PaperChaser

I can practically hear the screams of "BUT IT'S NOT WHAT I WANT TO DO!" preparing to leap out, but.... It seems like MOST of the very frustrated applicants on this forum are mainly trying to get into Literature PhD programs. (I tried that once. Didn't work out. But I'm not you.) In the grand scheme of things, the economy is bad, and...just trying to be realistic, not negative...people who would've retired now (or in a couple of years) are now clinging to their jobs since their 401ks became 91ks. Because the Baby Boomers-many of whom hold the coveted Lit positions-ain't budging, the job market for Lit PhDs is super-tight, more people are applying to programs, and it's just REALLY competitive. At the end of the "race," you may be battling it out with other Ivy League grads for a non-tenure track lectureship in Piedmont, ND. Ok, that's the worst case scenario, but it happens to way too many people. There IS another way to get a PhD in English AND have a better chance at finding a job that will lead to the job you want. (I'd like to take credit for this, but it's just reality.) More and more schools are offering programs in Rhetoric and Writing, Cultural Studies, and other less "rigidly defined" disciplines that still fall under the umbrella of "English" when you get your degree. From my experience, most of these programs have high placement rates, less competition for admission (say, 100 applicants for 6 spots instead of 500 for 6 spots), more flexibility as to what you teach, etc. If you're a literature person, going a less traditional route doesn't make you LESS of a lit person. If there's something in particular about a Lit PhD that you think you might be able to still get out of a Rhet/Comp, Cultural Studies, Interdisciplinary Studies, Women's Studies, New Media, etc...then maybe that's something to CONSIDER. Look at programs, look at their course offerings, look at recent grads' dissertations, and see if maybe that's something that would work for you. It's just a suggestion. If you're hell-bent on getting in somewhere, it might be worth reconsidering the less obvious options.

Since my writing sample was probably the best part of my apps (um, unless the committees were wowed by my stunning 2.7 undergrad grades!)....I'll tell you what I thought made the difference for ME. The first time I applied (and got in nowhere), I was less than halfway through my MA, and I used a paper from an undergrad class. It was awful. When I applied for this year, I DID use parts of my thesis. Like others have said, the whole thesis is probably too long. Considering that my thesis was pretty strange (but memorable, apparently), I used the introduction (5 pages), the major theoretical section (I took out anything extraneous to make it 15 pages), and the two shortest chapters that applied the theory (about 7 pages). That was STILL too long, but I really couldn't cut much else out for it to all make sense, so........if the app didn't say "12 point font, double-spaced," then I used 11 point font and 1.5 spaced it. Bending the rules a bit, but....that got it under 25 pages

THANK YOU for posting that honestly! I did equally bad (um, technically slightly worse) on the quant section and my subject test was an embarrassment! I can only speak for Rhet/Comp, but the programs I applied to and were accepted by gave GRE scores the lowest weight on their admissions schematic. VA Tech was cool enough to admit that they had enough "math geeks" around that I could borrow a calculator if I needed to add 2+2 I think a VERY low verbal score (below 60th percentile maybe?) would be a red flag to most programs-again, only speaking Rhet/Comp-but one could counter that with strong grades and excellent SOPs, LORs, and a kickass writing sample. Don't stress about low GREs....just make the rest of your app stand out

UNM=University of New Mexico? Not hideously selective. (Check the 2007 Portrait of the Profession thing for more info) Oregon=pretty dang selective.

Sometimes REALLY nice adcom profs identify with you if you're the kind of person who works your ass off but doesn't always "test well." My first acceptance phone call was from a DGS who, when pressed as to why the committee HAD to have ignored my GRE scores (awful, by any standards) to admit me, said "anyone who can score below the level of chance but manages to get glowing LORs, degrees with high GPAs, and continuous employment MUST have an interesting story to tell." (She then told me her GREs were LOWER than mine! And she went to a great program!) I think that people applying with just a BA have their GRE scores weighted much more heavily. On some level-unless you went to a very selective undergrad-how would a committee have any idea where to situate you "prospect-wise" without a "semi-objective" standard? (I won't go into how not semi-objective standardized testing is.) I really do think that if you have solid BA grades and mediocre test scores, you CAN get into a PhD without the MA if you absolutely ROCK the SOP and writing sample. The problem with that is...and this is JUST my opinion...it's a lot harder to know concretely what your interests are and how marketable they'll be in 5 years when you only have a BA. So that makes the SOP and writing sample considerably harder, since you haven't had the MA time and coursework to really develop either of those. Just a thought.

Ditto. FWIW, one of my best friends went to Florida and was happy as a clam. (Who wouldn't be? It's warm 80% of the year! Chicago has great food....but is really cold and windy!) You're already lucky to have more than one FUNDED offer! So go be the big fish in the good-sized pond..Woolfie is right, you'll be totally prepared for round 2. From my own experience, going from a BA to MA (rather than PhD) and having law school barfingly intervene didn't "slow" me down, it just gave me time and perspective to KNOW what I wanted from a PhD program. I'd strongly second taking a funded offer if you think you can pursue your interests at either of those schools

Yeah, I'll have to work full time. (That said, my firm is not a "2200 hours of billable time a year or you DIE" type firm!) I worked full time undergrad, grad, and (gasp, yes, illegally!) during law school. It's just never been an option for me NOT to work---not married, NO even upper-middle class family members to help in a pinch. Luckily I've almost always met the income guidelines for free or reduced health services, which helps out some. (The cancerous moles on my back aren't going anywhere....) I don't buy stuff I can't afford (iPhone....I'll wait till the firm picks up the tab) and if I have to replace a capital asset (car, computer), I either save up to pay in full or haggle until the price is doable. I've gotten screwed worse by ne-er-do-well roommates than anything else, so I think I'll have to resign myself to living alone without cable if it means cutting out an unreliable person who will guilt trip me because I have better credit. (Um, that would be because I pay my bills instead of squandering my ENTIRE student loan check in 2 months!) Oops, sorry to rant. Working has its upsides...worst case scenario, I lose my job and can go to school full time. Or vice versa. I've always been the "better in real life than on paper" type, so working has been more helpful than stressful. Stressful for me would be sending out job applications and having to put my embarrassingly low UGPA and non-prestigious schools on it! No one would hire me based on the education section of my resume, so I have to keep the employment part pretty solid. Plus, I secretly sort of like suing scumbags.

I didn't apply there but thought about it since they offer a totally online PhD (very appealing to a multi-tasker)...is that what you applied for? Try checking the Results Search and type in "Texas Tech" to see if you can get more info.....

I have to say, Louisville IS a great school for people whose interests at least partially align with the faculty and students there. Unfortunately, when I went up there for the grad weekend, it just WASN'T a fit. I feel soooooooo guilty saying that, because everyone was SO nice and it was SUCH a good offer, but I'm going to do the PhD thing to pursue my bizarre little course of research interests, and none of the faculty were even conversant in legal rhetoric. (Not that many non-law school profs are...) It would be a wonderful program for anyone who wanted a lot of hands-on administrative experience, and I got the impression PhD candidates were by no means limited to teaching Comp 101. I have nothing negative to say about Louisville (except that the buildings left a bit to be desired, but there was a horrendous flood a year or so ago) and would HIGHLY recommend it. It just wasn't a close enough match for my interests and, to be totally honest, it's just a bit too far away from home for me. Bar exam-not related to Rhet/Comp. I have to pass it to be a licensed lawyer (in addition to getting a JD)-if I move out of state, I'd have to take ANOTHER one. The "cheap" states are about $1500 for the prep course and $800 to take the exam, so.....it's definitely a consideration for me to stay in-state.. THANK YOU ALL for your advice. I really, really, really appreciate the opinions of people who have nothing to gain or lose from my choice...disinterested parties do tend to offer the most honest opinions!

Well, confirmed that spring break was LAST week. Apparently this week is the last few days for drop/add (uh, it's mid-MARCH!), so.....ok, the lack of response is highly annoying. I'm not even seeking funding from them (cheaper to pay in-state and keep my job) but it would really fry my ass if I were and hadn't heard. There's such a huge discrepancy between how well some of the schools I applied to have treated me (Louisville, though not a "match" for me, really goes out of its way to make you want to go there! Highly recommend that for Rhet/Comp people who have significant interest in WPA. VA Tech's DGS talked to me on the phone for an hour even though HE advised me not to take an unfunded offer, which was pretty nice of him.)....and how some of the other schools (South Carolina, UNCG) have been minimally professional and borderline rude in their late or non-existent responses to what were VERY basic and necessary questions. I think it's a bad sales pitch for those programs, but I guess PhD deals can afford to be picky and rude since we're all waiting in tortured agony! I just don't want to be treated that way as a student. FWIW, one of my recommenders (who is closest in personality type to me of anyone I've met in academia) said UNCG is a good fit for "laidback, not necessarily traditional people." She's apparently still friends with the DGS (she got her PhD there) and said that UNCG plans to accept about the same number of students it usually does but (unlike previous years) will not be able to fund all of them. Her guesstimate was accept 8-10 and fund 4-5. Sure would be nice to know....

I don't think anyone's dying on a waitlist for my programs, but I'm choosing among Louisville, UNCG, VA Tech, and South Carolina. It's basically come down to UNCG and South Carolina, so it that helps anyone....(sorry, I knew I wasn't Top 20 grade! But I'm in Rhet/Comp...)

Hmmmm. I can only speak for myself and my close friends/family, but I disagree that tenure track jobs are impossibilities for people who didn't get their degrees from the "top" schools. That said, tenure track jobs at "top schools" may be really hard to get if you didn't go to an Ivy, but there is no such thing as impossible. A tenure track job at a "good" or respectable school is attainable, but it may require more personal networking for those of us who don't have super-prestigious degrees. I've NEVER gone to a prestigious school (failed out of non-flagship state school, bounced around junior colleges, got BA from non-flagship state school, got MA from same school, got law degree from brand-new law school no one's heard of...) and I have had NO problem finding work. I've competed against the Duke law students-even UNC and Wake Forest are technically "vastly superior" to me-and beaten them out for summer associate positions and (eventually) a pretty good gig where I'll not only be the first associate, I'll be the first female attorney. Every lawyer there went to a super-prestigious school and was Order of the Coif and law review. So what? That doesn't make them better than me; it means they probably paid a hell of a lot more for undergrad and law school than I did and maybe had higher undergrad grades. Ok. But in every department or law firm or business, there has to be at least ONE person who everyone likes and/or is easy to deal with, and I made damn sure to impress upon every person I've worked with (academia, law world, and otherwise) that I'm absolutely reliable, super-hardworking, and extremely grateful for the opportunity. A good attitude often tips the scales. My advice to you is to knock the "but the world is closed to me if I don't have an Ivy PhD!" chip off your shoulder. It's not. You may have to work a little harder, force yourself to network (which I sense may not be your favorite thing to do), and yeah, kiss a little ass. But people will remember you, they'll like you, and when you apply for jobs or go to conventions, you'll have laid the groundwork for getting that dream job.

Ok, so like pretty much everyone else on here, I have unanswered questions and conflicting feelings. Here are my options, so if anyone wants to weigh in....I'm totally unable to ponder a decision. ***Reapplication is NOT an option, so it's this year, defer to next year, or never. I am not in a position to take out any more than subsidized Stafford loans.*** 1. U of Louisville (full funding). Upsides: engaged faculty, best stipend, low cost of living, nice grad students, good placement rate for my discipline (Rhet/Comp), 4 year program. Downsides: icky campus, sketchy housing options, only one faculty member who really interests me, very far away from ANY friends/family, have to teach summers. Total funding: $80k over 4 years. Would have to take KY bar exam. 2. South Carolina (TA-ship, renewable for 5 years). Upsides: larger program so more options for my weird interests, lots of faculty I'd like to work with, decent campus, have some friends there and family not SO far. Downsides: minimal options for teaching anything other than Freshman Comp, shitty stipend, medium cost of living (to be near campus), grad director not terribly friendly to new admits. Total funding: $60k over 5 years. Would have to take SC bar exam. 3. VA Tech (no funding). Upsides: would take 27 credits from my MA and JD (thus making it a 3 year program...), NO language requirement, probably the best fit for my interests, lots of opportunities to teach in pre-law program. Downsides: NO FUNDING, semi-rural campus, new program (no alumni), no promises. Total funding: probably nothing, so out of state tuition for 3 years. Would have to take VA bar exam. 4. University of NC-Greensboro. Upsides: I'm already in GSO, I could skip the funding (since in-state tuition is VERY cheap) and keep working but defer my law school loans, decent placement stats, nice new building/renovated campus. Downsides: Dept not really on the ball, not a flagship school, wouldn't get credit for any previous coursework because it's "too old." (2005!) Total funding: $69kish for 5(?) years OR my job ($300k/5 yrs) minus tuition (about $20k total for 5 years). I really don't know what to do. I feel like leaving a good job in this economy is really stupid IF I can make the local program work. I don't know that I am guaranteed continued legal employment indefinitely, but if I got let go, I could go to school full time at UNCG and finish sooner. I feel like getting 4-6 years of legal experience while getting a PhD may be the best use of my time and funds, but...I don't know. Ideas?

Free place to live with petsitter? Hell, I'll live with your parents if you don't want to!

I think some of the validation that comes with an acceptance from an Ivy is that you WERE accepted. Thank them for the opportunity (or try to haggle funding), but don't take out that much debt when the economy is in the toilet and academic jobs are slashed left and right. You can get a good education at a program that will pay YOU to go. AND you can gloat about getting into Harvard! As well you should.

In this economy, unless you're 100% sure you'd never regret taking out loans to go to Georgetown, I'd take the funded offer and enjoy the South by Southwest music festival

Just my opinion (as a hugely indebted person...) GO to MAPH if: 1. you don't have significant undergrad debt and/or 2. it's that or working in some shit job that will neither help you get a better job nor make your "year or so between application cycles" more meaningful and/or 3. you think you'd get a lot out of MAPH (I only know it by reputation) and that it would lead to a PhD admit or other acceptable career path. Rethink it if: 1. you want to go somewhere SOOOO badly THIS year that you're overlooking many potential programs that would pay YOU to attend (but you have to find something else to do this year) and/or 2. you have other student debt/consumer debt. (I posted some info on bankruptcy elsewhere, but it is VERY hard to get student loans discharged! Don't think of bankruptcy as a legitimate option..just because you file for it does NOT mean you'll get it. It's highly complex and not something to use as a fallback plan for loans.) and/or 3. the program is a good but not great fit. The cost of living in Chicago isn't low, so...well, I guess I'm just reiterating #1! In the end, it's your life. If you're fresh out of undergrad, you can always defer a year and think about it while you strengthen your other apps/get real world experience/travel/intern/whatever. If you're like me and it's about time to pick a career and STICK with it...well, you tell me!

Try Winston Salem's Craigslist and look at the downtown housing. A cat shouldn't be a big problem, but most of the traditional "managed" properties now charge a non-refundable pet fee PLUS "pet rent," so factor that in too. You can log onto the WS Chamber of Commerce website and request a relocation package

This is my LAST pseudo-defense of UNCG (and mainly because the new buildings on campus are really, really, really nice) since the administrative assistant has not answered my email either. Apparently this (or last?) week was spring break-I assume this week since they sent out letters last week and are hiding from pissed off applicants this week-so MAYBE they're all gone. I will give them the benefit of the doubt, but the campus is 3 miles from my house, and if I see lights on in the English building, I'm "dropping by" tomorrow. I really do think the letter from the DGS stating you're admitted and are in or out of state is just to serve as a place-keeper since April 15th is looming. I assume "funding decisions are being made" and we'll get letters from the English Dept regarding TA-ships or whatever in a week or two. If you're seriously considering UNCG and aren't familiar with Greensboro, feel free to message me...I've already made ALL the housing mistakes!

I like your coupon idea. I think, at a minimum, schools should refund part (or all) of the app fee if they reject you without actually reading your entire application. By my calculations, I would be some $1300 richer (PhD round 1, nursing school, law school, PhD round 2...)! Or a complimentary fifth of Jack Daniels so we'd at least forget how crappy it feels. I highly doubt you're a lousy writer, but if it makes you feel better, I scored in the 300s (yes, less than chance) on the GRE quant section and my subject test is almost as embarrassing. I only found out Australia was a CONTINENT a few weeks ago. You're smart. You got in. You're happy with your offer. I shall be happy for you!

Post Secrets are preferable to Texts From Last Night, I guess But I kinda miss those days!

Ditto prior posters... My list: 1. Thank God I actually sucked it up and applied, despite having shit for grades/non-prestigious degrees/weird interests. At least now I KNOW I have options, and maybe I'll be a smidge less bitter, whatever I choose to do. 2. However, in the meantime, the whole choosing thing sucks. I've been on the other side (no acceptances, no backup plan), and I won't lie and say that doesn't suck worse, but perpetual "did I make the right decision" plague is frustrating too. 3. For the later acceptances, April 15th doesn't give one much time to visit campuses and do other things necessary to making an informed choice. 4. I agree that how the faculty treats the admits (and rejects, and waitlists) is VERY indicative of how future students will be treated. I'm not spending 4-5 years of my life somewhere the faculty/staff "can't be bothered" to respond to emails. 5. There are a heck of a lot of people FAR smarter than I am who got in nowhere. I'm going to make the tacit suggestion that a "fallback school" should probably be out of the top 50ish...but that's just me. The best schools can only take a few of their hundreds of apps...the "middle of the road" schools CAN still offer a good education and opportunities. Sometimes it's not so bad to be a bigger fish in a smaller pond? 6. I got into more programs than my Ivy Leaguer/favorite child/5'9 115 lb "perfect" sister. That alone is evidence of some sort of universal justice. (Sorry, I can't admit that anywhere but here...) C'est la indeed.

I got a letter saying I'd been admitted but it didn't mention funding or...anything else. I would anticipate that the English Dept will send out something more specific. I'm aware that the school is having funding issues, but unless you've gotten something SAYING you aren't getting funding, I wouldn't assume you're not yet. I'll try emailing too...but I suspect UNCG is on spring break or just returning. (I live in NC.)

Be sure to set aside money for the rather high taxes. (They're not high if you're coming from NY or CA or a really big city, but they're steep for the south...) That's something I wish I would've known!

I live in Greensboro (currently-been here 3 years)...there do seem to be more young people in Winston than Greensboro. Honestly, I've had the best luck via Craigslist in terms of housing, but current/former Wake Forest grad students may be able to suggest housing in the area. The Triad area of NC (Greensboro-WS-High Point) isn't quite as inexpensive as people make it out to be, but if you don't have pets/kids, you can EASILY find something close to the school. I have to drive to downtown WS once or month or so for my job, and despite having a GPS, I STILL get lost a lot. The downtown (from my experience) is pretty safe and is definitely being "revitalized." If the downtown prices get a little steep for you, Kernersville is pretty close (10-15 minutes, but it's not cheap). Greensboro is actually only about 20 minutes if you live near the airport, but I'd shoot for something close to campus if you want to avoid the morning traffic tangle. Definitely buy a parking pass!!! Where are you from and what are you looking for (1 bedroom, townhouse, etc..price range)? I may be able to help, if you want a semi-native's perspective.