in that it: A. cuts down on the number of courses that I am required to take here, and, B. means that I don't have to write an MA thesis now. So, if you are in a terminal MA program, and if chances are good that you are going to have to write a thesis at some point, I am of the mindset that it is better to get it done during the terminal MA stage. Doing so has allowed me to, in my current PhD program, focus more time on my methodological training,  to pursue a number of smaller projects (in terms of scope) that I can present at conferences and/or submit for publication, and quicker time to ABD status which may also equate to a faster time to completion of the PhD itself. And, while I acknowledge that this may not be the same in every PhD program, those who enter our program with a professional degree (MPP, MBA, etc.) or with a non-thesis MA, will likely find themselves having to earn another MA degree, including completing a thesis here.

So, while there are pros and cons either way (and no choice a damning one) given my own experience (in that program no less), I really do come down on the side of the thesis option.

[terefere]

Of course, do the thesis.

[alphazeta]

I guess I'm out of touch with what's happening in MA programs these days, but three 25 page papers sound equivalent to, if not better than, a thesis to me.  A fairly common dissertation format is the three paper dissertation, composed of three publishable papers.  At standard journal world limits in the 10,000-12,000 range that works out to something like three 35 page papers.  

There is absolutely no publication market for something that looks like a typical MA thesis.  The ones I'm familiar with generally get chopped down into a single article at best (i.e., much of the thesis ends up as wasted effort).  It's conceivable, but unlikely, that an MA thesis would eventually evolve into a dissertation and then, many years down the line, a book.  

On the other hand, if you could write three strong papers that eventually become three published articles, you'd be in fantastic shape career-wise.  Obviously, there's absolutely no way that you'll write three publishable papers in the course of an MA program (for many PhD programs, the standard expectation is one publishable-quality paper after two years) but you could make progress in that direction.  

If it were me, I'd write three papers but placing the majority of my effort on the best idea.  I'd try to turn the best paper into my writing sample for applications and aim to have it ready for submission sometime during Year 1 of the PhD.  It would be much better to spread the remaining effort across two other papers that can eventually turn into something useful than devoting it to unnecessary elaboration of Paper 1 into the worthless MA thesis format.

[Volition]

Hey guys, I was about to create a separate post regarding this topic but I was fortunate to find this one here instead! Just like the OP, I'm in a similar predicament where I'm currently faced with the thesis vs. non-thesis option for my MA in political science (which is a one-year program). But while the OP's program alternative to the thesis is three 25 page papers, my program's alternative is a major research paper of 50-60 pages (in contrast to a thesis of 80-100 pages). The other chief difference between the two options is that the major research paper route requires the completion of six graduate courses but the thesis just only requires four. 

Considering the fact that the thesis is the more prestigious option, and seeing that the major research paper is merely 20 pages below the thesis at minimum but with a larger course load, would I be correct to think that the thesis option is the best in terms of academic recognition and time investment? 

[wb3060]

31 minutes ago, Volition said:

Hey guys, I was about to create a separate post regarding this topic but I was fortunate to find this one here instead! Just like the OP, I'm in a similar predicament where I'm currently faced with the thesis vs. non-thesis option for my MA in political science (which is a one-year program). But while the OP's program alternative to the thesis is three 25 page papers, my program's alternative is a major research paper of 50-60 pages (in contrast to a thesis of 80-100 pages). The other chief difference between the two options is that the major research paper route requires the completion of six graduate courses but the thesis just only requires four. 

 

Considering the fact that the thesis is the more prestigious option, and seeing that the major research paper is merely 20 pages below the thesis at minimum but with a larger course load, would I be correct to think that the thesis option is the best in terms of academic recognition and time investment? 

 

I would definitely go for the thesis. Since graduate courses (at least in my experience) typically require a 20-25 page research paper as part of the course, you'd actually be doing just as much if not more work anyway by going for the non-thesis (plus you'd have less time to write it), and you'd get less return on it in terms of prestige and demonstrating your research abilities. 

Edited May 2, 2016 by wb3060