so47

I'm with oldlady. I don't think a PhD is something you can get through if you're ambivalent. It's a lot of work, and you really have to have a passion for it. It sounds like you are very happy in your job, so why did you even apply? If your only reason for obtaining a PhD is a pay-scale raise, then I just wonder if that would REALLY be enough to get you through 6-8 years. Do some soul-searching, and figure out where you want to be in 15 years. Does your goal require a PhD? Or would you be happy moving up as a BS level?

So I was able to get a peek into some of the University Housing units when I was on campus last week. Here is my take: Maplewood: Location is good. Very close to campus, and also very close to Collegetown area, so it would be good for those who want to have a social life. But the housing itself was in really small individual modular units, into which were crammed a 4 bedroom apartment. IMO, the living room is wayyyyy too small for that many people, didn't even look like there was room for a decent TV. Kitchen was okay, lots of cabinet space, but you are sharing it with 3 other people. The bedrooms were MICROSCOPIC! As in twin size bed, tiny dresser and a desk, and there was barely room to move. Literally just a small path around the bed. Hasbrouck: Location wise, it's on the northwest border of campus, which appears to be a bit socially isolating (as others here at gradcafe had warned me). Lots of kids running around, so it was definitely obvious that there is a large number of families up there. But, I found the housing units to be more appealing. I looked at a 2-bedroom townhouse. The kitchen was very small (half-size stove) but seems adequate. The living room was much larger than Maplewood, with nice big windows. The bedrooms were a bit better here too. The "regular" sized bedroom is slightly bigger than the ones at Maplewood, and the larger bedroom is much bigger, even has a full/queen size bed. So I am not sure what I am going to do at the point. My parents are really pushing me to live in the university housing so I don't have to deal with the "unknown" but I feel like I would have to choose Hasbrouck for the space, but am worried since my first year is the one I really want to try to be social! Yes there are buses, but from peeking at the TCAT schedules (correct me if I'm wrong) it looks like they don't run very late, so it doesn't look like that would be an option for weekend nights and such. Ideally I would LOVE to find another female first year in my program to find off campus housing together, since it would be nice to live with someone going through the same thing as me! But, so far the people I met at visitation weekends have either decided to go elsewhere or have not yet decided. I'm thinking about emailing the admin after April 15th and asking if she could give me a list of the next year's first years so I can try to find someone else who might be interested in housing together. I am so antsy! I just want to get my damn housing figured out so there is nothing left to worry about for next year!!!

I vote for Oregon, because it''s supposed to be beautiful! Much better than Dirty Jersey, IMO

I'm a bit confused. The "tier" system is mostly used for the undergraduate rankings. There are separate ranking by your specific discipline for graduate schools, and at least in the sciences (I'm assuming your geology as listed in your profile) they only list to the top hundred or so, and even less in the specific sub-fields, which is no where near large enough for the tier system. If you are using undergrad rankings, disregard them! I was told a school's undergrad ranking has very little impact on how they are perceived for graduate school. Focus on the graduate school rankings for your field, they are much more accurate on how future PhD programs or employers will view the school's reputation in your area.

Does School B's offer come with financial support? If not, you are not bound legally, and it is acceptable to accept an offer and later withdraw if you get into School A. If they are offering support, I would follow boo's advice and take the offer and run. They still are you second choice, so it's not like it's your safety school. Still seems like a good option to me!

Here are some examples of ones that I sent. This first one is to my safety school, which I did not even visit: This second one I put more effort into, because I really liked the school and the program, and wanted to keep it friendly since I will probably run into them sometime in the future: I also sent personal letters to some of the faculty that I really liked at the second school, with a bit more detail and personal info. Hope this helps!

Forget about rankings for a second. This school has research that you are more interested in, and which school did you feel a better fit with? I personally went for "fit" even over better research, because it was important to me to go somewhere I felt like I belonged, got along with the people, and just overall could be happy for the next five years. If you think that you will be happier in City A at School A, and you liked the people and department, than go for it. Having a support system of friends and family could help to save your sanity. And a 50ish ranked school is still good, top 20 sounds better, but there are plenty of programs that aren't even ranked, let alone in the top 50. So if you liked School B and could be happy with your school and home life there, go for it!

Live your dream! Your spouse is supportive, which is awesome. And speaking as a military brat who moved a lot due to my dad's job, I think it was good for me and actually helps you in the long run. Kids bounce back, make friends, don't worry about that. Yeah they might whine when they first leave their friends and are scared to start school, but I think that making new friendships and being adaptable are important life skills, and it made it easier for me down the road (e.g. going away to college). And yeah it will be tough adjusting to a lower salary, but worth it in the end after you get the PhD. And I think we all worry about failing! I'm worried that my school puts so much faith in me and what if I don't match up? But, I think these schools know what they're doing, and only accept people they know can make it. And I don't think you're anywhere near to old! I met plenty of people with families who came back to school after working for years. And even the people who went straight to grad school, I think the common experience will help you bond more than age. Chin up, it'll all work out. I know it's hard to force yourself not to worry about things, because I am also the type of person who always finds something to stress over. But take a few minutes and bask in your success! You got what you have been working for for years, and don't forget that!

In this economy? Go for teaching. It sounds like a great opportunity. And can you really afford to be a student for a M-FA followed by another degree? If you can, you are very lucky and go for it. But for me, I would be worried about having a job to pay all those students loans off with! But also note, I am a scientist and am practical almost to a fault. So that definitely puts some bias in my advice

Not necessarily!I'm gonna stick a limb out and guess it's Scripps since you said highly respected, in California with no TAing. Scripps is one of the most reputable chem programs out there, and the reason they have no TAing is that they have no undergrads, it's a graduate only institution. I'd wager a guess that one gets a good enough background at Scripps that the lack of TAing is not really a negative. Anyway, as far as advice to the OP, honestly it sounds to me that you have 3 very good options. But things to consider: How many students are these profs you are interested in taking next year? The one who is heavily recruiting you seems to probably have room, but make sure that they all are taking students, or that they are not taking only 1. You don't want to go to a school that has one prof you want to work for, and not wind up getting into their group due to competing with others students for that one spot. Then you would be left with no one you want to work with! So if you know that these profs will have room in their group, go with the gut, whichever school just felt "right," the best fit. If there is any doubt if you can make it into these profs groups, then go to the school with more options. Can I just say one thing about new professors: I don't think it's a bad thing. If you join a new prof, I have heard that you get more one-on-one since they tend to be in the lab a lot, meaning you get better training, and experience if you go on to set up your own lab one day. They tend to work their students very hard, but, you get what you put in, meaning you tend to get lots of papers and stuff out since they are also trying to get tenure. I have never heard that it takes longer to get a PhD with a new prof, mostly because they do push you harder than most tenured faculty. What I learned from talking to the grad students on my visits is the most important thing to be wary of with new faculty is where they are in their tenure track. If you join a brand new professor, you will probably be finishing your PhD before they go up for tenure, which means you will def get the degree even if they don't get tenure. The risk comes in if your advisor goes up for tenure and doesn't get it before you go up for PhD candidacy...then the department isn't "committed" to you yet, and you could be in a weird spot. And if they didn't get tenure in the middle of your PhD, you might have to deal with finding a new group, etc which could put you behind. So I was told it's better to join a brand new group than one where the prof is up for tenure in 1-2 years.

I would also go with School B, because there is essentially only 1 professor you could see yourself working for at A, which is definitely not enough, plus you did not feel a "fit" with the other students, which is definitely important. I was in a similar situation, and decided that the fit was more important to me, you are going to be spending a LOT of time with these people, and you don't want to miserable. For me, I decided that I could adjust my research a bit for the higher ranked school, because I know that overall, the program was stronger and could give me a better foundation, even though I liked the research at the lower ranked school better. Good luck with your decision!

That is not true with the sciences. Most chemistry PhD programs actually require you to teach the first 1-2 years, and I am pretty certain that it typical of other sciences as well. The schools I talked to said that they don't typically give out RA's for the first year because they want to give you time to get acclimated, talk to faculty, and have at least the entire first semester before you join a group. As far as overall advice for the OP, can you TA your first year, then RA the rest of the time? I personally think that is the best set up. Then you get the teaching experience in the beginning before you are fully invested in a research project, but you still have an RA for 4 solid years which will definitely help you make good progress on your thesis.

Ditto!

Honestly, I don't think it's possible to do a science PhD 3-4 days a week. I'm attending an Ivy for a Chem PhD next year, and almost all the students I talked to (even theoretical) said they are there 6 days a week. I think you would be pressured to be there much more than 3-4 days, especially if you are receiving any type of aid. My advisor also went to an Ivy and said it was the same deal, and she actually only went in 5 days a week but read journals on the weekends, and she still caught a lot of slack for it. So I wouldn't count on being able to do work remotely. And I think if you are wrong with this estimation of 3-4 days a week, that it would be absolutely miserable to have that long of a commute for 5-6 days a week.

Most people do not bring any one on a visit, though I have heard some people on here talk about bringing a spouse, etc because obviously this type of decision involves their significant other. I went on one visit where someone brought their sister, but that was because the prospective is in the Army and was back from deployment solely for the grad school visits. What is the reason for you to bring the friend? Is it just for company, or are they someone important in your life you feel like you can't make this decision without? If it's only for company, I would advise against it, because one of the main goals of a visit to a grad school is to interact with the other students and faculty and see how you fit with them. If you bring a friend, you may be less disposed to chat with them in favor of just hanging with your friend so they don't feel left out. If there is a stronger reason, like this friend is moving with you, etc, then maybe it would be okay to bring them. Either way, if you DO choose to bring a friend, significant other, family member, etc, you ABSOLUTELY have to ask permission of the department. They pay for a lot of things for these visit weekends, like food, hotel, events, and they may have to pay for your friend, so you have to be sure they are okay with that.

Oh wow, found housing already? That's impressive! I'm a bit stressed about housing, not sure how to go about finding roommates, or if I will even be able to make it to Ithaca to look at places! I am going tomorrow to visit with my parents, but I feel like I am not ready to look at housing since I have no idea about who to live with and thus what size place to do! People in my program seem to wait until they come for TA training in July to find housing, but that makes me a bit nervous since I don't want to wind up in a crap-hole. So for now I am stressing! Gah!

^^THIS

I also agree with fuzzylogician. Plus, you mentioned that there are 3-4 advisors at School B that you really like, and only 1 at School A. It's better to have more than one advisor that you think you could work for. Go with the gut, they both sound like they are highly ranked in your subfield, so go with B since it feels right. *Edit- I personally wound up picking my school because the fit just felt right, and I felt like the school cared more and actually wanted me. Feeling valued is good, probably indicates they will have a vested interest in your success there.

*Wonders where the rest of the new Cornellians are* I'm impatient! So excited about starting I want to talk to more people that are starting as well! I guess it's still early though, theres still about 2 weeks left until April 15th...

Go for the funding. There are both stellar programs, but I seriously doubt that Harvard's is worth paying off $120K for the next 30 years. At Yale you will have no loans, and given some money to live off of.

I went to the first visitation weekend there. I went right after my Cornell visit, and I felt that it was set up a bit differently. It was more "independent" than Cornell's, as in I felt like there was less opportunity to interact with the grad students, you were on your own a bit more. You kind of had to seek grad students out to talk to them, whereas my other visit had more events that the prospectives got specific time with the grads. UNC had your host give you an informal tour when you got there on Friday, then to be honest my host didn't talk to me again when I was there. I really felt like there were only a few grad students I got to talk to, and they were the really extroverted ones who made a point to be involved. I also felt like it was more independent in the sense that you had to make your way around on your own, to and from the hotel and your appts, etc. I guess overall just a less structured approach than my other visit. Which depends on the each person, it can be good and bad. It gave some time to walk around on your own and figure things out, get your bearings geography wise, take pics, etc. I even had time to go to the hotel to take a nap, so it was slightly more relaxed schedule wise than my other visit. Hope this helps! Feel free to PM me if you have any more specific questions.

Honestly, a car is a must for more than weekend trips in Durham. I was just there last weekend, and while Chapel Hill has a good bus system, the impression I got from my friends and other students there is it is mainly useful for getting to and from campus (UNC-CH) but you really have to have a car to get to most grocery stores, shopping, social stuff. And my friends at Duke all drive to campus daily. The housing there is great, but it is mainly apartment complexes off of really big roads with 55 mph+ speed limits. And things are so spread out that I don't think walking and biking would be very practical there, especially at night. I have heard that there a rough parts of Durham and you wouldn't want to be walking through one of those in the middle of the night. But I highly doubt that Durham has more crime than Boston, but either place, you just have to be smart and know how to keep safe (don't walk alone late a night if you're a girl, don't go to ATM after dark, typical "street smarts") So if you don't have a license or a car and don't want one, go to Boston. Durham is great but pretty much everyone has a car down there.

Personally, I would just defer, just from not wanting to deal with the whole process all over again. There is always a risk of not getting in to the same schools next year since the applicant pool changes in quality and quantity, but I am not sure how often it happens that people don't get into the same school 2 years in a row. So overall, if I were you, since it sounds like you do really like Columbia, I would take their offer and defer. But first, talk to Columbia and check to see if they offer deferrals...as some schools do not (my friend had that problem last year) As for finding other schools you like, I think that will always happen, one of those "grass is greener" things. Good luck with your decision!

Personally, I would not accept it. I know I would not be able to go somewhere without funding or being eligible for a loan, and I would be scared of them not letting you know until July since it's possible they may ask you to start paying tuition, or at least deposits, before then. I think you need to expect the worst case scenario, i.e. you don't get funding, and figure out what you would do. If the answer is it's not possible, than I would not accept the offer. Accepting the offer is a binding contract, and you may have either a hard time getting out of it, or may lose deposit money or something like that. This all said, I also am not an expert, I applied to PhD programs and don't know how the funding situation works with MA programs. But make a realistic list of your options, and decide what makes the most sense.

I agree with everything rising_star said, but also make sure to ask things like follows: If you have to TA: -How many "teaching hours"/classes do most TA's get assigned? -What types of classes do they TA -How many years most students have to TA -How many hours a week do they spend on their TA duties In general: -How many days/hours most grad students are on campus? (you'd be surprised at this, I talked to students who said most people were there 7 days a week, including nights) -How much time off they get (may be official or through advisor, but some schools have 4 weeks, others have 2 or less) -Does the department try and help students through the program, or do they try to push you out if you have trouble? -How efficient is adminstration? (i.e. payroll, billing, etc) -Average length to degree, and does the department try to get you out or try to keep you there as long as they can -Can you switch concentration/advisors fairly easily? And I agree with what eucalyptus said about asking about competition/dynamic between grad students, and the social atmosphere too.