PaperChaser

I'd like to add that pharmaceutical sales have been a bit slow, so inducing depression and/or anxiety gives SOMEONE business....if you notice that all the pens and notepads in the offices are from Big Pharma, well.....

Hey man, after law school, I had to get a little greedier! Plus Louisville pays all expenses for a visitation day....$700 value to me! I wouldn't have known it existed if my MA WPA director hadn't gone there and raved about it. I think they're way more about teaching great teaching than teaching shameless self-promotion. I have friends who went to NC State. I know that being in Raleigh/Durham would offer you MANY more social opportunities, but that's just an opinion. As far as I'm concerned, it takes a ton of perseverance to actually complete an application (!!!!), so we're already winners, ya know?

Not to be confused with the Piedmont Triad (Greensboro-Winston Salem-High Point, NC) which is definitely not friendly to much outside WASP/hetero culture.

WOW Thank you for so much information!!!!! I wish I knew more (read: anything) about Louisville, but I guess I'll find out when I get up there. Since you have a lot of suggestions on what NOT to do which were very helpful, do you have any suggestions for finding a decent place to live? I do have a (relatively new/nice but not conspicuously so) car, so I CAN drive but really prefer either to walk (which sounds like a really stupid idea from what you've said...also, I'm a fairly small chick) or have a less than 15 minute commute. Are there any decent apartment complexes, or do you just have to wait and hope something pops up on Craigslist? Is there a way to find roommates who aren't totally sketchy? (Dumb question, but had to ask.) I just don't know how to find something from a distance (NC) that would be in my price range and not crime central. On the plus side, my dog is a pretty stellar theft-deterrent; on the other hand, not all places allow pets. Do grad students have to buy parking passes? (I'm sure by this point you can tell I have NO idea about the university...) Are they the expensive but really kind or the $200 a semester "have a nice 2 mile walk" type? Hmmm, this is all information to factor into where to live, that's for sure! Thanks for all the suggestions, and please keep them coming!

I am only speaking for myself, but here's my "valence": 1. If I applied to a school where I knew a graduate of the program, how pleased they were with their experience. (That says a LOT to me.) I.e., if they had it to do all over again, would they have chosen the same program? 2. Funding. Sorry, it's reality. I have more than $130k in law school debt, so I had to rank schools with the best stipends and committed funding (i.e. Louisville) over schools with shaky guarantees and low stipends (i.e. South Carolina, even though USC was high up on my "people I'd like to have on my dissertation committee list"). I can only take out a little bit more money in loans, so I have to go somewhere with a stipend I can make work. 3. Location. Again, kind of shallow, but it's 4 years of my life, and I have to be able to tolerate the climate. 4. Job placement rates. At the end of all this, I need to know I'm marketable AND that the school will help market me. I'd rather be a bigger fish in a smaller pond than struggling at a "top" program, but again, that's just me, and I've been jaded by 3 years of law school! 5. Willingness of program to encourage/allow interdisciplinary studies. Since my interests fall best into Rhet/Comp but also involve the law, I don't want to go somewhere that discourages interdisciplinary studies. 6. Campus visit/current students/current faculty. I either get a good feeling or a bad feeling and go with my gut. Could I see myself here for 4 years? I didn't apply to any super-prestigious programs, so I do have the luxury of multiple offers. I'll make my final decision after all the (paid, thankfully) campus visits, but right now I'm leaning very hard towards U of Louisville. The students have reached out to me, the faculty has been SO nice, the funding is as good as it gets, and I think I'd be a good fit. I can't compare that to the "top" programs, since I didn't apply to any of them, but it's a school with a good reputation, great placement rate, and happy students/grads. That's just me! Hope it helps!

Ditto Wordslinger. I took 4 years "off" because I didn't get in ANYWHERE my first round of PhD apps. In my 4 years "off," I taught one year of high school (which I personally did NOT enjoy but learned a great deal!), and went to law school. I figured, worst case scenario, I could be a lawyer. I didn't much like law school, but I did really well, so it overcame the objections that my MA grades (3.9) were a fluke compared to my undergrad grades (2.7..YEAH). Plus, at least in Rhet/Comp, a law degree is an asset, so my time/$ commitment to law school (I also got a TON of publishing opportunities in law school) wasn't a waste after all. While I wouldn't suggest doing the law route to someone who doesn't have any interest in anything legal AND doesn't want to incur a tremendous amount of debt, I do think spending a year or more out experiencing the world--teaching, working, traveling, whatever--VERY OFTEN makes the difference between a so-so application and a successful one. Besides, if you can afford to take a year off, you'd be crazy to pass that up! Take some time, evaluate what you really want, then reapply. That's JMO.

Agreed. If you're a "perfect fit" other than some pesky numbers....someone on the committee will see that and pull for you. Sometimes your numbers are about as indicative of your prospects for success as your shoe size is of your worthiness as a human being.

I think South Carolina has too, but I have heard anything on my app. My recommenders (I went for overkill expecting this to happen) were all on the late-ish side, but I think South Carolina only required 2. I'd really like to work with some of the people there, but the stipend is really low. You aimed a bit higher than I did in the rest of your apps, so you'll probably have plenty of options "Pending." Pending what?

I definitely back up Coyabean's admonition of the 'burbs. They may appear "close" on Craigslist, but Greensboro is REALLY spread out, so going more than one zip code away from campus is usually adding 30 minutes to your commute. There are a lot of new student housing (if you have no pets, kids, or issues living with undergrads) that looks pretty nice. There are more hippie-ish Victorians around UNCG that are decently priced BUT most of them don't allow kids or pets and don't have W/C connections. There's a real problem with parking around the UNCG area and the adjacent neighborhoods, so if you want to live close, you might need a bike. A number of the "renovated" buildings downtown (the ones near the law school) are the subject of homeowners' association lawsuits...so...can't name names, but do your homework so that you don't end up in one of those! I have friends who commute from Chapel Hill daily. If you don't have class 5 days a week, I'd opt to live there and commute----MUCH better graduate scene and social events. Greensboro isn't really a grad student's dream town, but it's tolerable for a finite period of time.

I think the applicant pools are a little smaller this year-from what I've been told by admissions people anyway. My first choice school took me right away (literally, the day after I faxed in the missing part of my app!) but ....nothing but crickets from several of the other schools. Then again, I don't think admissions committees are as anxious to let us know as we are to find out!

Ignore the bitter troll and go for your dream. Have a backup plan in case you have to go to Round Two. Then send the bitter troll a sarcastic thank-you note when you get your degree My high school English teacher always wrote on my report cards that I was the laziest student she'd ever had in an AP class. "You'd be lucky to get INTO college." It took me more than a decade, but the satisfaction of sending her a "note" on law firm letterhead saying that not only had I gotten 2 master's and a law degree BUT ALSO that I got into my first choice PhD program was SOOOOOOO worth the work! The really negative people want everyone else to be miserable too.

CONSULTING!!! After law school/legal practice, I've seen that there's a HUGE need for integrating and improving legal software. And lawyers can generally afford to pay you pretty well

All the sitting has flattened by butt into a pancake! (Three years of law school didn't help...) I gained 20 lbs between Halloween and New Year's!!!!!!! (And I was SKINNY! UGH!!!) I'm hoping once I'm esconced in my program, I'll lay off the sauce and get off my bum again!

Where are good places to live in walking/short commute to U of L? Decent cost of living? Fun stuff to do? Any avoidance suggestions?

Coming from NYC to Greensboro? Oh, you'll save a TON! Housing isn't quite as cheap (new law school and UNCG expansion have jacked up downtown housing costs), but you can find something reasonable outside of downtown. Aside from housing, the cost of living is reasonable EXCEPT for Guilford County taxes, which are among the highest in the state. I'd advise registering your vehicle elsewhere if you have one. If not...get one, because there aren't grocery stores within walking distance of UNCG and the bus system SUCKS. Food: totally non-descript. Undercurrent is one of the better restaurants, but most are chains. Very suburban. Social life: Europa (wine bar) is pretty popular, most of the clubs are skanky and have come and gone. I'd say social life=driving an hour to Raleigh.

Could those who applied to and were accepted or rejected by Rhet/Comp programs this year post the timeframes for decisions? Thanks!

I got a 6. I don't think it's indicative of much at all. Your statement of purpose and writing sample are what matters. I'd honestly say-from what I've heard-GRE scores in general are more of a tie-breaker between otherwise equally qualified candidates AND a "do you meet the minimum criteria" thing than anything else. But that's just me.

Some schools have separate PhD programs - English Lit and English Rhet/Comp. My BA and MA were in Lit, but given the tight job market, I applied only to Rhet/Comp this time around. I also went to law school, though, so I'm pretty out of touch with what's really current in academia! I do know that Rhet/Comp programs tend to have higher placement rates generally.

I heard from two schools several days after administrative people called to request missing items (oops). I guess if you mess up your application but they're still interested they'll contact you. I also heard from another school shortly after applying (which was weird), so I guess that school was pretty desperate. The other three I'm waiting on and have heard NOTHING, although some other posters have gotten accepted to one of them. I wouldn't "worry" until the end of March, and if you didn't apply early for funding (if that was an option), you probably won't hear anything until May or June.

I'm too lazy to type the schools (esp since I haven't heard back from 3...) but I did get into my first choice, fully funded. I'm doing Rhet/Comp focusing on language crimes/rhetorical concepts of legality and of course Comp pedagogy. I may change my mind though, since I'm getting pretty sick of the law!

My experience was similar to the above post (sorry, there's no way I can't mangle your name, but it's lovely!) But I have a slightly different set of stories, if you're interested. One of them (the first) is my own, the others are my sister and my MA thesis adviser, who is now a department head 1. I went to a semi-anonymous state school, failed out, went to three community colleges, and finally got a B.A. in English from a mediocre state school. I then went into pharmaceutical sales (yes, it is that awful) for two years before getting a M.A. from my undergrad institution. I actually LIKED my M.A. program, so I did really well (3.97), but I BOMBED the GRE Lit (sub 50th percentile), did a horrible and unsupervised job of applying exclusively to PhD programs in places I wanted to live (not realizing that STATE schools have to give priority to their own students) and got in NOWHERE. So I taught for a year at a Title I high school, hated it so much that I would do ANYTHING to just get out of (podunk medium sized southern town). So, on a whim and without studying, I hurriedly applied to take the LSAT and sent in recycled rec letters in the hope that I could get in somewhere. Well....turns out I have a knack for the LSAT (178), so my "please someone, just take me" situation changed a bit. I ended up getting into all of the law schools I applied to but went to the one that offered me the most funding. I hated law school, but I figured that-worst case scenario-I could either use the degree to get SOME sort of teaching job in a community college, go into research or consulting, or (really worst case scenario) employ myself. Of course, in my last year of law school, the job market CRASHED, offers were rescinded, the law review was practically suicidal...but my middling grades (3.4) and work experience (same firm all through school-not just summers) got me an offer from the DOJ and from the firm I worked for. Problem: I didn't want to be a lawyer. Prior to getting job offers-I suspected I might not get any-I applied to PhD programs. I worked really hard on my personal statements to show how my detour through law school made me a better candidate and how it opened a lot of doors in terms of what I would be qualified to teach. I applied to 6 schools and have heard back from 3 - all 3 offered full funding and their top TA-ships. (Since my first choice accepted me, I don't really care about the other 3.) I asked what made me a competitive candidate (never hurts to ask) and ALL of the program directors said that it was because I had a law degree, extensive research and publications in the legal field, and that I could teach in more than one department. So, to those who say "law school isn't the answer," it may not be the ANSWER, but it can be a PATH. My advice to those who do law school in hopes of transitioning would be to go to a school that will at least partially fund you. Unless you stay in the law, where you go doesn't matter (I went to a decent private school in the south), so keep the loans DOWN. 2. My sister (who had high undergrad grades from an Ivy) randomly moved across the country, couldn't find a job, went to rehab....anyway, after a year or so of working at a mental health non-profit, she decided she wanted to get a PhD/MD in Cognitive Neuroscience (Psychology). Problem: She had never had a psychology class. Not ever! She was an English major. So she started taking non-degree seeking classes at the local (luckily, flagship) university, worked really hard, got a research assistantship, charmed the hell out of the department head, and applied the next year for the PhD/MD program. She went to a two-day "finalist interview," thought there was no way she could compete, but ended up getting in, fully funded with a year-round RA position. Fully funded for SEVEN YEARS! Had she not shown up and paid for classes that wouldn't count towards anything (but allowed her to show how smart she is and how badly she wanted into the program), she would not have had a chance in heeeeellll. But...sometimes showing how badly you want it and that you'll do anything ethical to get it works! I think that she had worked (for free, initially) for one of the professors and got to know the rest did it for her. A name with a face and a work ethic tend to trump perfect but basically anonymous apps. 3. My thesis adviser didn't get into a PhD program after his MA. His wife was in law school, so he took non-degree classes at the attendant university for a year and reapplied to PhD programs. He only got into one-the one at which he took non-degree classes-but, as he's said to me many times, ALL YOU NEED IS ONE if it's what you really want. So, my long-winded point is, there are sometimes ways to get in other than just applying year after year. If you know why you weren't "a top candidate," then work on that. If your outcome goals are super-fuzzy, refine them. If you're dead-set on a top school, maybe consider some other options. Try getting another MA (or JD or whatever) in a field that would mesh well with your existing degrees and make you more marketable when the PhD is said and done. (That was another comment I got-JD=marketability later on..) But don't give up if it's what you really want, because you CAN make it happen. It just might take a little longer or require a little more creativity