snickus

I agree with the others that schools could find out, so it's best to be honest about it. I wanted to address your concern that it undermines the rest of your application. I don't think that's the case at all. Through that experience, you learned more about your true interests and where you want to be professionally/academically. If anything, your success in Silicon Valley afterward confirms that STEM is where you belong. They're professionals and know how important fit is. They'll understand that your law school gpa reflects a poor fit not a lack of general ability or indication that you'll perform poorly in their program. Of course, I don't know for sure if they'll take this perspective, but I'd be really surprised if highly intelligent professionals didn't understand this. I also attended a top law school years back. I completed just one semester, left in the middle of the second. I didn't do poorly, but my grades in the substantive classes weren't spectacular. I understand that it's annoying to have a GPA that doesn't really reflect your potential. In my case, I didn't study for finals, not at all, which I know you understand is pretty much unheard of! So it's frustrating to know they're seeing a GPA that doesn't even accurately represent my aptitude for law, just my attitude towards it (total misery lol). I'm not stressing it though because I plan to discuss how that experience taught me that it's the cognitive elements of study in the humanities that engage me and are essential for me. Our situations are a bit different, but similar enough that I get your concern. Really though, unless they're looking for doctoral students to double as law students I don't think that will undermine your strong record elsewhere. It'll just confirm that you didn't belong there, and you've been in the field that's right for you since then.

Thanks @TakeruK ! Great advice about choosing the writer based on the program. In my own case, I believe the first 3 I chose are best as a unit across the board. Your final comment gave me a relieved laugh because that's how I framed the news to the 4th professor! We have a good relationship, so I'm not too worried that she'll be insulted. I only had one class with her, while I had multiple with the others. So I think that detail alone will help her see my reasoning.

Thanks @jrockford27 and @Eigen! I asked the 3 professors who I believed could best speak to my work. In less than an hour, two quickly responded that they'd be happy to write the letter. After a week, I never heard back from the 3rd professor. So I took that as a polite "not interested" and this morning asked another, who immediately emailed back that she'd be delighted to write it. Then less than an hour later, the missing 3rd professor emailed me and stated that writing a letter for me would be his pleasure. It's an awkward situation to be in! I'll just need to explain what happened to the professor I contacted fourth. I absolutely don't want her brainstorming for a letter that she'll never be requested to upload. Thanks again!

Programs appear to universally request three. Does anyone know (1) if submitting four is frowned upon and (2) if the application platform generally even allows it?

@Warelin - Thank you so much, I'll check out those programs you named! You're good at this: I was indeed attracted to Berkeley's program! I quickly wrote them off as a pipe dream though. It's hard for me to shake the idea that top English programs won't even consider me because I didn't attend a prestigious undergrad. Won't I just be throwing away my money on the application? I've gotten it into my head that top programs care most about: undergrad prestige and letters of rec, then writing sample--statement of purpose--GPA...and then waaay at the bottom, GRE. I've been thinking that programs outside of, say, the top 20 in US News, care less about undergrad prestige so value the other factors more, meaning they'll give me more of a chance (even though it's still a tiny chance!). Why must I love a field with infinitesimal odds? Thanks again for your response and suggested programs. I'm off work tomorrow and can't wait to research them then. @renea - I see the wisdom in your advice. It would be more rational for me not to spend any more time studying math...Yet it feels hard to stop! Scared, I guess, and trying to create a guarantee where it feels like I have the most control. Thank you! I'll keep the math study to a minimum so that I can focus on the more important factors.

Thanks, @Dogfish Head and @Warelin! Anyone know if funding is typically the same for students in the MA program as in the PhD program? The web site says: The Department funds all of the MA and PhD students it admits. We expect that students admitted to the MA will go on to the PhD, so students in the MA-PhD program have six years of funding for seminars and dissertation research. http://english.la.psu.edu/graduate/funding-and-support Since "funds all" doesn't necessarily mean funds all at the same level, I'm a little concerned. It sounds like the funding is the same for both programs, but my financial worry wart self would appreciate if anyone in the know can confirm that.

That's reassuring!

Wow, I had no idea about that tendency. Does anyone know Penn State's reasoning for this?

Hi, I'll be applying soon to doctoral programs in Composition and Rhetoric. I actually posted for the first time a few months ago with the plan to apply to lit programs. Someone mentioned looking into C&R. In time I did, and I decided that's a better fit for my academic interests and background. So thanks already for the helpful advice! I just took the practice timed GRE that ETS offers. I scored 169(V) and 151(Q). I know my Q is on the low side, but to be honest I was pleased it wasn't worse! I'm in my 30s and haven't studied math in about 15 years. I'm beyond rusty. As far as V goes, years back I scored similarly on the SATs and LSAT, so I think that's an accurate score for me, give or take. I'm studying right now for the math section, but I'm scheduled to take the GRE in exactly two weeks and realistically I'm not expecting much of an improvement there. I'm just hoping I don't do worse on the real deal. My question is for those who know about C&R admissions...Do you think my low Q score will hurt me? Would Q be a decisive factor when choosing between me and someone with similar stats, or is it pretty much V and other aspects of the application that drive their decision? Thanks in advance for your insights.

Ah, these are helpful steps, thank you, FeetInTheSky! I appreciate the heads up regarding the math part. I definitely need a refresher there (it's sad how I've forgotten it all), but it's a relief to know that I don't need to aim for a high score. Thank you!

Thanks, Exponential Decay. I learned a lot from your post. When you say most programs are fully funded, does that mean that so long as I'm accepted I can expect to be offered full-tuition and a stipend? I may not be using the correct terminology. You make a strong point about people in my position not knowing the grad school discourse. It certainly is a tougher road when walking it without guidance. I'm relieved to have found this forum. I've learned so much about the process since I started reading posts here last night. Yeah, I definitely need to define my research interest in a way that English PhD programs expect it to be defined. Is an epistemological lens on 19th and 20th century American Literature too broad? In particular, I'm interested in applying Kant's revelation of the mind as the active constructor of experience (and, therefore, reality) to American literature written during that time period. The writing sample I submit will provide them with an example of the type of work I have in mind.

I read some of the threads here. I see now that my question is possibly unanswerable! I see how different the process is from that of law school. So much depends on identifying my areas of interest, finding a school that's strong in that, and tailoring my application portfolio around that. Can anyone advise of English PhD programs that are interdisciplinary? In particular, I'm looking to take some philosophy courses within my program. My particular philosophical interest is epistemology, and that's my favorite lens to use when analyzing literature. I didn't quite realize how obsessed I was with that during undergrad. It's only now when I reread my work that I see how that's what the majority of my literature papers were about. The English PhD program at my local university, UB, touts its interdisciplinary nature. That's one of the main reasons I want to apply there.

I'm brand new to this process and so grateful to be finding this thread right now. Thank you both for sharing your knowledge.

Hello! So, here's my story. I graduated high school in Florida. They have a generous scholarship program where if you get a certain SAT score and GPA, you get a full-tuition scholarship to any public FL college. I stayed local and attended a public FL college with a direction in its name. It wasn't until the end of my junior year that I learned I probably should've gone to a "better name" school. That's when I learned from professors and other students that it would be highly unlikely for any of us to get into a top graduate humanities program from my undergrad due to our lack of prestige. I should've persevered and gone that route anyway, since my heart was fully in my majors: English and philosophy. Fear of not getting into a good grad school and then not getting a job at the end of my PhD won out though. I gave up on that dream, despite it being the best fit for me. At that same time, I'd heard that law schools didn't care about undergrad prestige much, since they so strongly weighed the LSAT. So I took that, scored in the 99th percentile, and decided to go that route even though I had my suspicions from the start that it was the wrong fit. That was confirmed once I got there! I loathed it and became depressed. I did ok though, gpa in the middle of the class and all As in my legal writing course. This was at a top ten law school. Near the end of my second semester, I requested a leave of absence. My school was wonderful and granted it, said I could come back at any time. Not long after that, my mom was diagnosed with ALS. I was her primary caregiver for a few years until she passed away. At that point, I decided life was too short to do something I disliked. So I decided not to return to law school. I instead got my master's in English Education, since some of my strongest interests are learning and instruction. (I discovered this during years as a tutor and professional trainer.) I now have the guts though to go all the way and get my PhD in English so that I can teach at the college level. That's what my heart most desires and always has. Teaching and publishing my own work. I was scared for so long that it wouldn't work out, but I want to at least try! I come here for advice on where you think I should apply. I only want to apply to schools where I'd have a shot at full funding. I'd appreciate a heads up on the best schools you think I'd have a shot at. By "best," I mean the schools I'm competitive for that give me the greatest chance at landing a professor job when I'm done. -- My undergrad GPA was 3.65. I was also named "The Outstanding Philosophy Graduate" for my class. -- My grad GPA is 3.96. I graduate this month. -- I haven't taken the GRE yet. I took a practice test for the English part and scored in the high 160s. I haven't even attempted the math part yet because I've forgotten everything beyond fractions, it seems. I'll definitely need to study up for that big time! -- I have work experience in tutoring (writing, LSAT) and also in business (training, management). I currently live in Buffalo, NY and will be applying to University at Buffalo's program, but I wanted to check with you guys on where else I should include. I'll be applying this fall for admission in Fall 2018. Thank you for reading!