katanianQ

(sorry to cross post, but since there was not a lot of info over in literature, I thought I'd throw this out to a wider audience) So I am very seriously considering a literature PhD program in a non english speaking European country. The school is well ranked and has an excellent rep within the country, and the faculty is excellent (coming from american ivies and the brit equivalents, have published extensively, etc). Also, I don't think it behooves me to spend 5-6 years (and $40,000) in an american program when the job prospects are so completely shit. I just don't think it's the right decision for me. (the european program would be free for me and would only take approx 3 years since it is by research.) The problem is that I am having a very difficult time locating information about how competitive this degree would be on the job market. I am NOT looking for R1 craziness or anything near that- I'd be very happy at a small liberal arts college or non flagship ok state school. Does anyone have any info about people/professors who have done this?? Thanks in advance....please help!!!!!!!

(sorry to cross post, but since there was not a lot of info over in literature, I thought I'd throw this out to a wider audience) So I am very seriously considering a literature PhD program in a non english speaking European country. The school is well ranked and has an excellent rep within the country, and the faculty is excellent (coming from american ivies and the brit equivalents, have published extensively, etc). Also, I don't think it behooves me to spend 5-6 years (and $40,000) in an american program when the job prospects are so completely shit. I just don't think it's the right decision for me. (the european program would be free for me and would only take approx 3 years since it is by research.) The problem is that I am having a very difficult time locating information about how competitive this degree would be on the job market. I am NOT looking for R1 craziness or anything near that- I'd be very happy at a small liberal arts college or non flagship ok state school. Does anyone have any info about people/professors who have done this?? Thanks in advance....

Well, the European Ph.D would be free since I have dual citizenship.. And also, it a research degree so you basically write your dissertation and then you're finished.. so 3 years instead of 6 years.. Adverbially, if you don't mind me asking, where did you hear that a european Ph.D is useless? I actually did my M.Phil in Ireland and it opened a lot of doors for me.. I got a full time assistant professorship after 1 month on the job market when I came back to the states. Now granted, I am at a small college, but as I stated before, that's all I'm after really. I'd just like to move up to a slightly bigger school. (the job thing was very fluke-y and i was very very lucky.)

I would be grateful for any opinions on this: Do you think there is a stigma in completing a Phd in Europe? The university in question is decently ranked according to a few different lists (top 200 in the world) and has an excellent department with people out of very well known ivies/equivalent in US and England (who have published a lot w reputable presses..) It's not in an english speaking country though.. It just seems a lot more attractive than slaving away for 5-6 years at a US program.. For the record, I am not looking for an R1 job or anything remotely prestegious like that.. I would be happy at a very small liberal arts college if I am lucky enough to get a job at all. I just can't justify the time, debt, and insanity.. What do you guys think?

perdican, I sent you a private message..

Any info on Greensboro, NC would be very greatly appreciated.. I'd be coming from NYC so any info about food, cost of living, social life, safe/unsafe areas would be wonderful..

Does anybody have any info about what this program is like?? Thanks...

Yeah I'm going to Borders for that little book today.. Spritely, let us know what you think!

here's a tantalizing snippet anyhow.. "A precis of any chapter might cause us to wonder whether the book has any appeal whatsoever: a toy bear and a toy pig follow their own tracks around a tree until they are told by a small boy that this is pointless, and all retire for lunch. It is clear, I think, that Pooh must address us on an essentially subliminal level- that it must achieve its effects through sly manipulations and secret implications, not through what it directly narrates. That Bunker and the others did not perceive this is, I must say, a fact that might almost lead us to question their professional competence, were we not so grateful for their pioneering work." Hilarious!

I just came across this while hiding in the library like that kid out of neverending story and think it might save my life. What say you good folk? Anybody read it?

Thanks! Might I ask, are you fluent in all of those languages or have any concerns about that? I am looking into a school in Greece, and while I speak a little and the coursework is in English, I'm a little concerned..

Hey ihog-ers, does anyone know anything about Aristotle University in Thessaloniki, Greece? Specifically the English literature dept? Any word would be greatly appreciated..

Good point, Draff. Yeah I'm into fiction so I realize that going back to the UK would probably be the best option. This is something I'd probably prefer- also due to the nature of their Ph.D programs being mostly by research..

Modern Guy, Thank you so much for your very thoughtful ideas.. I will check out the articles you suggest. My main focus is pretty contemporary- Irish, British (inc. Scottish) lit- from WWII on. It's been difficult to find enough members in a department engaging with this stuff alone- never mind with my particular approach to writing and researching. I have studied overseas though and am very open to doing a Ph.D in the UK as well. If anyone knows of any applicable UK names/places, please do shout em out!

I understand what you are saying.. I ground my work in a cultural and historical context and really don't think there is an issue with the questions that have motivated the writing of my essay(s). I got an M.Phil from a top program and have had some publications with reputable presses and know that I would not have gotten through the door there without an ability to conceive and follow through with original writing that contributes something to my field. I certainly deal with many of the issues addressed through various schools of literary theory, but much like the professor at Catholic University points out in that interview, you can delve deep into issues of gender, identity, politics, history, etc sometimes in a more honest, refreshing way by treating literature for what it is- literature. I just personally feel these theoretical approaches limiting and often times undreadable due to all of the jargon and self importance. Just my opinion though. Check out the article (link is earlier in the thread). It explains what I mean by close reading much more eloquently than I'm doing here.

thanks so much, dart, for posting that interview. I am LOVING this and it's making me feel a lot better: "The profession has, of course, been dominated by literary theory since the late 70s, though things have been turning around. We want students to know that our department is a place that studies literature as literature. Creative literature addresses every topic theory stresses

Zoberg, would you mind posting that link maybe? I'm an american but did my M.Phil overseas.. I have applied to a bunch of programs in the UK/Ireland but so far, not good... same with the american applications.. what a tough year to be doing this. Any advice for Ph.D by research programs in the UK/Europe whose deadlines have yet to pass??? thanks in advance

Adding my 2 cents.... I have an M.Phil from a UK 'ivy', 3 years as an assistant professor, one conference presentation, chapter in a book, and a book coming out in a few months.. Phi Beta Kappa, great undergrad GPA, eh GRE scores.. I don't know what else I could have done; its all greek to me. Except I freakin speak greek so I guess its all mandarin to me.

thank you so much, efhadisto poli, etc etc. please keep the reccomendations rolling in... I'm also glad to see that I'm not (totally) alone in bucking against the lit theory fever. I think a lot of it comes from the need to make something as intangible as literature a concrete 'science.' My boss, who has a fancy phd and is probably the smartest and most well read person I have ever met, thinks its all a load of bullshit and I am inclined to agree.

Hidely ho, friends, neighbors and countrymen.. So after getting my 9th or so rejection, a bit of a pattern is starting to emerge. My last rejectors(?) were kind enough to write a very personalized letter that was enthusiastic about me, my proposal, etc, but said that I would do better in a department that focuses more on close readings rather than theoretical stuff. And they encouraged me to pursue study at a place like this, then skip through a field of lavender, etc. So my question to you all out in the void is.... have any of you HEARD of a department like this? Old school? That actually has a ph.d program? If any of you have any experience with a place like this or has heard of one, please tell me so I can start barking up the right tree.

yeah thats what my grandma says. I'm all like, yeh nana, I'm sure oxford will be beating my door down after being rejected from way shittier schools.' theres always hogwarts.

also, keep in mind that while less teaching requirements will be good while doing the phd, you might be a more attractive candidate for a job with all of that extra experience.. just something to consider..

md, i like your quote!

well i'm more or less 0-7 right now.. only a few schools left and am finding it hard to be optimistic. but i have promised myself that if i get rejected across the board, i will spend 2 months in greece while deciding what the hell to do with the rest of my life. i figure that'll cushion the blow somewhat.

there is a very interesting old thread I found on metafilter and was wondering if any of you guys have read through the experiences talked about here.. would love to get a similar discussion going. http://www.metafilter.com/53284/Should-I-teach-English from my experience doing a masters, I completely relate to what the people on here are saying..