m-ttl

I just took the GRE today and signed up to retake it again in Nov. Don't get me wrong, my verbal score was fine, I'm more than happy with a 165, and assume my written score will be a 5 or 6. But at the end of the test, at the sixth section, I got a third Quant section, and clicked continue. The test switched pages and brought me to the "Do you want to see your scores, or cancel them?" page with no back button. I panicked (and was a bit baffled) but didn't want to cancel my scores. :/ I realize I should have said something but in panic mode I don't really think. I completely bombed the Quant section, without a shadow of a doubt. I don't know if that's because I didn't take one of the graded portions because of a glitch or the equally likely I'm truly terrible at math. Does anyone else retake because of abysmal quant scores in Art History? I feel like when I had terrible math scores on the SAT and ACT in High School I was determined to retake to get an "average" score, and I also felt like the tests were more important. But with the GRE and the low math score for Art History I'm not sure how much it's going to factor. I don't want to look like I simply didn't try because I thought it was unnecessary or pointless, but in the grand scheme of things I have good LORs, and strong writing samples, etc which I would think would overshadow "She can't do algebra."? Did you choose retake simply because of general Grad school admissions standards for the GRE, or for Funding, or what? I'm concerned such a low Quant score would detract from my potential funding or schools with "minimums" standards, which is why I'm redoing it. Did anyone get really bad or absolutely terrible Quant scores and do fine admissions wise?

I won't know until I apply. I had to say no to my ED undergrad choice because they wanted me to incur $160,000 in debt, so I'm not particularly invested in the idea that I will get a lot of money from people, and I'm not writing out the possibility that it's simply not feasible for me to afford this career. There's a difference to me between some debt, and $54,000 a year in straight loans, you know? It's not a matter of how passionate I am about the field, it's really honestly a matter of "Will I be able to eat?", "Can I afford a place to sleep?", "Is this going to give me over $100,000 in student loan debt for a field which I will never be able to pay this back in?". I'm sure there are some people who can make that choice without worrying about it, and good for them. But I honestly won't know if the payoff is worth it until I'm holding offers in hand. I think that's fair...a little harsh, but it's going to keep me from being "surprised". People won't always hire curatorial assistants or curators. I can get a job as a temp, however. I could just not get enough money period, and do teach for America. There's a lot of other options if I simply can't afford it. It will suck, I will not be happy about it, but I don't think the overall happiness of my life will be dictated by whether or not I can afford a master's degree right away. The overall comfort of my life, however, might be crimped by drowning in student loans. :/ It is what it is. I'm really grateful for the information, but I'm afraid I'm just a little less optimistic than most.

It's hard for me to say, I think my GPA is fine, but...it's hard to tell when there's so much "4.0 or nothing!" attitudes I get. Do you know if it's overall GPA or major GPA? I spoke with a curator recently at a museum I interned with and she encouraged my looking at the dec arts field in general, and certain programs including Bard, but it all essentially comes down to money. It's hard to relate to "Well they're [Dec Arts] expensive programs but I think they're great!" no matter how well respected the curator is, or the director, etc, when what will inevitably happen is I will take whatever option is cheapest. I don't have money of my own to fund my schooling with, and I presume I'll be paying off my undergrad loans well into my 40s...so I'm not so much discouraged as I am trying to be realistic. I probably can't afford most schools, so my apps are an exercise in the funding lottery. I've mostly found that others I speak with don't have the same debt I do, or have other back up finances/sources and so on, so I tend to be a little more wary of my chances.

I don't have time to double check the whole thread on my phone but I noticed in the first few pages people mentioned great places to shop like the Limited, and Banana Republic but... Didn't mention the student discounts they give? I've bought $68 blouses on sale with a discount for about $10 before. J. crew does this too? I buy sale stuff when I can because its so cheap and especially in rich neighborhoods folks hate to be seen in the sales section. Most of the discounts are student/educator/military. Although I'm not actually a grad student I figured I'd pass that one on...15% off is pretty nice. Also my biggest academic chic splurge has been my Cambridge satchel co. brown 13" bag from mod cloth. If I could afford another bigger one, I'd buy it. It's really nice leather and just big enough for my laptop and a book or notebook.

I would find out if people who get denied for the PhD are still considered for the MA. But regardless if your intent is to move from MA to PhD eventually I would still state that?

Ah, I'm in my junior year of my BA. While it seems like a lovely program, it also seems to be designed for graduate students, not undergrads? I have a friend who is already working in the field with Dec Arts and who has an MA and this seems to be more targeted towards her? I would love it, but I'm afraid I'm not what they're looking for, necessarily. They state there's only two spaces for qualified Graduate students, which I unfortunately, am not yet. Thank you though! I'll keep it in mind, just in case for the following years. I'm starting to think of Bard as the "long shot" school, not for acceptance means, but for viability of finances.

Wait, UPenn or Penn State? "Upenn state" ?

I'm sure the funding is just as competitive, but if the option of fully funded/mostly funded MAs are available at any given school, I would find such a list to be highly beneficial. I'd just like to outright not apply to programs that 1.) Won't give me any money or 2.) Only accept PhD applicants who already have an MA. The competitiveness isn't the issue so much as the list of possibilities? But this is a great thread idea, I hope people have some suggestions.

Thanks Pictureit24, that actually makes a lot more sense. I'm hesitant in general just because the City is so expensive, and Bard itself is so expensive, but I'm still interested, if nothing else.

I agree. If you want to be an exceptional applicant, you have to think exceptionally and critically, especially about the way the field has been shaped, formed, and reflected. Some of us who are not white, nor wealthy already have to examine these factors at play just by the very nature of not being a part of the long-standing dominant groups in the field. If you're looking to join the field and seem outstanding, I absolutely recommend that you come in with new and fresh ideas to approach the broadening horizons of audiences, academics, research, etc. The amount of potential diversity of thoughts and experiences/backgrounds are changing, and it's always important to show that you will not remain unwilling to learn new things. Perhaps some professors don't encourage intellectualism (a shame, as I would argue exploring new ideas, or old ideas in new ways is an invaluable skill) but in general, I would say that's not the way to stand out as an exceptional applicant? YMMV, I suppose. I won't say that affluent people are less creative, but I will say necessity is the mother of invention. Economic challenge often forces you to come up with a variety of ways to keep up with peers who have that extra boost that you do not have. This may not seem like much, but obviously it's a factor enough that finances are taken into consideration in "diversity/overcoming adversity" statements, and need based scholarship? Lack of affluence doesn't make you smarter or more creative. It just means that sometimes you have to work more to keep up with the base standard of the field/pool of applicants.

I think you missed the multiple times I repeatedly said I have other, more conventional interests I am eager to pursue and consider this only a side-interest option I wanted to explore if there were options for? Sorry, but I'm not sure you understood that I have A.) Decided I really don't have any intention of switching fields, and B.) I also have no interest in taking time off. I'm not yet a senior, I'm taking classes/internships that are in my two major areas of interest that I hope will sway me one way or another by the end of this year (or at least solidify what my MA interests are best suited for). I have found a POI, and one at a school I feel meets all of my potential interests, who studies the Material Culture of Childhood (as well as a few other subjects I'm fascinated by, and recently lectured at a museum I'm going to be interning for). I have a small connection in this respect, I'm more than enthused about material culture/object based study, will have experience in a Museum that focuses on these things, etc. I think I can find plenty of "traditional" things I'm interested in. I have a list of about 16 schools I think would all be suitable for me, all with programs and POIs with traditional subjects I do want to learn. I don't mean to seem short, and rest assured I'm not trying to sound ungrateful but... Like I said before, I'm more than capable of deciding something is better left as a hobby if it doesn't align with my Academic/Career goals, and I already know what those are. The things that don't align with those goals remain hobbies. I'm intending to re-evaluate my strongest subjects/areas of interest within Art History at the end of this semester and then spend next semester in my research methods class writing for the field I'm choosing to apply to. If one of my multiple papers this semester speaks to me, perhaps by next year I'll have narrowed my focus enough to apply to select PhD programs. But I'm currently happy enough to look at MAs that suit me. I'm already graduating with a Museum Studies degree (at my school it requires more Art History distributional requirements than the Art History degree itself, plus professional classes and two internships in the field), so I'm hoping to find a program that is Art History based with more museum/gallery experience and leanings. I guess I just see no need to take time off simply because I like other things? This seems counter-intuitive to me. Isn't the idea to start a wide search and then narrow it down based on what is viable and what isn't...instead of just stopping the search and loafing at home with your parents to do some "soul-searching"? I have until next year to have a list solidified. This is just preliminary narrowing of the search. It doesn't really seem like a good reason to put on the emergency break and stop on the tracks altogether.

You'll find the US Government will likely caution against it too. It could be an excellent program, but risks are risks. Someone could decide it's completely for them, but to pretend that Americans are welcome with open arms everywhere would be folly. Still, plenty of US citizens travel to places they're told not to, and if you already speak Persian, this seems like it'd be perfect.

I'm sure this must seem like a silly question, but as I understand it Bard (upstate) has a Curatorial Studies program, and Bard Graduate Center is focused on Design, Dec. Arts, and Material Culture. I'm particularly interested in the BGC and find a lot of their methods, means, and ideas etc appeal to me. I've mostly been looking at BGC, and browsed their Financial Aid pages. Which seems great, but the Curatorial Program at the "mothership" warns: They both report to the same Financial Aid departments for funding; in fact BGC states that the aid packages are determined upstate. Is the difference really that big from "department" to "department" or from school to school in this case? Is this perhaps because BGC is a much smaller program? They're both being funded by the same place so does this just mean BGC has a bigger chunk to deal with financially? I don't mean to over think this too much, but I suppose I got confused when checking out CCS Bard.

Thanks, I'll mention it for the growing list. It definitely looks like the requirements can all be met for applications.

My friend is looking for MA/PhD programs that focus on Modern or Contemporary East Asian Studies (specifically China). She's going to have about 5 years of Mandarin Chinese and one year of Classical Chinese done by next year (our senior year) and is currently a Global Studies major/Chinese Minor. Mostly the big problem we've run into searching for potential programs is that it's easy to find say, University of Chicago and Columbia, but less easy to find the other programs (first or second tier, whatever they may be) that would be of interest. She's not looking to go into business, politics, or art history - but I think she'd be willing to look at general Modern History (mostly Chinese Cultural Revolution and onwards, but 1920's+ would be okay), Chinese Literature, or Language/Pedagogy. She has a 3.5 GPA which could end up a 3.6, and is looking for things that well, aren't an Ivy league. I have the fullest confidences she's going to be a competitive applicant by next year (she's spending this semester in Taiwan) but expanding the range of options she's considering would be great. Any suggestions?

I actually sat in on a class called Japanese Pop Culture at my University (Art History class), and enjoyed it greatly. Manga and Anime is something I grew up with, particularly because I lived in Singapore when I was very little, and Japanese cartoons were much more accessible/popular in Asia. And don't get me wrong, I like Japanese art, I like manga, I like discussing the nuances of the exchange of artistic influence between America and Japan immediately after WWII, but...I do not like learning Japanese all that much. Perhaps it was mostly the department at my school that was awful, but I found the experience to be headache inducing and unpleasant. The textbook was bad, the department gave us pointless assignments, the grammar was maddening, etc. I had taken it in High School and liked it, but at the college level, it just became...a frustration? For whatever reason. I like my Chinese classes however, enjoy Dynastic Chinese Art, as well as Contemporary Chinese art. I'd also sat in on a Russian Art class for some time and liked the influences on Chinese Socialist Realism, and even North Korean Socialist Realism/"Juche" Art. It's overall something I can work off of/from better. Like I said, I love comics, and think they should be studied, but I won't pretend I don't have 2-3 paper ideas in Chinese Art, or even American Art that aren't about that. American Art has a large appeal to me because I'm going to intern with an American (mostly dec arts) Museum and I am very interested in American culture and art. I have a lot I think I could do, just in terms of Pop Art, Decorative Arts, American Architecture, etc. But -- I can't pursue programs that can only maximumly offer half-funding like Sotheby's does. I don't have a lot of money, I've had to pull teeth with my father to get the money he owes me, I've had to take out the max amount of student loans, and then more because I qualify for Parent Plus Denial Loans.... putting myself into even more debt is not just dangerous, it's stupid. $21,000 a term? That's lucky some students have that amount of cash to throw around, but I simply don't. And I've had opportunities denied to me before because I simply don't have the cash, so I'm not throwing my heart into avenues that are just impossible. If I don't end up going to Grad School in 2015, then I'll have to work or join a program like TFA. Simple as that. But taking out another $63,000 in loans? That's more than my undergrad debt.

Thanks. I've been sitting on this, and now I think that the truth of the matter is the majority of people researching Comics are English folk, who, while a close cousin to Art History, aren't quite what I want. People whose brains I'd love to pick, and would love to hear from, but the realism of getting a degree in English when my focus and concentration (and experience) is solidly elsewhere is dismal. Not just in terms of acceptance, but also in terms of what I want to do with my career path. It's a great potential subject of study for my own time, but I'm starting to think I'm better served by finding American Art or East Asian (Chinese) Art programs. (The former because I'm going to be interning briefly with an American Dec Arts Museum and am interested in Dec Arts/American Art, and the latter because I'm currently taking Chinese as a language and an upper division Chinese painting class I'm enjoying.) It's an understudied field, to be sure. There's a wealth to be said and examined, and I've been reading some wonderful things about the transience of comics, the relevance to our culture, the formation of arts cultures around them, the drive of collectors, etc but I won't pretend like I don't have other equally valid interests...or that everyone is ready for a radical shift in a very old field. I don't want to appear flighty or unsure - I know what I don't want, but I'm a flexible and passionate person. If this doesn't exist in my field, I can pursue what does and this in my spare time. I already do that, so I don't really see it as any sort of sacrifice. (I'm also a creative writer, which when I entered college, initially at a small LAC with a strong creative writing program, was something I had to consider. I decided I loved fictional writing as a passionate hobby, not a career choice, and that Museums and Art History were the fields I wanted to work in. It's two very different feelings.) I would rather remain in my field and study something equally interesting, related, or something I could later apply to my personal interests than...leave my field. I'm going back and looking at research interests of professors at Universities I'm considering, and trying to balance my list with places I could get into, and places that match me. I've found greater luck in looking for American Art/Decorative Art, and East Asian Art by far (and also someone who studies something similar enough that I would be very pleased/excited to work with them - someone who I luckily have an incidental connection with). I'm hoping my classes, internship, and papers this semester will finalize my feelings one way or the other in terms of which field I go into, but I'm assuming I'm looking at a MA rather than a PhD at the moment when I apply next year. (I have a 3.4 overall and a 3.7 in my major which I hope to raise to a 3.5/3.8 but is still not a 3.9 or a 4.0). I also need funding so I'm trying to be mindful of that as well. The need for money puts a big damper on a lot of things, and I've been burned before so I'm putting 100% into my search and my backup plans. Still, I'm a big believer in narrowing my search by elimination and by being flexible but committed. I have other good interests I'm going to look out for. Still, thanks everyone for commenting. It was worth a shot to look, at any rate! But now I know where my real search must be focused on.

@lefilsdhomme: I'll send you a PM later after I head back home! I'm taking a quick break at my internship because I just moved a few paintings that are bigger than I am...so I took a quick breather on my phone. I'm not presenting at anything yet. I saw the conference at UF this march (devastatingly while I'm visiting Florida to do a week long spring break stint with a great American Art museum there. So I'll be in the right state, but the wrong city!) but am only just now looking at sending in papers. The paper is actually one I chose to do for my internship credit. I've actually got in touch with the local comics shop by my campus and lucky for me, one of the saleswomen is a PhD student at my uni (in Anthropology/Gender) so she's not only going to be one of my interview sources, she offered to help me with my questionnaire and grad school ideas. I might add an internship with the comics shop and I'm considering asking my current Gallery if I could do anything here... I do worry about veering completely away from Art History, just because Comic studies is new enough that I can't imagine a lot of careers I could hold with that. I don't pretend museum work is an easy field to get into, but I do have a fair bit of experience and hope to graduate BA with 5-7 internships/jobs in the field. I've already got 4 and am required to take another internship credit...but to eliminate myself from the field means I'd have to figure out where one works with an MA/PhD in comics... And that could be an avenue Q song waiting to happen, haha.

@assassina Well, I have more straightforwards interests as well, (ones that were easy to find a pre-lim scad of programs I'm going to whittle down from thirteen between now and next fall), but this is something I only just realized might be an option. And it would be remiss of me not to pursue it even just a little. I'll look at Bowling Green State, but to be honest, part of my secondary concerns are: Are there accessible museums? and Can I continue to not have a car? What sort of funding do they have? I'm not familiar with the area, or even Ohio, really! So I don't know if that's the case, but the majority of the other schools I've found interest in were FL as an outstanding case (but with friends nearby), New York, Boston, Chicago, D.C., San Fran. (The museums come to play, basically.) SCAD would be an interesting option. @asdf123 Wow! I do have to say that's all wonderful stuff, but UChi is also notoriously difficult to get into. I guess I shouldn't be surprised (I'm not asking for common fare) but like I said, I have only the most basic English classes. I'm not already coming in with an MA (which seemed to count against me in the Art History department, anyways) and I guess my big fear with both is competing with folks who have more experience in the field the program is located in. But Prof. Chute sounds amazing. I'll probably start looking to see how much of her work I already might have read.

I'm thumbing through a copy of the caa Directory of Graduate Programs in Art History, and while I know it can't tell me everything, I'm wondering if I'm looking for a lost cause, or just not going about things the right way. I have more than one area of interest I'm looking into pursuing (one is certainly more common), but my more uncommon area of interest is Comics/Graphics/Sequential Art history. I've got a background in Museums and Art History as my BA, and I have experience with Museums, Galleries, and Comics Conventions. I adore the intersections, am currently doing research for a paper on Conventions as Arts Programming, etc. It would be more than ideal to bring my passionate hobby into the world of my passionate academics. It's probably a bit bizarre for someone who has been considering going down the curatorial route, but I like the subject well enough that I think I could find myself doing a lot with it. I have one problem: as far as I know, only one program exists - the University of Florida has an MA/PhD program in Comics & Visual Rhetoric. It's an English degree, and aside from my university's required courses, I haven't taken excessive english classes since high school. I can see that being a problem if they're strictly interested in scholar's focusing on words over art. I'd be content with combining the two disciplines as thoroughly as I can, and am strongly considering applying anyways. But I'm still looking for Art History degrees, perhaps in Modern American Art? Should I be stretching out to Visual and Media Studies? Many Modern & Contemporary Art History programs seem to lean away from this sort of Art. Are there ways to figure out if professors/POIs are accepting of this sort of study, or if a program would be flexible enough to allow it? Am I better off just applying to my other Art History area of interest and then having UF be a stand-alone subject in my applications next year? I know fellowships exist, I know academic journals exist, but how can I reverse search for the right schools?