Yetanotherdegree

I'm in a similar situation to you (I'm working on a doctoral app for the fall, GRE prep, kids part-time, working to get my Latin up to speed before fall courses start, and some actual, for-pay, work.) I don't feel like I have a ton of extra time to toss at stuff that isn't worthwhile and I'm careful about which commitments I accept. That being said, I would prioritize an opportunity to get credit for a publication. I think actual publications can help to make an application stand out, and I think the potential for a stellar reference is also helpful. I would do the article.

How is it going? When is your test? What are you doing to prepare? Any tips for others? I'm bored with the math stuff. Test is August 31 Preparing by morning through most of the Manhattan Prep series. Currently, finished all the vocal/text stuff and bogged down in book #2 of the math stuff. My goal is to put in an hour a day of effort. The only tip I have is to keep going and get it over with

Thanks, folks. I think I can and should do both, I just don't want to do the GRe prep (insert whine here...)

So I'm scheduled to write the GRE in August for doctoral applications in the fall. I'm also working on Latin in my spare time. I feel like I need to pick one or the other. I need both, but I could put off the GRE until late December and still be able to apply for the fall 2014 cycle. I might not even apply for fall 2014- I might wait a year and aim for 2015 instead. And my ancient languages are seriously lacking. I've been advised to take a certain course in the fall, which I can only do if I can improve my Latin. WWYD? Postpone the GRE because I might not even need it this fall, and fix up the Latin instead? Or just do the darn test and get it out of the way? Dumb question, I know. I kind of think I'm procrastinating on this just because I don't want to review fractions this summer.

Thanks for answering, jdharrison. I think you're right, there's a need for balance between marketability, interests, and resources (including institutions willing to accept you.) It has been suggested (by an academic who knows me well) that I develop teaching competency in an area that seems very far away from my academic interest (although I can see the overlap/connection). I want to work on historical theology, specifically the practices of holiness and sacred space in late antiquity; I've been advised to make sure that I develop a pastoral theology dimension (spiritual practices, the development of holiness, etc.) While part of me just wants to run off into the world of the desert fathers, I can see the wisdom of incorporating a more contemporary element. I'm relatively limited in terms of the institutions I can apply to here. I can't move, and I have family and church obligations that prevent me from going anywhere else. But my options are, all things considered, more than adequate. I can focus on my particular interests while developing additional skills and knowledge that may (or may not) lead to future opportunities.

I agree that funding is a big issue, and I've heard that North American institutions prefer the North American PhD, complete with comprehensive exams that attest to areas of knowledge and competency. However, if you have successful teaching experience and you've done research that has been well received, then I don't think you're at any disadvantage if you have a top-tier European doctorate, at least in terms of employability. Student loan debt, on the other hand...

A friend of mine is aiming for something similar. His first choice is Chicago. I've also heard really good things about Toronto, but funding could be an issue there. Can you narrow it down a bit in terms of specific interests? If theology is secondary for you, you may prefer to go through a department of near eastern studies or similar (as opposed to religious studies, divinity/theology, or even Jewish studies.) you have lots of options Are there particular academics whose books you enjoy? Any sense of who you would like to study with? Good luck!

I'm just curious. We all have our interests and areas of expertise, but some subjects and specializations are perhaps more employable than others. Where do you think the future areas of growth in theology are? Where will divinity schools and seminaries be looking to hire in the future? And are some areas or specializations overdone or outdated now? I have heard that it can be a struggle to find qualified people for some of the positions in the area of pastoral theology, and that women in NT are "very employable." On the other hand, there seem to be a lot of people doing PhDs in American Christianity or similar, and I don't see that many jobs out there for those graduates. Any thoughts? I'm curious about this, and I'd love to see some ongoing conversations on here. I enjoyed all the activity in the application season, and I keep checking in to see if there are any more opportunities to discuss things. Anyone interested in a conversation about theological education and future possibilities?

I second (fourth? ) what others have said. For me, part of the difference was increased focus and a better work ethic in div school vs undergrad. I actually found much of the div school work easier because I was finally studying something that felt meaningful and relevant to me. And I had figured out that I had to work consistently, instead of putting in occasional great efforts as deadlines loomed. If you're a full-time student, treat it like a full-time job, put in the appropriate hours and develop discipline. The vast majority of my MDiv courses were not academically stringent. The exceptions for me were ancient languages and some of the more complicated theological courses. I once spent an hour reading seven pages of Karl Rahner, only to realize I had no idea what he was talking about. YMMV, however the vast majority of courses are not that taxing. They required preparation and effort, but most students could complete them adequately, while still maintaining some form of school-life balance. Choose courses that sound like fun as well as things that sound like they will be good for you, pick one or two things that build upon your strengths (in other words, don't plan on an all-ancient languages first semester, unless you happen to be great at them already ) and expect to work consistently to keep up with readings and to plan for assignments. You'll be fine.

It is Right. Decision made. Thanks!

Thank you! I'll do option #2. It sounds like more fun for me, anyway

Thanks, everyone! As I start to look at the next application cycle, it just seems like everyone has the grades, the scores, the references. I hope I can do enough to make my application stand out from the, oh, 100 or 200 others that want the same spot.

I'm taking an advanced degree masters, part-time, beginning in September. My plan is to work towards applying to a PhD or ThD. I also work and have a young family so I can't take a full course load. I'm trying to decide between two courses. If you were in my situation, which one would you pick? #1) doctoral-level seminar, prof is relatively senior and is a recognized authority in their area. Topic is interesting, somewhat relevant, but does not line up 100% with my interests (the focus is about 200 years earlier than what I want to study). This course takes place at a time that will require additional scheduling of kids and work. #2) advanced masters-level course, brand-new prof, who is known for being willing to work with students, helpful, etc. The topic is pretty much exactly my area of interest, not just the era but specific issues within the appropriate time period. This course fits in neatly with my current work/home schedule and can be done with minimal additional effort. So, if my goal is to get into a doctoral program and I want a reference out of the class, would I be better off taking the higher-level course with the bigger name, or the better-fit course with the new prof? And if it makes any difference, my applications will be local only, either at the institution where I am doing this current degree or at the one other place within the same area (so maybe the name-recognition of #1 doesn't matter as much?) I can't move for a doctorate. Wwyd? 1 or 2? Thanks for any suggestions!

What sets a doctoral application apart? Assuming everyone has great grades and stellar references and an outstanding GRE score, what else can you do to make your application stand out? Does it help to: Have publications? Present at conferences? Teach somewhere? Know the admissions committee? ??? If you've applied and been accepted to a doctoral program in religion/theology, what do you think made your application stand out?

I think sometimes the scoring can feel a little random and people who write and communicate well can walk away with poor verbal and writing scores and not understand how or why that's happened. That doesn't mean it is, in fact, like playing the academic lottery. It means they have not studied appropriately. Fact: you can and will improve your scores if you prep strategically. The test is expensive, both in terms of money and significance for your PhD applications. Why would you not make the effort to get the best score you can?

Where are you going? (I feel like I should know this...)

I did CPE before starting my MDiv (the summer before.) The supervisor had no problem with my sequence of courses etc, and it sounds like you have more relevant courses going in than I did, by a considerable amount. Is hospital chaplaincy your goal? If so, you will need CPE, and you can certainly apply whenever you could do it. Not all supervisors will accept you without some theological training, but some will. If this is your plan, you will also want to talk to someone from your faith tradition (pastor, rabbi, etc) in order to make sure you have appropriate support and fulfill any requirements they may have for them to endorse you.

It may be Hollywood, but... The current crop is retiring and they aren't being replaced at the same rates. The reality is that purely academic positions are increasingly hard to come by, and the number of people with decent PhDs is increasing very year. I think the key for happiness and success is to do this with more than one possible end in mind. If you just go into it wanting a classic job in the academy, you will likely be disappointed. If you go into it knowing what other options might prove an equally satisfactory use of education and interests, then your odds of finding something good and useful out of the years of focused study increase exponentially. For those who believe, ministry has typically been a good option, as has Christian education, church administration/ denominational work, and certain types of nonprofit work. There are also other institutions that are happy to work with folks with good academic backgrounds (one friend with a PhD in early church history now teaches latin at a private high school and is very happy doing so.) in short, if you can see multiple uses and options for your studies, and if they don't put you at a financial or other disadvantage, then, by all means, keep going. But in this, as in the rest of real life, looking at things too narrowly will only lead to disappointment.

Has. Not as. Sorry, posting from my ipad, and I keep missing letters.

And yes, I know September usually as a "p" in it..

Other than not stressing over applications, that it Are you doing anything at all academic? Any prep before school starts? Or are you taking time off or maybe working a "real" job? I'm stydying for the GRE, refreshing my ancient languages, and thinking about writing an article or two. you?

So sorry to hear this. Prayers.

Kareniskimova, did you ever hear back from Duke? And congrats on your acceptances and scholarship to Candler!

Have you ever submitted something for publication? Or thought about it? What periodicals are you interested in writing for? And if you've done this, any tips?

I'm using the manhattan prep, the 8-volume set. It's excellent.