Why attend a mid-tier program?

[Guest]

Hello all,

I've been admitted to a handful of programs, including one t-10 school and a few other t-30 schools. My first instinct is to automatically accept the t-10 offer, but I'm trying to find reasons to consider the other programs.

Here is my main issue: Pursuing a political science PhD often means poverty wages and frequent mental health issues, but more importantly, enormous opportunity costs and a miserable job market. It seems that some of these issues can be mitigated by attending top ranked institutions, but outside of the top programs, you are really setting yourself up for outsized challenges.

My question to anyone choosing to attend a non-top ranked institution: Why? What makes you think it will be worth it? Inspire me to consider t-30 schools!

[wrongpathos]

If the higher ranked institution hasn't shown you any red flags then it's simple, attend it. Otherwise, consider that it's five years and a happy environment at a lower ranked school might make that time (given the constraints/stressors you outline) a much better experience.

[schuaust]

The work is going to be hard, and the lifestyle taxing, no matter where you go. Don't add the anxiety of post-graduation job prospects unless you have a really, really good reason for doing so (such as, you know that students of a particular professor from a department place well, and they would lead your dissertation committee). 

[devotee]

Is mid-tier defined as below the elite? Like outside the top 10? What is the general definition here? Are not there any good-but-not-elite schools between the mid-tier and the elite?

Anyways, if the chances for decent jobs for the schools outside outside the top 10 were as grim as you point them out to be, I do not think we would be seeing this much of a competition for them. I do not think everyone applies to schools outside the top 10 just for safety.

[Guest]

I’m sure there is a gradient, but just for the sake of clear conversation I am referring to mid tier as anything outside of the elite. 

 

Just playing devils advocate here: Could it be that the competition for admission slots does not necessarily correlate to placement success? As in there may be fierce competition for admission to a mid tier school, but that doesn’t necessarily equate to that school having a good placement record. 

[devotee]

Obviously it may not correlate, but still, why are hundreds of people applying given the low chances of getting a placement? It is a 5 year commitment from probably the most valuable era of your life and this decision is not made by uninformed fools, it is done by a well-educated portion of the population, supposedly having the ability to research (the likelihood of getting a good placement). Are ALL of these people shooting blindly?

I think the problem with the question is that it is too general. Just top-30 vs top-10. Those things are too contingent to be classified as such, in my opinion. What if you collaborate with a  great professor in a mid-tier school that will unlock some doors for you? If you give the names of the schools, your intended area of research (some mid-tier department may be particularly strong in that subfield etc) the answer may be better concretized. It is too vague like this, I think.

Edited February 26, 2019 by devotee

[CoffeeMonster0]

It's also important to remember that the name of the school you attended is not the only factor in getting a job.  If you have good teaching abilities and a good research portfolio, you have a good shot at getting a job even if you didn't go to a top-10 school.  

[Tedmonkey]

I'm very likely accepting the offer from a T-50 school. It really isn't whether you can get a job, it is the type of placement available to you. A T-10 school would allow more of an opportunity to get placement at an R-1 research institution (especially the higher ranked ones). Whereas, a mid-tier school would be more likely to lead to placement in a lower R-1 or an R-2 school. Low ranked schools are more likely to lead to LAC placements. Of course, the biggest influence within those tiers is teaching experience/evaluations and publications. And these placement trends are primarily only the first faculty job. It is hard but possible to publish your way up, somewhat. Many mid-ranked schools, especially the higher ranked mid-tier schools, have very good placement records in mid to lower R-1 and in R-2 schools. Rank has some importance but without good fit it is unlikely someone will get a great placement due to a lack of a strong mentor.

[TheBunny]

I will be attending a school which may be around 50-60, and the pure reason is the fit. I don't think I can find a better fit than this in any of the schools in the US. Also, this school certainly places people to tenure-track positions and have an academic focus. So, there is nothing like if you don't go to T-5 school, you will be unemployed. If it was like that, only 50 people might have been doing Ph.D.s as T-5 programs accept that much in total. 

[Guest]

These are interesting perspectives. Thanks for the replies everyone!

[Larm]

I read the comments and I found them very useful. When you say "mid-tier program", are you referring to the position of the university or the position of the program?

Does anyone know how volatile are these rankings? I mean, are the us news rankings renewed EVERY year? Is it possible to access old rankings?

[Tedmonkey]

4 hours ago, Larm said:

I read the comments and I found them very useful. When you say "mid-tier program", are you referring to the position of the university or the position of the program?

Does anyone know how volatile are these rankings? I mean, are the us news rankings renewed EVERY year? Is it possible to access old rankings?

When looking at PhD programs you always use the ranking of the PhD program and not the university as a whole. US News does renew the list every year but from the years I have looked at there usually isn't any major changes unless something serious happened with a department. I believe you can find the old rankings with a simple Google search if you are interested in looking them up yourself. 

[Larm]

17 hours ago, Tedmonkey said:

When looking at PhD programs you always use the ranking of the PhD program and not the university as a whole. US News does renew the list every year but from the years I have looked at there usually isn't any major changes unless something serious happened with a department. I believe you can find the old rankings with a simple Google search if you are interested in looking them up yourself. 

Thank you. I asked that question because on the US News website (in the section "Best Political Science Schools"), at the top of the page it says "Ranked in 2017, part of Best Social Sciences and Humanities Schools". Then, I supposed that the ranking that appears could have been done using an old survey. This may not be the case when they present the rankings of the universities, since they mention that they refer to the ranking of 2019.

Edited February 27, 2019 by Larm