What were your reasons for getting a Masters before PhD?

[scientific]

Hi all,

 

Had a wildly discouraging talk from a professor in which he said I have no good shot at my two dream schools due to my low GPA. I'm considering a master's to compensate for it (3.22).

 

What were some of your reasons? Do you think you'd do it again, or go to a lower rank school straight into a PhD?

[TakeruK]

I'm from Canada where we must do a Masters before a PhD (2 year MSc, 3-4 year PhD). But even if it was not required as part of the degree path, I like doing a Masters first because I don't want to commit to 5 years in research without a way to get out in 1 or 2 years in case I didn't like it.

Also, if I was in a place where I had to choose between low rank PhD or Masters->Apply for higher rank PhD, I would choose the Masters first. If I couldn't afford the Masters then I would try to find work or do something non-academic and re-evaluate when I was in a position to apply for grad school again. This depends on your career goals though. But given the toughness of the academic job market, I would rather pick a non-academic career path than enter a PhD program that isn't in the top tier. (Not that graduating from a top tier guarantees anything, but my personal view is that prospects for job satisfaction are too low without a top tier PhD).

[scientific]

Thanks for your resposne, TakeruK. My biggest concern is definitely cost for the master's, so it's not been an easy choice. I don't really want to become a professor or anything, but I would like to be in research career-wise, whether it's at an academic institution or not; it's something I've found  I really enjoyed over the 3 years or so I've done it. 

Do you feel like it's common to get burned out doing a masters (1-2 years) before a PhD (~4 years)? I'm definitely worried about that since I got burned out near the end of my undergrad (I majored in an emphasis I ended up disliking). I was also under the impression that master's students don't typically do a lot of research, which is why a lot of schools in the states don't take them on. 

[Butterfly_effect]

I went straight to PhD but that was mostly because I got into where I wanted to go first try. If you think your GPA will prevent you from getting into the program of your choice, maybe a master's is fine. I'm in a top program for my field (neuro) and no one in my program that I know did a master's first, though many teched for a while. I would say in general, Master's are not required at all for US PhDs. What are your dream schools/programs by the way?

[scientific]

Thanks, Butterfly_effect! I know Master's are rarer in the US, but I'm not really sure how else I can combat my low uGPA. I'm already a non-traditional student (few years out of school, worked in unrelated family business, but back doing research in a new chemistry lab). (Other background: 3.22 GPA from US top 50 public state school, 2 publications in unrelated chemistry field, ~4 years of research including conference abroad by the time I apply, 162/162/5 GRE, 3 good-strong LOR, 3 years TA/tutor/tech positions)

My dream schools/programs are University of Chicago and University of Illinois at Urbana Champaign for physical/astro-chemistry. I have no illusions about University of Chicago and know I have extremely low chances about getting in, but the professor I talked to essentially said that the same goes for UIUC, despite the fact that the (different) professor I'm working for now there did his PhD there. He essentially told me to shoot for much lower ranking programs than I was originally hoping for, which was really hard to hear since I thought I had a decent shot at some around 15-35 ranked schools. 

I'm really regretting all the extracurriculars I did in my undergrad lately... Should've studied harder!!

Edited November 3, 2016 by scientific

[TakeruK]

Additional time will also diminish the impact of your uGPA. When you are fresh out of undergrad, your GPA is one of the few ways schools can measure your aptitude for grad school etc. However, now that you are beyond that stage, you have lots of different ways to show them that you are going to be successful in a PhD program. Especially since you are doing research in a chemistry lab right now!

Here's my advice, if I were in your shoes. It sounds like a research career is really important to you and your career goals doesn't necessarily require going to a top tier school. But the higher you can get, the better! So, if your current research job in the chem lab is somewhat stable (i.e. it's not just for this month or something), my advice is to just apply to UChicago and UCIC this year. If you get in, great. If not, keep working in the lab, build up your research experience and try again in the future. At the same time, maybe apply to a few Masters programs that can provide funding. Again, if you get ones that pay enough, and if it will provide more experience than your current lab position, then take it. 

[Chai_latte]

I'm co-signing everything TakeruK said.  

In answer to your burn-out-after-the-MS question, the answer is no.  Since you like research, you'll probably be energized for the next step.  I did a thesis master's, and research was not my passion.  Because I had a great research advisor and I took the time to explore other interests, I had a good experience.  That good experience fueled me to pursue my next graduate program immediately afterwards.  When you're passionate about something, a previous MS won't leave you feeling drained.  

ETA: I was also drained after undergrad.  So, I'm definitely someone who can get burned out.

Edited November 3, 2016 by Chai_latte