Is the review process for international students different from those for domestic ones?

[YoYToT]

Hi all,

I hope this is the right place to discuss this topic. 

I am an internatinal applicant for PhD in Epi 2017Fall. In the result sharing, I have seen quite a few people invited to PhD recruitment days (cong!) from the programs I have applied to too, such as BU, Brown, Yale and etc. However, I've heard nothing, no rejection, no invitation, nothing. Obviously, it is not too practical to invite an international student to US for an interview. This brought up my question--whether there is a different/separate review process for international students? 

I have read a horrible post in the forum that some school only considered international applicants after they first filled the spots for domestic ones. So I was wondering what is the general practice or please share your knowledge/experience. Thank you!

[CoffeeFueledAnxiety]

The review process will of course be different in different school and different programs. However, from what I understand many programs does have a separate review process for international applicant. Not exactly in the way that they are reviewed after filling spots for domestic ones, but rather, they are being reviewed against a different pool of applicant (the international applicant pool) to fill the spots they have for internationals. Also, the main funding source of many programs are from the government, which means that those specific fundings could only be used for US citizen (or sometimes permanent resident) therefore they usually only have a small number of spot to offer to international students based on their other fundings. 

When it comes to interview, unless you are living in the US most program would offer a Skype interview instead of an interview weekend invite. Some programs do the Skype interview before their interview weekend, some do it after, again it depends on the program. 

[GeorgeC07]

I'm also an international applicant, and from what I've read on the programs' websites, I think there are some two points on this issue. 

First, in most cases only domestic students are invited to recruitment days or tours. I'm not sure what these activities mean but maybe the departments give the domestic students more chances to contact the POIs.

Secondly, some programs only consider domestic students for fellowship opportunities, and since fundings are rather important, chances for international students are smaller. 

Besides these two points I haven't seen any indication that some schools only consider international applicants after filling the spots for domestic ones, and even if they do, they won't tell you since this would lead to a steep drop in the number of international applicants in the following years. However, some programs do send out the fellowships early to the first round of applicants, and leave the others to compete for the assistantships. 

[AP]

Great question. As others have pointed out, there isn't a definite answer. 

On 2/6/2017 at 6:51 AM, CoffeeFueledAnxiety said:

The review process will of course be different in different school and different programs. However, from what I understand many programs does have a separate review process for international applicant. Not exactly in the way that they are reviewed after filling spots for domestic ones, but rather, they are being reviewed against a different pool of applicant (the international applicant pool) to fill the spots they have for internationals. Also, the main funding source of many programs are from the government, which means that those specific fundings could only be used for US citizen (or sometimes permanent resident) therefore they usually only have a small number of spot to offer to international students based on their other fundings. 

When it comes to interview, unless you are living in the US most program would offer a Skype interview instead of an interview weekend invite. Some programs do the Skype interview before their interview weekend, some do it after, again it depends on the program. 

This is not entirely true, and it is worth talking about the subtle differences. 

So far, this is the first time I see someone say there is an international applicant pools. This could be true in programs that receive state/federal funds and so their funding cannot spend in large number of outsiders. This happens in state universities. When I was applying, two POIs I reached out to said they did not have funding for me because I was international. State schools are accountable on how they use taxpayers money.

If you apply to private schools, the story can be different and there probably is more freedom for admitting international students. In my subfield in my department we are all but one international students. How many per cohort? Half. This is one school, though. It may happen that the school next door wants to prioritize in-state or American applicants, which is fine. 

Further, you are required, like any US American applicant, to submit GRE scores (even if you have never sat for standardized tests), statement, LORs, etc. So you are also competing against the locals, which makes absolute sense. Where I'm from, we don't write SOPs in the same way that US universities require them, but whether we like it or not, they need to be at the same level. In my program, the admission process goes something like this: Everyone submits applications, half or a third are dismissed for not having all the materials, for not having a minimum GRE, or for weak LORs. Then, the adcomms sift through SOPs and get rid of some more. Then, the professors in each caucus read all the applications from their field and they make the shortlist for Skype interviews. After that, each writes an independent report on each interviewee and send it to a professor in the adcomm who is not in the caucus. For example, Africanists send their reports to East Asianists. Based on those reports, the decision is made. Again, this is my program, which is not a fancy one.

For the interview, many schools fly you in. Surf the forums and you'll find a good number of international candidates trying to do one trip to the US to two weekends. I myself was offered a huge reimbursement for part of my air ticket but I still couldn't make it. 

 

[CoffeeFueledAnxiety]

@AP Yes I think you are right, the story is quite different between state school that mainly uses federal funds and private school. I guess I don't know much when it comes to private schools because I mainly apply to state schools and have heard that while they are considering my application against the whole applicant pool, the fact that they could only admit limited number of international students makes them compare international applicants in their own pool, too.

Some international applicants does goes to the US, but then again it also depends on where you are from, I think. Applicants from some country find this easier than others, and some programs have more money to offer for reimbursement than others, too. I have read in this forum that some program also do not want to assume that applicants already have applicable visa for visiting and the processing of that in certain countries could takes quite some time, so that might also be a consideration.

Great to know how other programs operates in regards of this, though, Thanks!

[TakeruK]

I have experience in both public schools and private schools and my pubic school experience reflects what @CoffeeFueledAnxiety describes and my private school experience reflects @AP's description. Just a couple of things to add:

- At public schools, even though it might feel like you are a "second class" applicant because of the separate application pool, from sitting in on faculty meetings, I get the sense that international students are almost like a commodity. There can be extremely limited number of spots. For example, in a program with 80 students total, only 8 spots can be international. Assuming a 5 or 6 year program, this means they can admit about 1 or 2 each year. Professors compete with each other in order to get the international student (since the department often pays the extra cost of international tuition, rather than the professor).

- At many US state schools, there are far more international applicants than domestic applicants, so this makes the competition even stiffer! A prof that worked at one of these schools shared some numbers with me. Let's take a hypothetical department that admits 10 students per year and gets 100 applicants. They will typically get 75 international applicants and only the top 2 or 3 will be admitted. On the other hand, out of the 25 American applicants, the top 7 or 8 will be admitted.

- At my private school, in my department, people are admitted without regard to their country of origin. I think there is some more restrictions in certain fields due to US technology export laws. Overall, about 45% of the grad student population are international! Only the ones based in Canada or the US will be invited to visit though. We are also a small department so the process goes: all applications are received, the entire faculty reads every single application, some applications are moved to different departments based on better fit, and the top 7 or so are selected for admission. There is a small correction to avoid having too many candidates for the same prof because we want people who come in expecting to work with Prof X to actually be able to work with Prof X. Our department is connected with a few others in the same discipline and after each (small) department makes their decision, the faculty of the entire organization that houses all the departments get together and vote to approve each department's selections. Then, decisions are sent out. We do not interview.