Applying to Psyc PhD after working in Education for 5 years

[arielskiwi]

Hi everyone,

I am looking for some feedback in regards to my next step as I am hoping to apply for Fall 2021 Social Psyc programs. To make this thread as streamlined and simple as possible, I've organized my situation in the following topics:

Basic Info

• Psychology B.S. with Honors, C/O 2015 - highlight include finished a 2-year honors program within 1 year, finished a research project (unpublished, presented 2 times in school conferences/showcases)
• Higher Education M.A., C/O 2019 - highlight include finished an independent and funded research using a psychology framework studying college students (published in 1 higher education journal, current R&R for another, presented at 3 conferences)
• Have about 5 years of research experience total: 2 year in undergrad, 2 year in grad, and currently I'm conducting an independent study as well
• Have about 5 years experiences working in higher education - highlight include presented 17 times at different regional and national conferences (but all of them were education related...), conducted assessment in different offices, and hold different chair/leadership positions in national associations (but again...mostly education related)
• Have another published journal article and 5 blog posts/non-peer-reviewed articles
• Have received both academic and professional awards from local and national organizations - But still mostly higher ed related...

Challenge 

I believe my experiences and CV are good for Education related doc program, but my research interest is more in line with cultural psychology or social psychology. Because I've already applied grad school once so I have a good idea of the LoR, SoP, and GRE I need to acquire. My biggest concern are the following

• Lack of Psych faculty connection and direct psyc research experience: because of my career path, most connections and experiences I've built are within higher education. I know I can elaborate more in my SoP about how my experiences align with psyc research, and I know I can still highlight my own research, but I do worry that I'm not competitive enough. This also means that it'd be difficult for me to get a letter of rec from a psyc faculty....since most faculty I've built a relationship with are within higher ed...
• Faculty choices: I have identified 3 faculty that has similar research with me within education related PhD, but most faculty I'm interested in working in is within psyc/social psyc with a focus on identity and culture. This is one of the reason why I want to apply for some psych porgram but also worry about my own experiences and skills.
• I've started to cold email psyc professors, so far only heard back from 1.

Question

Currently I have two options -

1) As someone who luckily have accumulated a good amount of saving prior to this pandemic, I could use this fall to do more volunteer research work by reaching out to faculty, sharpen my research skills through more quant/qual classes, and finish up my own independent study (my IRB expire in Feb 2021). My saving would allow me to sustain myself without a job for at least 4-6 month, and I can also spend more time with my family in China (yes I'm flying back home after being away for 14 years! T.T)

or

2) Work remotely and still apply this fall. I have a potential offer from a tech ed company that allows me to work remotely. But this would reduce the time I could contribute to research experiences.

I know the answer to my question is personal and largely depends on myself, but I do want to explore more and hear some feedback from the community:

1) If you were me, which option would you go for?

2) What are some tips or feedback you have for someone who is applying to Psyc PhD from a different discipline?

 

Thank you!

 

Edited July 24, 2020 by arielsorange

[IOapp2020]

I think you need to consider how comfortable you are possibly having to apply twice. I tend to have more of a "go for it" attitude and would lean toward option #2, but with less psych experience you'd be potentially limiting your opportunities and your chances of having to try applying again the next year may be higher. However, I had a similar background and taking time to get additional experience didn't necessarily help me. I too was in education initially, but dual degreed in psych and education in undergrad. Went on to teach K-12 for a while before staring a PhD program in an education program. Realized I didn't love that either and took some time before getting my master's in I/O Psychology. When applying for PhD programs last fall, I thought for sure that my "dedication" to I/O (as evidenced through my master's and additional research experience) would be enough to overcome my non-traditional background, but I applied to 6 schools and got accepted at 1. Now, having started a PhD program before could have been a turn-off, as well as already having my master's in the field (some programs don't like that), but when I was interviewing, my change in career path was a huge question from faculty. 

My biggest recommendation is if you do decide to apply, make sure you have defined research interests that help bridge the gap between higher ed and social psych and find faculty with which you could align. I think I could have articulated my research interests in more detail in my personal statement and that may have helped. I mentioned broader areas of interest, and less of "I'd like to do abc and this aligns with so-and-so's work focused on xyz." If you're able to do that in a way that bridges the gap in content areas and shows how your higher ed experience could be an asset, then that could work well for you. For instance, what about working in higher ed has sparked your interest in identity and culture? Is there some sort of gap that higher ed needs to be considering when it comes to identity and culture? How could your research fill this gap? How could you take one of the professors' interests and/or prior research studies and make it applicable to higher ed? Specificity is key. Also look into what those programs are looking for and discuss the programs' mission statements and values with those who will write you LoR so they know what skills of yours to highlight. It's best if they can take instances of you excelling in higher ed and discuss how those skills will be applicable to a social psych program, but they have to know the language the program uses and what they're looking for in potential students. Your LoR writers are probably unfamiliar with the psych world, so help them help you. When it comes to cold emailing professors, don't stress. Many professors are slow to respond over the summer and it's a shot in the dark as to if they'll answer you at all. They're bombarded right now with trying to figure out how COVID will impact their classes, so I'd say their likelihood of responding is even less than it would normally be. I got flat out rejected from the schools I reached out to and accepted and/or waitlisted to the schools I didn't reach out to, so you just never know. 

That being said, obviously no one can evaluate the importance that additional time could offer you in China (as per option 1). Strictly living off of savings scares me, but you know your financial situation and if you can handle it. Starting a program will be time intensive, so you may cherish the additional time you'd have now to spend with your family. Going back to school would mean you're back on a student's schedule however, and most schools offer generous winter breaks where you could potentially fly home. There are pros and cons to both options, but I'd probably lean toward #2. You never know until you try and if you get to March and it's not looking good, try to find summer research opportunities so you'll be ready to apply again in the fall. I personally wouldn't want to wait a whole year when you never know if you could've made it in this round. If you have enough saved up to live off of for 4-6 months, then you can probably pay for multiple rounds of applications (even though no one wants to!), especially if that means you won't be taking time off of work. Either way, definitely finish your independent study. No matter the discipline, seeing your own independent study through from start to finish and having a well-written paper can be more impressive than being third or fourth author on someone else's paper. By using your study as a way to sharpen your quant skills (ex: taking free online courses to help with your analysis, download a new stats software and learn the basics) you'll be showing initiative and determination, which could also impress faculty. 

[arielskiwi]

15 hours ago, IOapp2020 said:

I think you need to consider how comfortable you are possibly having to apply twice. I tend to have more of a "go for it" attitude and would lean toward option #2, but with less psych experience you'd be potentially limiting your opportunities and your chances of having to try applying again the next year may be higher. However, I had a similar background and taking time to get additional experience didn't necessarily help me. I too was in education initially, but dual degreed in psych and education in undergrad. Went on to teach K-12 for a while before staring a PhD program in an education program. Realized I didn't love that either and took some time before getting my master's in I/O Psychology. When applying for PhD programs last fall, I thought for sure that my "dedication" to I/O (as evidenced through my master's and additional research experience) would be enough to overcome my non-traditional background, but I applied to 6 schools and got accepted at 1. Now, having started a PhD program before could have been a turn-off, as well as already having my master's in the field (some programs don't like that), but when I was interviewing, my change in career path was a huge question from faculty. 

My biggest recommendation is if you do decide to apply, make sure you have defined research interests that help bridge the gap between higher ed and social psych and find faculty with which you could align. I think I could have articulated my research interests in more detail in my personal statement and that may have helped. I mentioned broader areas of interest, and less of "I'd like to do abc and this aligns with so-and-so's work focused on xyz." If you're able to do that in a way that bridges the gap in content areas and shows how your higher ed experience could be an asset, then that could work well for you. For instance, what about working in higher ed has sparked your interest in identity and culture? Is there some sort of gap that higher ed needs to be considering when it comes to identity and culture? How could your research fill this gap? How could you take one of the professors' interests and/or prior research studies and make it applicable to higher ed? Specificity is key. Also look into what those programs are looking for and discuss the programs' mission statements and values with those who will write you LoR so they know what skills of yours to highlight. It's best if they can take instances of you excelling in higher ed and discuss how those skills will be applicable to a social psych program, but they have to know the language the program uses and what they're looking for in potential students. Your LoR writers are probably unfamiliar with the psych world, so help them help you. When it comes to cold emailing professors, don't stress. Many professors are slow to respond over the summer and it's a shot in the dark as to if they'll answer you at all. They're bombarded right now with trying to figure out how COVID will impact their classes, so I'd say their likelihood of responding is even less than it would normally be. I got flat out rejected from the schools I reached out to and accepted and/or waitlisted to the schools I didn't reach out to, so you just never know. 

That being said, obviously no one can evaluate the importance that additional time could offer you in China (as per option 1). Strictly living off of savings scares me, but you know your financial situation and if you can handle it. Starting a program will be time intensive, so you may cherish the additional time you'd have now to spend with your family. Going back to school would mean you're back on a student's schedule however, and most schools offer generous winter breaks where you could potentially fly home. There are pros and cons to both options, but I'd probably lean toward #2. You never know until you try and if you get to March and it's not looking good, try to find summer research opportunities so you'll be ready to apply again in the fall. I personally wouldn't want to wait a whole year when you never know if you could've made it in this round. If you have enough saved up to live off of for 4-6 months, then you can probably pay for multiple rounds of applications (even though no one wants to!), especially if that means you won't be taking time off of work. Either way, definitely finish your independent study. No matter the discipline, seeing your own independent study through from start to finish and having a well-written paper can be more impressive than being third or fourth author on someone else's paper. By using your study as a way to sharpen your quant skills (ex: taking free online courses to help with your analysis, download a new stats software and learn the basics) you'll be showing initiative and determination, which could also impress faculty. 

Hi there, first of all - thank you so much for taking the time to write such extensive and insightful reply!!! Without even reading your words, the sheet length and details of your feedback is so encouraging and heartwarming, so thank you so much for being so gracious about sharing your experiences and insights. Your suggestions tips definitely helped me to reflect more about this application process. Luckily I've witnessed my best friend's PhD application cycle (twice) so she had helped realized some expectation vs. reality conversations. Either way I will do my best to carry out my study and hopefully wrap up the writing by September, and I will definitely remember your words when evaluating some of my next step decision!

❤️

[arielskiwi]

Wanted to give a quick update and bump this post  - I am applying this cycle! I got a paper acceptance and poster acceptance, which hopefully can boost my CV. I've also connected with a psychology post-doc and trying to start another research project with her. I'm going the "unconventional" way and only applying to my reach and match schools. I've mentally and financially prepared myself in case I have to apply again next year. ❤️ Would love to hear back feedback on SOP and hear any advices on career transitions~

P.s. GPA: 3.46 undergrad, 3.93 MA, GRE: V 159/Q 161

 

Edited November 3, 2020 by arielskiwi

[t_ruth]

Given your background, I'm very curious what your driving research questions are..

[arielskiwi]

1 hour ago, t_ruth said:

Given your background, I'm very curious what your driving research questions are..

Thank you for being curious haha~ my research questions revolve around bicultural integration and biculturalism. This has a lot of do with my personal experience as an immigrant and assessment experiences on students' sense of belonging in college. In short, I wanted to know 1) how do people integrate cultures and if there's a critical age for cultural integration similar to language acquisition and 2) how does biculturalism and its associated cognitive flexibility help to improve interracial dynamics/biases. I've had a lot of discussions with colleagues and professors on whether my questions can be better explored in a psych program vs education program, in which I find most of the faculties I'd like to work with resides in psyc department.