m-ttl

I think the confusion was my usage of average not meaning mathematical average, but average as in usual or ordinary. Siiigh, math strikes again? Probably shouldn't have phrased it as "the average". Bleh. Yeah that's more what I meant. Half of America makes at or under the brackets listed on Wiki. Regardless of whether I'm terribly good at mathematical jargon (I'm not, you caught me), it's not really a bad deal for many of us to consider.

The stats there are a median income, meaning it's the average income, but a large amount of people make far less than what is listed. Personal income stats also include things beyond just wages - as explained in the wiki. But comparing low-wage jobs to grad stipends, I think is fair. I'm thrilled to give up 5 years of pay in favor of....five years of guaranteed pay. That's more than most "taco bell" jobs afford you, a promised income laid out (so long as you do your job), probably much lower turnover rates, flexible schedules and sick days ... and personally, I'm getting covered insurance-wise. Some rough math left me realizing I could be a little frugal, pay off a chunk of my student loans, have an okay place to live with a roommate, and still save money and afford groceries and the like. That's fantastic, deal wise. Look, the...benefits at the end of the road need to be weighed and discussed, and those of us in humanities should consider our job prospects carefully, but at the same time, who is going to turn down 5-8 years of funding, insurance, etc? If I do put some of that funding towards my student loans from UG, I could squeeze my debt down -- graduate with a PhD and very little remaining undergrad debt, and at that point, if I get hired to...be some kind of private school teacher or retail manager, then so be it. I think in today's economy you sometimes have to weigh those things against each other, and I'm fine with it. Some people have to ask if they'd rather be taken advantage of by working for Walmart or working for a University as an underpaid TA. Guess which one I'd rather choose.

Not to mention the United Nations is right there. I don't see how it's a downgrade, in that respect.

Your rude attitude is completely unnecessary and insulting. I'm not stupid as you'd like to think. I know precisely what curation entails. I keep trying to point out to YOU however that this thread was intended to address exploring a range of possibilities and understanding how other jobs work so you know how to best consult someone else. You've done nothing this whole time but denigrate me and my intellect and follow it up with the idea that I don't know what I'm talking about when multiple people have pointed out getting experience in smaller places can be GREAT for getting a feel for the field. My expertise in museums comes from the fact that museum studies IS my degree. You have repeatedly shown us why art history is perceived as elitist: apparently I can't POSSIBLY know anything about what I study because my PhD isn't in hand, I'm a potential embarassment because I'm not wealthy, I should expect other people to teach me how to write labels (not professors, but co-workers!), suggesting to learn other skills in case you aren't in the most elite bastion of museums is indicative that I don't understand how they work, and to top it all off my degree is "tedious", boring, and actually knowing how museums run, work, what their goals are, what my goals should be, etc means I am just ignorant of what "real" (read: what you DEEM worthy) curation is about. Using my example about STUDENTS failing to frame properly as indicative that I think all curators should frame things and so on. You've made wild leaps of assumptions about where I have worked and where Borden has worked and place yourself at the top. You've blatantly and intentionally twisted my meaning and words to make yourself right at every step "layouts and object placement as prep for an EXHIBITION BEING CURATED". And I'm tired of it. You're making things up to call me an idiot when I've done nothing here but suggest that learning about things besides curation can be helpful for figuring out what it is you DO want to know how to do. I never said "be able to do conservation" I said "know what conservators do." I don't know why you think I pissed in your cereal but give it a rest already. If I didn't have extensive curatorial experience I wouldn't have been accepted, end of story. Honestly I was willing to let this die in peace but I am sick and tired of the backhanded insults. I don't get what your real issue is here because otherwise we might agree. Instead you've just taken your time to pick apart things I didn't actually say and insult me with them.

They explicitly said in the PDF there was a hard copy being sent to [My Address here], and I emailed back the DGS to say I was accepting and what should my next step be? (Answer? Mail back the hard copy, signed.)

That's a really upbeat view of how disability is approached in schools. I have a friend transferring from a CC to a 4 yr college and she frequently needs to use a wheelchair. She texted me yesterday that the college she was looking at had little to nothing in the way of a DRC for physical disabilities and that the tour group left behind her and her father while they were trying to navigate with her chair. For those whom walking is not easy, you can't simply just say, "I'm sure they'll be accommodating!" because they may, in fact, be the opposite of that.

Nope. I mean I was tempted at the last minute to not apply (issues with recommendation letters through their app system, I got suuuper frustrated) but I've heard zilch. Not a no, or a yes, or a WL. I suspect they'll (rightfully) reject me for an imperfect fit. I could maybe work in their program, but maybe not. I hate to sound ungrateful but I still haven't heard back from three of the schools I applied to (two being Williams and Rutgers). Don't get me wrong, I got accepted to a place I'm going to enroll in but what's up with the weird and utter stasis on my apps?? I got one rejection, then a weekend of acceptances and then nothing. At least one of them I'm like 90% sure I was rejected at, so just send me an email already. Grr. Also I got a PDF email of my official offer at my program so now I'm just waiting impatiently on the postal version. bleh.

I would do a few things, but this is just me: Unless he's paying you/you're a writing tutor, I would say I didn't feel like I was the right person for this kind of extensive help anymore. It's one thing to help someone out, another to liberally change things as you see fit (imo), and I would honestly put my foot down. Not only that but if you're feeling frustrated or confused as to how he got in, perhaps you're just simply not the right person to be helping anymore. That's not a bad thing, it's just the honest truth -- you can't exhaust yourself on just helping other people catch up. The only kind of editing I have received is the first kind "Clarify" or "explain" and "repetition here", etc. Sometimes I get suggestions "Re-construct the sentence like this...." but this never fundamentally changes anything without me being the one to do the work, which is I think what you're asking about. The work is his, and shouldn't be on you. Point out you notice he's referenced other authors/ideas but hasn't properly cited his sources. Suggest he review MLA/Chicago/whatever your field uses carefully to avoid accidental plagiarism, then that he find another editor who can help him.

One Direction. Seriously a ton of OLDER friends (and ex-friends) got very very into them. I'm not above mediocre pop music, but as boy bands go? They don't even dance, and they can barely sing. And I feel way too old to buy bracelets and DVDs meant for young tweens. I heard one of the group talking about wanting to bring up 1D in the class she teaches as a PhD student and I was mortified. There's having fun, and there's bringing up irrelevant things (irrelevant to her class, anyways) by forcibly trying to make them relevant and wasting your students' time. I don't know how or why a bunch of adults got so into them, nor do I particularly care -- but the increasing psuedo-academic/intellectual "critical analysis" of their love for the band and why they are good and important or worth enjoying is tiresome and embarrassing. You don't need to use academia to make something worth your own enjoyment, just enjoy your crappy pop music and stop trying to say it's subversive. It really, really isn't.

...Are you sure your Quals are going to be the same year you start or are they just going to be at that time of the year for people who are ready to take them?

Thirded. All the top programs for IR are in DC, all the IR business is in DC, the federal government is in DC, all your major NGOs probably have reps there, etc. Basically if you want to go into politics of any kind, I wouldn't go anywhere else in the US. It would be sub-par in comparison. When I first started college I had considered my options as an IR/PS student and going to Washington is considered invaluable. I ended up deciding Art History was the better choice for me (I realized Political Science was about stats, and my field experience as an exit-poller turned me off a little) but for a good while I had a Poli-sci advisor. If you're basing it solely off of career options post-MA, American is the far superior choice. In this case, the city is half your education.

I think we mentioned earlier as well that Rutgers does weird spurts of acceptances? Even looking at last year they were announcing pretty late in the game.

"Limited experience" is not "no experience" which is what I have been saying this whole time. ...Are you confused about that part? My initial example was someone who had NO experience whatsoever with museums saying she was unprepared to work in one as an ABD. You began to contest me on that point. That with no experience, she could still be hired. Obviously my example was one of student art historians using a university collection -- but still a real and exasperating mess because they didn't bother to ask how to do it properly. No one is saying curators are registrars, preparators, etc. No one is even saying that those jobs are curatorial. What we ARE saying is that it's absurd and entitled to start off by saying: "People debate the value of a museum studies degree" and then follow that up with, "But the registrar should teach the curator how to properly accession things, or use the database, and the educator should teach the curator how to write a label, and the grant writer should teach the curator how to write a grant for a museum..." That is miles away from collaborative work: the curator writes a label draft, shoots it to the educator, they reach a happy medium and it gets sent to the copy editor. You continue to insinuate that I have not worked in extremely well-endowed institutions (I have), and that I just "don't know" how this works. Both Borden and I have stated we've worked in larger endowed institutions, and we still have this experience to speak from. Yes, many curators have preparators on hand, and many have the registrar team around to check up on humidity levels -- but do you honestly think curators themselves never avail themselves to enter the collections areas and handle works? That they never have to pick a paint chip and debate how something should be hung? Even at a place with preparators, I still helped a curator do walkthroughs the space, recommend layouts and hangings, estimate the proper amount of space between paintings/objects, and analyze the flow of the room -- all this after the weeks of academic research and readings. We did spot checks of the labels before they got sent off to the design folks, we make sure the preparators do what we want, etc. If you, as a curator, want to work collaboratively with your museum team you should "probably" (and I mean definitely) learn their basic trade and pick up a general museum studies book so you understand how everyone else is working and where they're coming from. I'm not saying mat something yourself if you're in a massive institution and unable to do so, but you should probably know how it's done. Regardless, at this point I feel like we're having two different conversations, one where I say: "Look this is how you break in without knowing what you want to do yet, be it curator or something else, because you need experience and that's what you're looking to do, boost your application." and one where you defend the Ivy league unnecessarily (from what??) and continue to argue as if no experience = some experience, actually.

Then they are in clear violation of the policy.

I would say it's unwise and really unprofessional if not perhaps outright bad for the class, but the dating policy of schools varies from school to school. My current uni has a policy which would allow professors/TAs to date their students even if it's not recommended, strictly speaking. This could easily bite them in the ass.

....When were these people even hired? I don't know anyone hired in the last twenty years without an internship or fellowship of some kind under their belt to be a curator (even an assistant!). Look, I don't know how much more blunt any of us can be about this - that's not what the job market is like right now. A TA or Preceptor job is not like an internship for a museum in the amount of work you do. It's not usually a "limited experience" job. Do you honestly believe an entire museum of people busy trying to do their own jobs would jump for joy at the opportunity to baby a new curatorial hire into doing things as simple as label writing??? Expecting everyone to lay down their full time jobs to teach you how to do yours step by step is an entitlement. No one is saying "take a decade long slog at a house museum". People are saying a brief internship at a small museum can be helpful for teaching you how to do things you should ALREADY know by the time you're an assistant curator. Things that, yes, are covered in those very same museum studies books. I've dealt with cleaning up after the shoddy messes fellow art historians have made with zero museological/exhibitions training before -- let me tell you how upset the curator of special collections was because they PACKING TAPED matted printed into frames. I had to remove the tape from all the frames and mats and then re-do an entire exhibition because they were too ignorant to know how to do it properly. I also was the one to print and cut their labels (and I edited their un-spellchecked errors as well), and I hung everything because they didn't do it right the first time. They were good art historians, but terrible curators, often leaving out valuable items that needed to be in climate controlled environments for long stretches of time until the curator noticed and had a fit. Just about the only thing we can agree on is the OP's experience is already a good starting point.

Not that I disagree, but the OP has also consistently brought this (their weight) up in threads even where it is completely irrelevant. My first instinct was that they were baiting for concern trolls and fatphobia, honestly by repeatedly stating it, not responding further, acting coy about weight despite the seeming self-photo. But I gave honest advice for what is an honest question regardless. Again, asking what campuses are most accommodating without even knowing their field is pointless. All we can really say is ask the DRC at the schools you're looking at.

It's usually best to go with the standard advice "don't bring up your childhood unless it's exceedingly relevant". Your success despite breaking this rule doesn't mean it's not a rule for a very good reason - it's a tired, boring cliche, that everyone has seen a million times and rarely, if ever, helps out your SOP. People want to know about you NOW as a scholar, not what your aspirations were when you were four. I also don't suggest "Hello my name is _____." This isn't quite a cover letter either and that feels stilted to me.

Confirming. Everyone and their mother in the museum/art history field does not want to hear "Ever since I was a child I loved Monet Paintings...blahblahblah". In fact one perspective POI I had emailed wrote me this: "Application-wise, I'd suggest that you work on your statement--what you want to study and why; I'd avoid the narrative of ever since childhood, I've wanted to learn about/work in a museum...we get a lot of that. [...] We want smart, curious and motivated students with a good record of academic achievement. (It should really address your scholarly potential." I did have a short "narrative" sentence which explained directly my scholarly experience with what I want to research but it had nothing to do with my childhood. Save that for icebreakers with fellow classmates.

Well I didn't have a chip on my shoulder until you implied I would embarrass my employers because I didn't spring fully formed from the head of the John Harvard statue.... [ETA: No seriously, why is this continuously brought up? I've admitted to being poor as a valid and legitimate reason for not doing unfunded MAs and recommending to others not to carelessly take on debt, and suddenly everything is about a chip on my shoulder? This is only the third or fourth time someone has implied I'm bitter, angry, resentful, jealous, or have a "chip". I got into my first choice PhD with full funding. I don't have a chip right now. I DO resent the constant micro-aggressions that I am either 1.) Wrong to criticize a classist field or 2.) All of my opinions are somehow directly tied to and only because of my personal circumstances and that I have no knowledge outside of myself or of the rest of the field, or that I'm somehow uncultured/unmannered. Politely speaking, get it together folks - I have plenty of well to do relatives, and have sufficient "which fork should I use" manners. This is really starting to be insulting by implicating I don't know how to handle myself.] ...I think we need to clarify a few things because there's a few different points going on here. 1.) I can't speak for anyone else, but I haven't only worked at small museums. I've certainly worked at much larger institutions (medium sized, but with large endowments, has collections on loan to the Met, etc) who don't officially take interns because of same-said entitled small LAC kids hoping to boost their resumes and never actually do any work. Obviously this isn't the norm but I have worked there, and I got in because I could be vouched for as someone who would work my ass off. And while I never attended a gala in my time there, I did help organize and attended a high tea and lecture for their donors and the most embarrassing thing I did was spill some of my water on my plate of fresh maracons. 2.) No one is making up the "small museums are great places to get experience" thing out of some sort of class based ideology. This is advice you'll find in virtually every single museum studies book that exists, based on years of experience and hundreds of people in the field. For someone wanting to get their feet wet, a small museum makes a lot of sense because it introduces you to a wide variety of departments because they have less people, so the work is less divisive. I.E. at a small museum, you might only have one person be both the registrar and the curator, or the educator is also the grant writer, whatever. Should you spend 10 years employed at a tiny museum if you want to work at The Getty? No. But a few months interning to gain a wide variety of skills you can apply to your medium sized institution internship, and then your flagship institution or application to the Getty as an employed assistant? Might be worth considering. You can go from small to large in the museum world. But you also have to actively be climbing the ladder. 3.) People with no experience generally do not "deserve" jobs, they are usually just well connected. Let's be clear here: A curatorial job is not one you will do well without any prior experience. Suggesting that a Williams grad has "interesting methods to approach curatorial methods" means you know that they....have learned what curatorial methods are. And they should, if they go to Williams because Williams has local museums and programs. If you know nothing about curatorial practice, museum practice, etc, and get a curatorial job, I do not think I am being petty or resentful by thinking you are probably not really prepared for that job. Those aren't cute side skills you learn, those are major foundational parts of the job. I think somehow you are insisting that all Ivy grads are "better trained" but also may not have experience...? Look, if an Ivy grad is experienced then of course they are better trained. But simply learning at a well respected institution doesn't train you to work in a museum as a curator. You can't simultaneously have zero museum experience and be better trained than someone who does have experience. Regardless, the thread is for someone looking to break into the field, so all the advice stands. It's best to get experience in order to prepare for what you want to do.

Ah, I think in relative terms, it is harder to start from absolute zero (as said TA would have been doing) than to jump in with background object based methodology. Her complaint was more that she had not really cultivated any museum connections or experience, thus making "breaking in" harder compared to classmates who had the experience already. You could very well be hired with no experience, but if you're the one hiring, would you rather pick the hire with experience, or the one who has none? I don't suggest someone who wants to be a curator do anything other than a PhD in their field -- but for other museum jobs? MAs may suffice in Museum Studies. (I think the large amount of the debate centering around museum studies is that you do learn by doing; my degree is best when it is being rigorous, practical, and applied knowledge. But whether or not people think I need a degree to learn something I could have done in an "apprenticeship" is sort of besides the point -- the degree title itself opens doors and forced me to remain connected with the museum community as a whole.) A quick check of AAM suggests that it's going to be an uphill climb for those who have no experience and want, as you suggest, a Curatorial Assistant position. So you obviously either need experience, connections, or both. I think it's fair to say "get experience so you have an edge in getting hired" in this case. There are loads of internal or "incestuous" hires in the museum world. But assuming or betting you'll be one of them is foolhardy before you actually have those connections. Anyone wanting to work in a museum should work in museums so that A.) they know what it's like and so that B.) when you do have those connections that springboard you into a career, your recommenders will be able to enthuse about how awesome you are at doing the things they need you to do. I believe you when you say some people get hired with no experience. But for the vast majority of people this is not the case unless they are development, marketing, IT, etc -- not curators, registrars, educators. Nowadays starting from zero is the exception to the rule. All that said, I would never recommend an online Museum studies degree unless you are working full time at a museum while you are taking the degree.

Right like...do people just not like celebrating? How is "life accomplishment" suspicious? Yeah the other side of my family has more degrees but even they'll expect announcements. It would be rude not to. I wouldn't send anything to a fourth cousin (at least I don't think so?), but I have great aunts and uncles who will all want something, and after I've covered Aunts, Uncles, and Great Uncles/Aunts I'll just let my family figure out who else they want to send things to. For some people, I might not know them well, but my grandparents would be horrified not to let so-and-so know about their grandchild. *shrugs* It is what it is. If those people are annoyed with me, what do I care?

Yeah, I'd have to say this sort of thing is COMPLETELY based on your family's culture. I have a very large, very extended family on one side. These sort of announcements are how we keep in touch, celebrate, remind ourselves to call everyone, etc. A success for one member is a success for everyone, especially reflecting upon my mother and grandparents, (but also godparents, and other adults in my life). There's a decent divide between: "I'm better than you for graduating college" and "You all worked hard so I could be the first to graduate college and now I'm going on to graduate school. This is our success." (Also good to note: Out of my 12 first cousins and brother, I am the oldest of the bunch, so if I do it, it's not weird?) It would never occur to me to think of it as being "better than", because it's something my family encouraged me to do so I could have better options in life. It's coded in the language you use, I think: "owe you money". The money is a gift. I don't know, it would be completely weird for me to not send announcements to everyone and their mother. Any time I visit home there's a good smattering of them, coupled with birth, engagement, and wedding announcements on the fridge and corkboards. If someone else in my family needed money and I had money to give, I would contribute. That's just how it works for us -- broken dishwasher? Everyone pitches in for an upcoming birthday and buys a new one. Move across the country? Well if they don't have the money to help, they might very well help me pack. I'm not going to walk, so I'm only inviting people to my party. A large chunk of my family all lives in the same metro area, so it's not as if they won't be able to come. As for the family further away, inviting them is a courtesy gesture. The idea that you would resent someone for graduating college, or having a baby, or getting married, or whatever and the implication that they might need money therein is...odd to me? I don't know, I just don't know anyone in my family who would react so negatively.

Isn't UMass Amherst part of a consortium? Does that extend to graduates and would you take advantage of that in any way? All things being equal, I'd write out in no particular order: affordability of the city vs the stipend amount (can I live comfortably/afford conference travel?) local resources (museums, galleries, libraries, etc.) university resources (research centers, libraries, galleries, museums, etc) number of desirable faculty in each department what's "nearby" but a day trip from each city? location pros and cons fit re: your area of focus program specific "bonuses" you liked for each school misc "other" things you like about each school or location (not necessarily directly related to your studies, but hey -- you have to have some kind of hobbies outside of school, right?) Then maybe go from there?

If you need money to move that badly, do you honestly care if your second cousin resents you for asking for it? Personally, I see no reason to be direct with it, the implication is there in the Grad announcements. If you think the announcements themselves, or the asking for funds for a major life event like moving across the country and going to graduate school is something to resent someone for then so be it. This isn't true for everyone, however. For my family, demanding would be tacky because it's expected people will help however they can because they're family. That said, asking for help is what family is for. Or at least such is the case with my own family. Yours may be completely different! But I hardly think being a young graduate asking for help with a big move is losing self-respect.