Returning to school

[decidedly undecided]

Hello everyone, 

I'm new to this forum, and I am hoping to gain from your collective knowledge and experience. 

I've been out of undergrad for quite a while (10+ years), and have a law degree (worked as an attorney for 5+ years), but I am considering going back to school for a PhD. Reading is my passion (sounds cheesy), and I often find myself annotating, dissecting, analyzing whatever work of fiction I happen to be engaged in. Since I have virtually no interest in practicing law--it's just a paycheck to me at this point--I thought perhaps it time to switch careers in hopes of spending my time doing something I might actually enjoy (life is too short to do something you hate).  That explanation out of the way, I have a few specific-ish questions you knowledgable folk might be able to help me with:

(1) As an undergrad, I was a history major and thus did not take many (or any) proper literature courses. Will this count against me in the application process given how long I've been out of undergrad?

(2) I have nothing remotely resembling a writing sample. Does anyone have suggestions on where to begin developing one from scratch? More to the point, is there anyone here who has faced a similar situation (creating a writing sample without a smidgen of guidance from a Professor, knowledge of current trends in literary analysis, experience in literary analysis, a prompt, et cetera)?

(3) My undergraduate grades were far from fantastic (better than a 3.0 but not by a large amount), though the institution I attended is well respected. My law school grades were not fantastic either, though the school is considered to be top five in the field. I only mention this las bit because it may be relevant in how an admissions office looks at my academic background. Between you (the board) and I, those rankings are absolutely meaningless in terms of indicating quality of education (or student for that matter). What sort of program might I have a chance of gaining entrance to? Is anything open at this point or would I be advised to look outside the "top" programs? 

Thanks in advance for the help.

[erosanddust]

Hello! Excuse my disorganized reply and my inability to answer all of these questions, but I thought I'd share a few things that came to mind:

(1) There will certainly be ways to demonstrate that your background in history (and even law) are assets to your application, especially if your specialization benefits from historical knowledge/methods. That being said, I think not having a lit background, more than counting against you for arbitrary checklist reasons, would be a detriment if you feel you lack background in literary methodology, etc. (as you seem to suggest in your second question).

I've seen people on this board coming from other disciplines enroll in lit courses at a local college to "brush up" on these things — that might be an option to help you "test the waters," or even to make connections with professors for letters of reference or help with a writing sample. Looking into funded MA programs first might be an even better option.

(2) I've sort of addressed this question already, but I'll add that another good way to get acquainted with current methodologies is to find journals in your field and read them. You'll be able to get a feel for what the trends are right now in your field, but also to take a closer look at the critical moves different scholars make. From there, you can consider which modes of analysis appeal to you and how you might adapt them to your own project.

(3) This may not really answer your question, but I would advise everyone to look outside the 'top' programs, regardless of academic background. PhD applications are so competitive, there's no such thing as 'safety schools'. In fact, it's more important to find a program that produces good work in your specialization — the top schools for you will likely look different than the top schools according to US News.

[echo449]

My gut tells me that you should be looking at MA programs first. You have no coursework in English to show, and probably not close to the credit hours that most programs require. Good news tho! Many people on this board have applied to MAs, so they'll be able to help more than I can. 

 

Edited May 6, 2016 by echo449
Had opinions about rankings; they weren't cogent. Cut them.

[decidedly undecided]

Thank you both for the responses. Every bit of information is helpful. 

I will do a proper Googling, but @erosanddust, if you happen to have any journal suggestions or good places to look for them I'd certainly be grateful. 

[Dr. Old Bill]

I agree with @echo449, and would go so far as to say that even taking some graduate level courses without necessarily going for a degree might be worthwhile if you can afford the cost of a course or two per semester while you keep working. Fortunately D.C. has enough fantastic schools to make that a viable option for you -- GWU, Georgetown, American, UMD (I'm biased), Catholic U.... Basically, demonstrating that you can do graduate-level work in the field of English will help your cause immeasurably when applying for a Ph.D. It will also give you the opportunity to develop a writing sample, and ideally make some positive connections with professors.

I suspect that it would be a longshot getting into a Ph.D. program without having anything recent in the field of English on your transcript. Your reasons can be extremely valid, but chances are that you'll have to demonstrate your ability a bit before you can be brought into the relatively elusive fold of doctoral study.

P.S.: Do you have a general idea of the field / period you are interested in? That will help whittle down suggestions for journals to look at etc.

Edited May 6, 2016 by Wyatt's Terps

[xolo]

About 5 years ago I decided to go for the PhD. I hadn't been in school in many years and had no degree in my field. I studied for a couple of years on my own, then started taking upper division language classes at the local university. It also allowed me the opportunity to develop a field of interest, writing samples, and LORs. These are some of the most important things for the PhD. In my opinion, grades and such are more "check-boxes" compared to original research, statement of purpose, and LORs. Now I'm in a top-10 program. I see on this forum that everyone has their own path. The main thing is perseverance and knowing what you want, not an exact plan on how to get there.

One thing that you should seriously consider. I went from a language student to a researcher and language instructor. Defcon 5!! Shocker!! Big time culture change. Be sure this is what you want. PhD does not equal "I love to read".

[ExponentialDecay]

I wouldn't judge what is a top program by US News either, but (will I get pummeled for this?), if you want a job, concentrate on the T10/T20. Depending on your subfield, it may be worth choosing a lower ranked institution to work with a highly respected adviser, but even those don't usually fall outside the well-reputed places. 

[echo449]

7 hours ago, ExponentialDecay said:

I wouldn't judge what is a top program by US News either, but (will I get pummeled for this?), if you want a job, concentrate on the T10/T20. Depending on your subfield, it may be worth choosing a lower ranked institution to work with a highly respected adviser, but even those don't usually fall outside the well-reputed places. 

I basically agree with this. I think there are exceptions in the top 30 (Penn State, Vanderbilt), and I've seen arguments that some schools farther down the list place well regionally, but when you're in the application phase, thinking about placement maybe even trumps fit, depending on your personal situation.

Edited May 7, 2016 by echo449

[decidedly undecided]

On 5/6/2016 at 7:50 PM, Wyatt's Terps said:

P.S.: Do you have a general idea of the field / period you are interested in? That will help whittle down suggestions for journals to look at etc.

Please excuse me if I don't use the correct term of art to describe my interests, as I mentioned above, I've not really studied this with any formality. 

Generally speaking there are a few areas I'm particularly interested in: (1) modernism, especially the period between the wars; (2) post modern literature, especially work touching on the absurdity of consumerism and late capitalism; and (3) acid noir, for lack of a better term--basically the detective story taken out of or beyond the classic detective novel. I feel like there is a reasonable way to fold all three, or at least aspects of all three into one.

[screamingacrossthesky]

American Literary History, American Literature, boundary 2, Contemporary Literature, Critical Inquiry, Criticism, Critique, JML, MFS, Narrative, Novel, PMLA, Post45, Qui Parle, Studies in the Novel, Twentieth-Century Literature...

I'd also recommend looking at program websites and finding faculty whose work interests you and seeing where they are published.  I think that it will prove challenging to prepare a writing sample for a PhD application independently without a literary studies background, although I think reading around in journals will be a great way to affirm your interest in pursuing studies in this field at that level and getting a sense of the topics/methodologies/theories that are hot right now.  I think there have been some great suggestions in this thread for how to prep for a PhD round, especially looking into post-bac classes through extension/open enrollment programs and thinking seriously about applying for MAs instead (or, at least, as well).

[decidedly undecided]

@screamingacrossthesky thank you very much for the list. It should keep me busy for quite a while. 

As perhaps is to be expected, I quite like your username. 

[__________________________]

Here's useful list of stuff for accessing books/articles/resources even if you don't have access to university research resources:

https://thelitcritguy.com/2016/05/02/smash-the-paywalls/

Dude's twitter account is worth following too.  The list leaves off Library Genesis, a great resource for getting your hands on pricy academic texts.  Academia.edu might also be helpful, as scholars will often upload their own papers on there; though some are definitely more active than others on the site.

For your subject area, you should definitely be buffing up on theory (lib gen is great for this). There's a thread or two floating around for brushing up on stuff like that, but the list of journals mentioned by screamingacrossthesky are the leading journals if you can get your hands on them. I feel like Critical Inquiry and post45 are particularly worth checking out for broadly theoretical issues in modern/contemporary lit. I could be biased there though.

Edited May 13, 2016 by mollifiedmolloy